Thinkbroadband Customer Service Awards 2009

dujas · Dec 27, 2009, 15:18:47

Customer Service Awards 2009

02/BE continue to dominate for the large ISPs, unfortunately Idnet drop to third place for the niche ISPs. I guess the problems created by the delay in transitioning their 20CN customers to IP Stream Connect cost them a few percent? Customer Service Awards 2008 for comparison.

Rik · Dec 27, 2009, 15:26:06

Curious, AAISP seems to have been a bit of a curate's egg from what I've seen, so I am surprised they made number 1.

davej99 · Dec 27, 2009, 16:42:30

That is good news for IDNET. Intuitively you would say IDNET, AAISP, Zen, and NewNet are all good and the ratings show this group well ahead of the pack of niche ISPs. They are all scoring in the 80s and are all outperforming the very best of the large ISPs as well. This does not surprise me either and it says this elite group using BT Wholesale can outperform large ISPs dominated by LLU. Strangely BT Broadband cannot. You have to ask if BTW is so bad when this elite group can do so well.

Curiously the ratings do not take into account speed, which is understandable because products and distances make it impossible. However, there is a measure of speed that is important to us all because it is so frustrating. Let's call it the relative speed, or the congestion coefficient, or the throttle factor, that is to say the speed you get at peak times compared with best speed you get. It seems to me many of the big players and some niche players have a poor record in this regards. LLU, or cable deployment is no sure indicator of low congestion/throttling, but it is of low price and it might be that the economics dictates high levels of contention and throttling as a result.

Nor do the ratings take into account cost. I sugget cost is often inversely proportion to service, reliability, and relative speed. So my interpretation of the Awards is that cheap, all you can eat broadband, leaves the customer with little satisfaction and a bad case of constipation.

Rik · Dec 27, 2009, 16:47:50

Wouldn't disagree, Dave. IDNet suffered this year for the failures of BT in delivering promised services. I am confident they will, next year, make a much stronger showing.

davej99 · Dec 27, 2009, 17:06:23

All businesses have a bad patch and get let down by suppliers. What counts is dealing with it and moving on, which IDNET did very well. In spite of problems we see barely statistically significant differences between IDNET and the top spot. Small equates to being fast, efficient, aggressive, adaptive, innovative. What counts for IDNET are stronger differentiators and carefully crafted products. They will in turn bring sustainable growth.

Rik · Dec 27, 2009, 17:14:19

We like to think so.

davej99 · Dec 27, 2009, 17:21:45

Oh, and a price list customers can understand!

Rik · Dec 27, 2009, 17:28:24

That too. As I see it, this year's vote was probably affected by a handful of spoilers, plus the poor BT service. We've seen the turnaround since everything moved to the Hostlink, and that will get better as IDNet get the new tools to manage profiles. Hopefully, we can also see some more 'advantageous' tariffs in the new year.

quandam · Dec 27, 2009, 19:00:14

Have to say that DSLZone ISP ratings (It's the same for all) now place NewNet in 2nd place. Some two/three months ago they were three places below IDNet in the ratings. Today IDNet are in 8th place. Whether we like it or not Joe Public has voted and the results do not make good reading. Clearly something has upset Mr Public re IDNet and not with NewNet who offer virtually the same level of service. Sometimes the truth doth hurt

Rik · Dec 27, 2009, 19:02:07

Ah well, perhaps we have to accept that the venom matches the passion, Q.

Tacitus · Dec 27, 2009, 19:47:49

But if you analyse the DSLZone figures, the difference in the ratings is not that great.

speed support reliability price
iDNet 8.8 9.2 9.2 7.9

NewNet 8.7 9.0 9.4 8.7

So iDNet are ahead on speed and support, but below, albeit not by much on reliability, with a greater gap on price. The reliability rating no doubt reflects the problems of the last few months. The main gap seems to be on price and I suspect many are reading NewNet's offer and not realising they count up and download so it looks a bigger allowance than in fact it is. In practice for many people it will be a real improvement, since not many peeps upload all that much, so it might be worth iDNet in their next price review considering doing the same.

I never put a lot of credibility on these rating sites. You get a lot of ranters like the famous Dwayne D over on TB who sounded off about iDNet being a load of muppets and, later admitted he didn't bother to contact support to try and sort out his problems.

Rik · Dec 28, 2009, 10:12:03

To name but one...

Technical Ben · Dec 28, 2009, 12:50:56

I also think IDNet are sometimes beaten by the big players not playing fair. O2 will always win on price, but that's because they tie you into a contract (read don't have to give you a service after 30 days

) and offer it to mobile customers.
Where as IDNet offer consistent deals and good service, it's less likely to stand out as being flashy. But then IDNet don't have to come up with ridiculous offers, like Skys Free Broadband. I guess you get what you pay for. Also with a 1 month contract, they have an incentive to continually provide a good service to customers, and it shows.

Nice to know you made the top 3! Cannot wait till 20cn WBC is enabled at my exchange. Then IDNet will really shine above the rest.

Rik · Dec 28, 2009, 12:57:21

We agree, Ben.

quandam · Dec 28, 2009, 18:47:07

Quote from: Technical Ben on Dec 28, 2009, 12:50:56
I also think IDNet are sometimes beaten by the big players not playing fair. O2 will always win on price, but that's because they tie you into a contract (read don't have to give you a service after 30 days ) and offer it to mobile customers.
Where as IDNet offer consistent deals and good service, it's less likely to stand out as being flashy. But then IDNet don't have to come up with ridiculous offers, like Skys Free Broadband. I guess you get what you pay for. Also with a 1 month contract, they have an incentive to continually provide a good service to customers, and it shows.

Nice to know you made the top 3! Cannot wait till 20cn WBC is enabled at my exchange. Then IDNet will really shine above the rest.

I am not knocking IDNet for one moment as I am more than happy, however, NewNet offer a very similar product and service and have attained the 2nd position and we (IDNet), are down in 8th place. Tacitus has come up with some interesting facts but the main fact is that NewNet are in 2nd position and we are in eighth! There are five other ISP's above us and NewNet.

As stated before, something is not right, Joe Public is quite clearly not happy with what he or she is being provided with (right or wrong), we have NEVER achieved 2nd place and that should be our basic aim and not simply say 'I am not interested in these ratings' and dismiss them as irrelevant, for Joe Public does not think deeply like tacitus and simply looks at the ratings and 'goes' for the one 'shining' in the league table.

No matter what we think this table is important and should not be dismissed lightly.

Rik · Dec 28, 2009, 18:48:18

IDNet were third in these awards, Q.

Glenn · Dec 28, 2009, 18:50:56

For the vast majority of internet users, there is only 1 question, which one is cheapest, so most will not even look past Tiscali, TalkTalk etc, it is only the niche market users, that will bother looking at the stats, imo.

Tacitus · Dec 28, 2009, 19:43:05

Going by the TB awards, it is clear the levels of satisfaction and reliability with the bigger providers is much lower than that for the niche outfits. The main thing these larger providers have in common is lower prices.

The obvious conclusion is that Joe Public wants the cheapest deal and would prefer to go for that and then whine about poor service, than pay more for better quality. 'Cheap' is the main, sometimes the only, consideration. The 'niche 4' are not going to compete on price for a long time, if ever, since the levels of LLU investment required are so high and, the current LLU providers like O2 are unlikely to offer wholesale deals at prices that might undercut their retail operations.

Actually Q I didn't say league tables were irrelevant, I said that I don't give them much credibility, which is not the same. Whilst I agree that some (the majority?) punters are simply going to check who's top of the list, look at how the numbers commenting on DSLZone compare to the numbers on the TB awards. Check out the top six on DSLZone and, with the exception of NewNet, they are Enta resellers. I may be wrong but don't Enta have an 'unlimited' download policy, which may of course be entirely coincidental.

On the TB rankings they all come under Entanet, which is well down the list.

As Rik points out, iDNet came third in the TB awards which IMHO carries much more prestige than DSLZone, particularly given the reliability and satisfaction ratings.

Aaron · Dec 28, 2009, 20:54:12

Just had a peek at AAISP's pricing page. my head hurt trying to make sense of it all.

quandam · Dec 28, 2009, 20:54:53

Quote from: Tacitus on Dec 28, 2009, 19:43:05
Going by the TB awards, it is clear the levels of satisfaction and reliability with the bigger providers is much lower than that for the niche outfits. The main thing these larger providers have in common is lower prices.

The obvious conclusion is that Joe Public wants the cheapest deal and would prefer to go for that and then whine about poor service, than pay more for better quality. 'Cheap' is the main, sometimes the only, consideration. The 'niche 4' are not going to compete on price for a long time, if ever, since the levels of LLU investment required are so high and, the current LLU providers like O2 are unlikely to offer wholesale deals at prices that might undercut their retail operations.

Actually Q I didn't say league tables were irrelevant, I said that I don't give them much credibility, which is not the same. Whilst I agree that some (the majority?) punters are simply going to check who's top of the list, look at how the numbers commenting on DSLZone compare to the numbers on the TB awards. Check out the top six on DSLZone and, with the exception of NewNet, they are Enta resellers. I may be wrong but don't Enta have an 'unlimited' download policy, which may of course be entirely coincidental. On the TB rankings they all come under Entanet, which is well down the list.

As Rik points out, iDNet came third in the TB awards which IMHO carries much more prestige than DSLZone, particularly given the reliability and satisfaction ratings.

Tacitus

I was not referring to you with regard to the 'irrelevant' comment but to earlier replies to the same subject within this forum. I do agree that the TB ratings could well carry more credence but my point remains that DSL ratings should not be ignored and should at least be given some thought and taken on board.

As IDNet & NewNet are on a par my simple question is why are they in 2nd place and we are 8th? Something is not quite right

wecpcs · Dec 28, 2009, 21:22:08

Quote from: Rik on Dec 28, 2009, 18:48:18
IDNet were third in these awards, Q.

I think quandam is getting confused with the DSL ZoneUK ratings where Idnet are 8th and not the TB Awards 2009.

Colin

Tacitus · Dec 28, 2009, 21:23:40

Quote from: quandam on Dec 28, 2009, 20:54:53
As IDNet & NewNet are on a par my simple question is why are they in 2nd place and we are 8th? Something is not quite right

Because in the DSLZone methodology, a small difference in the overall rating number makes a disproportionate difference to the final position - the difference between iDNet and NewNet is around 2% (8.78 and 8.95) which in practice is negligible, but it results in a big difference in the table positions.