BT BRAS Profile

[T_M_D]

It depends on the volume, Tina. All lines have some background noise, either a hum or a hiss.

Ah, yes, I have just had a good listen to mine after ringing it and not speaking and I have been able to compare it to my friend's and it is exactly the same noise. It is slightly more noticeable on her hallway phone that it is on mine but on her bedroom phone, I would estimate the sound is probably twice as loud, though it is the same sound. I would hazard a guess that with the telephone upstairs it is to do with the nature of its installation travelling up the outside of the wall and because it is attached to that splitter. So I guess that the noise I can hear could be completely insignificant then when troubleshooting the under-par Internet download speed.

BTW -    for running with this with me and have a  Tina

[davej99]

To prove a line noise problem (hum, crackle) you need to remove the half plate on the primary socket, plug in an unpowered phone and do a quiet line test as above. When the half plate is removed all other extensions should be disconnected with it because the wires should be attached to the half plate. If any other extention give a dial tone then you have an improper installation.

If there is no socket with a split plate then you need to go looking for the primary LJU2/1A by carefully removing each plate and looking for a capacitor. This will probably be the socket nearest the drop cable or ground feed. The incoming BT cable may be terminated at an external box and thence to the master socket.

The LJU2/1A or any master socket is BT property and you may not move or reinstall it. It ought to be the starting point for all the other extentions from at least pins 2, 3 and 5. The extension that seems to come from the external box could well be just a pass though of an external extension feed from these terminals. You need to be very careful accessing a LJU2/1A primary because, unlike the NTE5 split plate, the incoming feed is not automatically disconnected and you will be responsible for any damage you cause.

BT are responsible for the external junction box, if it carries the incoming feed, and for the master socket. BT will replace a faulty or damaged juntion box or primary socket. The rest is generally the responsibility of the occupier. Work is best carried out on old LJU2/1A  primaries by BT or a professional installer for extention wiring, but this is expensive.

[T_M_D]

To prove a line noise problem (hum, crackle) you need to remove the half plate on the primary socket, plug in an unpowered phone and do a quiet line test as above. When the half plate is removed all other extensions should be disconnected with it because the wires should be attached to the half plate. If any other extention give a dial tone then you have an improper installation.

If there is no socket with a split plate then you need to go looking for the primary LJU2/1A by carefully removing each plate and looking for a capacitor. This will probably be the socket nearest the drop cable or ground feed. The incoming BT cable may be terminated at an external box and thence to the master socket.

The LJU2/1A or any master socket is BT property and you may not move or reinstall it. It ought to be the starting point for all the other extentions from at least pins 2, 3 and 5. The extension that seems to come from the external box could well be just a pass though of an external extension feed from these terminals. You need to be very careful accessing a LJU2/1A primary because, unlike the NTE5 split plate, the incoming feed is not automatically disconnected and you will be responsible for any damage you cause.

BT are responsible for the external junction box, if it carries the incoming feed, and for the master socket. BT will replace a faulty or damaged juntion box or primary socket. The rest is generally the responsibility of the occupier. Work is best carried out on old LJU2/1A  primaries by BT or a professional installer for extention wiring, but this is expensive.

Hi Dave, what do you mean by an 'unpowered phone'? I wouldn't have a clue how to move or reinstall a master socket or the LJU2/1A so I think they are safe from my interference I will look (and hope for) a split plate. Beyond that I might have to give up on it and my friend live with the slow download speed as I am nervous about unstitching sockets in case I damage any internal wiring, if I do decide to do it though, would it be obvious to me which one has the capacitor? I have looked at images of capacitors and they are quite varied in their structure.

[Rik]

Hi Tina

Dave is saying don't use a DECT phone, but one which plugs directly into the socket. A DECT phone has its own noises. Just look for a large component or two in the sockets, the normal sockets don't have any.

[T_M_D]

Hi Tina

Not necessarily, it depends on the route that her phone line takes to get to the exchange. For example, my house is about 100 yards from the exchange, as the crow flies, and yet my line is 1.5 miles long - it literally goes round the bypass and then comes back into town.
Simon

Thanks Simon - turns out she is on a completely different exchange 

[T_M_D]

Hi Tina

Dave is saying don't use a DECT phone, but one which plugs directly into the socket. A DECT phone has its own noises. Just look for a large component or two in the sockets, the normal sockets don't have any.

I see. I think they do have one plugged in the hallway socket - it connects to the socket rather than through a cradle. It is very old though and the curly cable that goes into the receiver apparently causes crackling on the phone when they are talking to anyone on it. I think it also has a built-in answering machine in it. They have recently bought a phone that also has a built-in answering machine in it, but this was causing a problem kicking in when they were on a call to someone so they have disabled it.

Before I do the testing in the master socket, is it worth unplugging everything, including the filters, attached to every socket and only leave in the filter and hub in its current BT socket, then run a BT Speed test and check the hub stats? Could I expect the stats or speed test to show whether what I have done has improved things or not, or would all phones and filters and extension leads have to remain unplugged for several days before any improvement, or not was shown in speed tests and hub stats?

[Rik]

Before I do the testing in the master socket, is it worth unplugging everything, including the filters, attached to every socket and only leave in the filter and hub in its current BT socket, then run a BT Speed test and check the hub stats? Could I expect the stats or speed test to show whether what I have done has improved things or not, or would all phones and filters and extension leads have to remain unplugged for several days before any improvement, or not was shown in speed tests and hub stats?

You need to look at the router stats both immediately before and immediately after the move to the test socket. A BT test is unlikely to reveal anything as the profile won't change instantly.

[T_M_D]

You need to look at the router stats both immediately before and immediately after the move to the test socket. A BT test is unlikely to reveal anything as the profile won't change instantly.

Hi Rik, yes I had assumed that I would need to do that, but would it show a difference in before and after results straight away?

Incidentally, I recommended IDNet to my friend, but her husband took a sales call from BT one day and signed them up for BT Broadband. I am in the process of setting up my own IT Training and Support services and I am thinking about becoming an IDNet partner - had this been the case in this instance and I had identified this problem, how far would IDNet support have been able to help me with this issue? I am assuming I would still need to do the master socket test?

[Rik]

Yes it will, Tina, those are the only figures which will give you a definitive answer.

I don't know much about the partner scheme, you'd better ask IDNet on that. My guess, and it's only a guess, is that you would be expected to provide the front line technical support, they would provide backup. Certainly, either way, the master socket (test socket where available) would have to be done to reduce the risk of a BT callout charge of £160.

[T_M_D]

Yes it will, Tina, those are the only figures which will give you a definitive answer.

I don't know much about the partner scheme, you'd better ask IDNet on that. My guess, and it's only a guess, is that you would be expected to provide the front line technical support, they would provide backup. Certainly, either way, the master socket (test socket where available) would have to be done to reduce the risk of a BT callout charge of £160.

That's good news regarding the test results, thanks. 

This is what IDNet states re: partnering:- unlimited free professional support for both you and your customers. Fast, reliable services with competitive reseller discounts make attractive packages that can not only compliment your existing products and services but also provide an easy additional revenue stream for you.

I would expect to do the frontline support myself, but it looks as if partnering with IDNet would certainly enhance the experience for me and of course, there is always this fabulous forum as well.   

[Rik]

As I said, Tina, you need to talk to them to get the nitty gritty. I've never gone in for re-selling.

[T_M_D]

As I said, Tina, you need to talk to them to get the nitty gritty. I've never gone in for re-selling.

Yes Rik, I will. Maybe I can afford to start shopping at DR once my new business gets up running!  I am now going to drag myself away from IDNet as I have so much other stuff I need to get on with. Tina.

[Rik]

I thought we were trying to deal with BT.

[T_M_D]

I thought we were trying to deal with BT.

Oh well, I am sure one is allowed to deviate occasionally 

[Rik]

And BT are definitely a bunch of deviants! 

[T_M_D]

And BT are definitely a bunch of deviants! 

I bet a few of them lurk on this site.

[Rik]

We've never caught one yet, but we do watch for them. I'd love to get a BT total care rep posting here.

[T_M_D]

We've never caught one yet, but we do watch for them. I'd love to get a BT total care rep posting here.

LoL - I bet there's at least one lurking, probably having a good snigger at people like me trying to grasp what to them is dead simple stuff 

[Rik]

That's how we learn, Tina. I started by asking questions and when I reached the point of being able to answer them, I switched roles.

[T_M_D]

That's how we learn, Tina. I started by asking questions and when I reached the point of being able to answer them, I switched roles.

I totally agree with you! I hope to contribute to the forum as time goes on and my knowledge increases. Now, online to do my lottery and shopping then a bit of Final Fantasy on the Play Station! 

[Rik]

 

Priorities, eh?

[davej99]

Hi Dave, what do you mean by an 'unpowered phone'? I wouldn't have a clue how to move or reinstall a master socket or the LJU2/1A so I think they are safe from my interference I will look (and hope for) a split plate. Beyond that I might have to give up on it and my friend live with the slow download speed as I am nervous about unstitching sockets in case I damage any internal wiring, if I do decide to do it though, would it be obvious to me which one has the capacitor? I have looked at images of capacitors and they are quite varied in their structure.

Sorry Tina I am not explaining myself well. As Rik says an unpowered phone does not have a plug into the mains. It will be a phone with a cable just for the phone socket. You are right not to tamper with wiring on a phone wall plate that is not split, but you can safely remove the two screws and look inside. The capacitor you are looking for will be about 1/3 as long as an AAA battery. It is a good idea to test with everything removed if you do not have a split plate. All stand alone answering machines, faxes, sky boxes, cordless phones etc should be removed. If you have a split plate, test in the socket behind the removeable plate, and try several filters. But do check all other sockets are dead with an unpowered phone when the plate is removed. Good luck.

[T_M_D]

Sorry Tina I am not explaining myself well. As Rik says an unpowered phone does not have a plug into the mains. It will be a phone with a cable just for the phone socket. You are right not to tamper with wiring on a phone wall plate that is not split, but you can safely remove the two screws and look inside. The capacitor you are looking for will be about 1/3 as long as an AAA battery. It is a good idea to test with everything removed if you do not have a split plate. All stand alone answering machines, faxes, sky boxes, cordless phones etc should be removed. If you have a split plate, test in the socket behind the removeable plate, and try several filters. But do check all other sockets are dead with an unpowered phone when the plate is removed. Good luck.

Ok Dave, thanks for all the info - I will let you all know how I get on, which should be Monday evening sometime 

[Tacitus]

There's a picture of one of the split faceplates (the standard BT NTE5) and the test socket here.  Scroll down about halfway and you can see how they work.  You can see the test socket on the bottom right hand side when the bottom half is removed.  It will have wires attached to it so be careful when you pull it out. 

Not sure if this is helpful but here it is anyway.   

[T_M_D]

There's a picture of one of the split faceplates (the standard BT NTE5) and the test socket here.  Scroll down about halfway and you can see how they work.  You can see the test socket on the bottom right hand side when the bottom half is removed.  It will have wires attached to it so be careful when you pull it out. 

Not sure if this is helpful but here it is anyway.   

Hey Tacitus - this is super!  Thanks. I am going to savour it tomorrow and go through it in detail, but I have already had a quick scan through. I am sure it will help me to have the confidence to look behind it.