2700 with new ADSL2+

[HavellN]

Hi,

I finally had my broadband upgraded to ADSL2+ last week and all went through fine, my speed has increased slightly which is good.  I have a question though as to whether i am truly on ADSL2+, the router info looks like it is trying to go to ADSL2+ but then reverting to ADSL2:

Time	Line	Rate	Max1	Max2	Max3	Mgn1	Mgn2	Attn	Pwr	CRCs	FECs	INP	DLY	Rate	Max	Mgn	Attn	Pwr	CRCs	FECs	Mode	Vendor	State	Exit Code	Echo	VCXO	Rx Gain	INC Tones
2009/06/19 21:59:56 BST	1	0	0	0	0	0.0	0.0	61.5	0.0	0	0	0.00	0.00	0	0	0.0	35.5	0.0	0	0	G.DMT2+ Annex A	Infineon	223/93	ERR_INCONSISTENT_SIGNAL	-15.1	-6.7	34.5	34
2009/06/19 22:51:58 BST	1	1634	1997	1989	1989	6.0	5.9	59.7	16.8	2	180644	4.14	7.93	631	644	6.6	35.5	12.4	0	84	G.DMT2 Annex A	Infineon	236/104	N/A	-14.7	-6.1	34.5	0

can anyone shed any light on this, is it good or bad?

all help appreciated

thanks,
Nath

[kinmel]

The big problem for us all at the moment is that we are still in the learning curve for the 2700 with  WBC and so there are no definitive comparisons available as yet.

We agree that you have probably dropped from ADSL2+ to ADSL2


Two comments have been forwarded to me by enthusiasts from elsewhere.



The line sync speeds are somewhat low, around 2000 kbps with high line attenuation of 59 to 61db, ADSL2+ has always favoured shorter line lengths and perhaps the 61db attentuation under 2+  was too high, so the hub dropped down to ADSL2
 
There are reports reports that ADSL2 compatibility with some routers is a bit hit and miss.  ie. a particular router may work better with one make of DSLAM cards than another.

It would be a great help if you could keep us updated with any changes.

what were your stats like before the changeover to WBC, perhaps your line can be improved by making changes to your telephone cabling setup ?

[Sebby]

On LLU, I know that even on ADSL2+, the router can still connect as ADSL2 if it's going to be more stable at that time. I suspect it's the same for BT's WBC, but it's probably worth checking with IDNet.

[Arathorn]

I went live with ADSL 2+ on Tuesday and my router set up is as follows:

2700HGV Firmware version:  4.25.19 connected to an Infineon (Huawei) DSLM.

Before the switch this was a typical speed test result:

Your DSL connection rate: 8128 kbps (DOWN-STREAM), 448 kbps (UP-STREAM)
IP profile for your line is - 7150 kbps
Actual IP throughput achieved during the test was - 6695 kbps

Yesterday's result was:

Your DSL connection rate: 13795 kbps (DOWN-STREAM), 1169 kbps (UP-STREAM)
IP profile for your line is - 11000 kbps
Actual IP throughput achieved during the test was - 10231 kbps

To be honest I was expecting a profile of around 17000. Is there a training period?

Cheers

Arathorn

[kinmel]

I went live with ADSL 2+ on Tuesday and my router set up is as follows:

2700HGV Firmware version:  4.25.19 connected to an Infineon (Huawei) DSLM.

Before the switch this was a typical speed test result:



Your DSL connection rate: 8128 kbps (DOWN-STREAM), 448 kbps (UP-STREAM)
IP profile for your line is - 7150 kbps
Actual IP throughput achieved during the test was - 6695 kbps

Yesterday's result was:

Your DSL connection rate: 13795 kbps (DOWN-STREAM), 1169 kbps (UP-STREAM)
IP profile for your line is - 11000 kbps
Actual IP throughput achieved during the test was - 10231 kbps

To be honest I was expecting a profile of around 17000. Is there a training period?

Cheers

Arathorn

What is your attenuation and SNR ?

[Sebby]

Yep, we'll need to see those details. Why were you expecting 17Mb?

[Arathorn]

What is your attenuation and SNR ?

Attenuation           25.4 dB

Noise Margin            4.1 dB

Cheers

Arathorn

[kinmel]

Attenuation           25.4 dB

Noise Margin            4.1 dB

Cheers

Arathorn

With ADSL2+ your theoretical line speed should be 19097Kbps and  the maximum IP throughput (result from a speedtest) is likely to be around  16900Kbps, which is what you were expecting.

Irrespective of the training period your sync rate should be 19097Kbps, so "training" is not the cause of this problem.

[Arathorn]

With ADSL2+ your theoretical line speed should be 19097Kbps and  the maximum IP throughput (result from a speedtest) is likely to be around  16900Kbps, which is what you were expecting.

Irrespective of the training period your sync rate should be 19097Kbps, so "training" is not the cause of this problem.

Since my original post another BT speed test has produced the following:

Your DSL connection rate: 14368 kbps (DOWN-STREAM), 1172 kbps (UP-STREAM)
IP profile for your line is - 12000 kbps
Actual IP throughput achieved during the test was - 11166 kbps

My IP profile has increased by 1000 kbps. Is this training or what?

Cheers

Arathorn

[Simon]

My suggestion, for what it's worth, would be to reboot your router in the morning, and hopefully you'll get a better sync speed.  If not, come back to us, and we'll see what else we can do. 

[Lance]

There does appear to be a training period but I don't know if it is still the same at 10 days.

[Sebby]

As Alan suggests, training is somewhat irrelevant, as the service is rate-adaptive (the exception to this is when the target margin is increased, though this can happen at any time outside of the training period too). The training period is really just for BT to get an idea of what you line is capable of, and then respond to any service requests in light of this.

Simon's suggestion of re-syncing in the morning is a good idea to see if you achieve a higher sync during a quieter time in terms of noise, but losing sync in the evenings is more likely as a result.

[Arathorn]

My suggestion, for what it's worth, would be to reboot your router in the morning, and hopefully you'll get a better sync speed.  If not, come back to us, and we'll see what else we can do. 

Rebooted the router this morning as suggested and there's been no change since yesterday. Here are all the BT speed tests done since the switch over on Tuesday:

16 June 2009 (2055)

Your DSL connection rate: 13156 kbps (DOWN-STREAM), 1155 kbps (UP-STREAM)
IP profile for your line is - 7150 kbps
Actual IP throughput achieved during the test was - 1659 kbps

17 June 2009 (0640)

Your DSL connection rate: 13156 kbps (DOWN-STREAM), 1155 kbps (UP-STREAM)
IP profile for your line is - 7150 kbps
Actual IP throughput achieved during the test was - 6679 kbps

17 June 2009 (1955)

Your DSL connection rate: 13795 kbps (DOWN-STREAM), 1169 kbps (UP-STREAM)
IP profile for your line is - 11000 kbps
Actual IP throughput achieved during the test was - 10010 kbps

18 June 2009 (0655)

Your DSL connection rate: 13795 kbps (DOWN-STREAM), 1169 kbps (UP-STREAM)
IP profile for your line is - 11000 kbps
Actual IP throughput achieved during the test was - 10209 kbps

19 June 2009 (0555)

Your DSL connection rate: 13795 kbps (DOWN-STREAM), 1169 kbps (UP-STREAM)
IP profile for your line is - 11000 kbps
Actual IP throughput achieved during the test was - 10231 kbps

20 June 2009 (1850)

Your DSL connection rate: 14368 kbps (DOWN-STREAM), 1172 kbps (UP-STREAM)
IP profile for your line is - 12000 kbps
Actual IP throughput achieved during the test was - 11166 kbps

21 June 2009 (1010)

Your DSL connection rate: 14368 kbps (DOWN-STREAM), 1180 kbps (UP-STREAM)
IP profile for your line is - 12000 kbps
Actual IP throughput achieved during the test was - 11159 kbps

Before the switch over my IP profile dropped from 7150 to 6500. At the switch over it reverted to 7150 and has now crept up to 12000 even though my DSL connection rate has only increased by a much smaller amount.

Am awaiting BT's ongoing tweaking with baited breath.

Cheers

Arathorn

[Sebby]

Could you give us some details about your setup? Is your router connected to an extension socket? If so, have you removed ring wires or anything like that?

[Arathorn]

Could you give us some details about your setup? Is your router connected to an extension socket? If so, have you removed ring wires or anything like that?

Hi Sebby

My router is powered from a 6 gang Belkin Surgemaster and the broadband link is connected to  a BT extension box (I've tried connecting the router to the master box and running a long ethernet cable to my PC but it makes no difference)

I've also tried different filters with no improvement.

I'm 0.45 miles from my exchange (as the crow flies)

All in all I'm reasonably happy with my speed and could wait and see how it pans out over the next week.

Arathorn

[Sebby]

Could you remove the lower half of the master socket and connect the router to the socket behind it? Then re-post your stats.

[Arathorn]

Could you remove the lower half of the master socket and connect the router to the socket behind it? Then re-post your stats.

Hi Sebby

I have an old fashioned BT Master Socket (without the split front plate) with no socket behind it. As mentioned, I have tried connecting to this socket and there is no difference.

current stats are:

Current Rate:                14369 kbs         1181 kbs
Max Rate:                      14981 kbs       1181 kbs
Current Connection:
Current Noise Margin:       4.4 dB         6.5 dB
Current Attenuation:       25.4 dB       11.7 dB
Current Output Power:       20.7 dBm       11.4 dBm

The max rate appears to be slowly creeping up.

Cheers

Arathorn

[Sebby]

In that case, could you try removing the ring wire from every socket (the wire connected to terminal 3). It's not needed, and it's responsible for noise pickup. The problem is that even if you connect to the master socket, it's still affected by the extensions, which is where removing the ring wire usually helps.

[Arathorn]

In that case, could you try removing the ring wire from every socket (the wire connected to terminal 3). It's not needed, and it's responsible for noise pickup. The problem is that even if you connect to the master socket, it's still affected by the extensions, which is where removing the ring wire usually helps.

Hi Sebby, my sockets are the old type and apart from the tangle of wires I'm not too sure of the legality of "playing around" with BT's Master socket wiring.

For what it's worth here are my two most recent BT Speedtests followed by my latest Router stats:

28 June 2009 (2325)

Test1 comprises of Best Effort Test:  -provides background information.
Your DSL connection rate: 13832 kbps (DOWN-STREAM), 1177 kbps (UP-STREAM)
IP profile for your line is - 12000 kbps
Actual IP throughput achieved during the test was - 11164 kbps

03 July 2009 (1940)

Test1 comprises of Best Effort Test:  -provides background information.
Your DSL connection rate: 15511 kbps(DOWN-STREAM),  1176 kbps(UP-STREAM)
IP profile for your line is - 11000 kbps
Actual IP throughput achieved during the test was - 10119 kbps

03 July

DSL            Down            Up
Current Rate:       15511 kbs       1177 kbs
Max Rate:               15511 kbs       1177 kbs
Current Connection:
Current Noise Margin:     2.7 dB        6.6 dB
Current Attenuation:    25.5 dB       11.9 dB
Current Output Power:    20.9 dBm       12.0 dBm

Life is strange but not as strange as BT 

Cheers

Arathorn

[Sebby]

It looks like the noise levels are quite variable. Removing the ring wire will hopefully sort this. Have a look here.

[Arathorn]

It looks like the noise levels are quite variable. Removing the ring wire will hopefully sort this. Have a look here.

I haven't removed the ring wire as in my master box there are 2 green / white wires connected to to pin 3 rather than the orange / white ones mentioned in the link you provided so I'm playing it safe at the moment. That said, what a difference half a day makes. Here are two speed tests taken this morning and again this evening together with my current router stats: What are BT up to?

14 July 2009 (0720)

Test1 comprises of Best Effort Test:  -provides background information.
Your DSL connection rate: 15499 kbps (DOWN-STREAM), 1188 kbps (UP-STREAM)
IP profile for your line is - 11000 kbps
Actual IP throughput achieved during the test was - 10324 kbps

14 July 2009 (1935)

Test1 comprises of Best Effort Test:  -provides background information.
Your DSL connection rate: 17096 kbps (DOWN-STREAM), 1184 kbps (UP-STREAM)
IP profile for your line is - 15000 kbps
Actual IP throughput achieved during the test was - 10083 kbps

DSL                     Down         Up
Current Rate:       17096 kbs       1185 kbs
Max Rate:               17096 kbs       1185 kbs
Current Connection:
Current Noise Margin:     2.8 dB        6.5 dB
Current Attenuation:    25.8 dB       11.8 dB
Current Output Power:    16.8 dBm       11.9 dBm

Cheers

Arathorn

[Rik]

It's just the line settling, give it the 10 days before you take speed too seriously. I doubt you'll hold the higher sync speed to judge by the 2.8db margin, but we can hope. Colour is unimportant on the ringwire, it's whatever is connected to terminal 3.

[Arathorn]

It's just the line settling, give it the 10 days before you take speed too seriously. I doubt you'll hold the higher sync speed to judge by the 2.8db margin, but we can hope. Colour is unimportant on the ringwire, it's whatever is connected to terminal 3.

Thanks for the ringwire tip Rik, and you're correct about holding the higher sync speed as well. 24 hours after my last test these are the stats.

Test1 comprises of Best Effort Test:  -provides background information.
Your DSL connection rate: 14368 kbps(DOWN-STREAM),  1188 kbps(UP-STREAM)
IP profile for your line is - 12000 kbps
Actual IP throughput achieved during the test was - 7535 kbps

And the router stats are

Current Rate:         14369 kbs         1189 kbs
Max Rate:               15061 kbs       1189 kbs
Current Connection:
Current Noise Margin:        7.6 dB        6.6 dB
Current Attenuation:       25.8 dB       11.8 dB
Current Output Power:       16.7 dBm       12.4 dBm

I'll try removing the ringwire and post again tomorrow.

Cheers

Arathorn

[Sebby]

[Rik]

That looks more like the line's 'natural' level, Arathorn, but without a ringwire you may gain the speed back.