Internet Explorer still slipping

Gary · May 05, 2010, 07:06:04

Quote "Microsoft's Internet Explorer (IE) web browser, now accounts for less than 60% of the market, down from 95% at its peak in 2003, according to new figures.

Latest statistics, from measurement firm NetApplications, show that IE has 59.9% of the market, with Firefox gaining on it, with 24.5%.

While third-place Google Chrome's 6.7% share of the market looks tiny by comparison it is rising sharply, up from just 1.7% this time last year.

A new version of IE is imminent.

Microsoft has gradually been losing market share, largely due to concerns over security, experts said"

I love the last bit, the BBC loves to quote the obvious, El Reg is also carrying the story http://www.theregister.co.uk/2010/05/04/internet_explorer_market_share_decline/

Den · May 05, 2010, 07:32:27

IE8 is still the best browser in the market and far superier than all the rest unless you are a Microsoft hater. I think the rise in other browsers is purely the fact that Microsoft were forced to offer alternatives. I wonder how the Apple Mac fans would feel if Apple were forced to let their operating system be used on other machines and how it would effect sales of Macs.

DorsetBoy · May 05, 2010, 07:49:17

Quote from: Den on May 05, 2010, 07:32:27
IE8 is still the best browser in the market and far superier than all the rest unless you are a Microsoft hater. I think the rise in other browsers is purely the fact that Microsoft were forced to offer alternatives. I wonder how the Apple Mac fans would feel if Apple were forced to let their operating system be used on other machines and how it would effect sales of Macs.

This will be the browser with 5 current serious security holes then? And since when was Internet Explorer an operating system?

IE8 : 5 security holes.

Apple Safari : 1 hole.

Firefox : zero holes.

Opera : zero holes.

Gary · May 05, 2010, 08:04:51

Quote from: Den on May 05, 2010, 07:32:27
IE8 is still the best browser in the market and far superier than all the rest unless you are a Microsoft hater. I think the rise in other browsers is purely the fact that Microsoft were forced to offer alternatives. I wonder how the Apple Mac fans would feel if Apple were forced to let their operating system be used on other machines and how it would effect sales of Macs.

Den that would not change a thing. Also Microsoft are not forced to do anything, that's there business model so your comment about Apple does not make any sense, anyway Safari is available for Windows, so what's your point? El reg and the BBC are only pointing out the trends, and without those other browsers you may have been still stuck with IE6, and just because I posted the info, it did not make it an attack because I have a Mac or some dumb war about OS's yet again, anyway I use FF. Calm down dear

Gary · May 05, 2010, 08:19:36

Quote from: DorsetBoy on May 05, 2010, 07:49:17

This will be the browser with 5 current serious security holes then? And since when was Internet Explorer an operating system?

IE8 : 5 security holes.

Apple Safari : 1 hole.

Firefox : zero holes.

Opera : zero holes.

The Safari security hole was fixed about a week ago I believe in an Apple security update, 4.05 has at this time no security holes Dorset I know of on the OSX platform or Windows, well none that are public anyway

but that's the thing there are always holes, but not public ones as of yet.

DorsetBoy · May 05, 2010, 08:30:11

Quote from: Gary on May 05, 2010, 08:19:36
The Safari security hole was fixed about a week ago I believe in an Apple security update, 4.05 has at this time no security holes Dorset I know of on the OSX platform or Windows, well none that are public anyway but that's the thing there are always holes, but not public ones as of yet.

Not according to Secunia http://secunia.com/advisories/product/25519

Rik · May 05, 2010, 08:43:10

What will be interesting to see is whether the non-MS browser market continues to grow, or whether it's now reached a plateau and the movement will be between alternative browsers from those who already use a non-MS product.

Gary · May 05, 2010, 08:58:34

Quote from: DorsetBoy on May 05, 2010, 08:30:11
Not according to Secunia http://secunia.com/advisories/product/25519

Nope your right, didn't see that one

Gary · May 05, 2010, 08:59:12

Quote from: Rik on May 05, 2010, 08:43:10
What will be interesting to see is whether the non-MS browser market continues to grow, or whether it's now reached a plateau and the movement will be between alternative browsers from those who already use a non-MS product.

I think Chrome will be doing a lot of the advancing, Rik.

Rik · May 05, 2010, 09:00:15

Google.

Gary · May 05, 2010, 09:02:24

Quote from: Rik on May 05, 2010, 09:00:15
Google.

I know, and yes I use Gmail,

still a great spam filter for non personal mail, but Google when there OS comes out might make MS and the rest run for the hills if they are not careful, look at how well Android is doing for smartphones

Rik · May 05, 2010, 09:11:31

I just couldn't bring myself to use it unless I had no choice.

Gary · May 05, 2010, 09:14:43

Quote from: Rik on May 05, 2010, 09:11:31
I just couldn't bring myself to use it unless I had no choice.

I agree, but choice is running out, just look at tomorrow

Rik · May 05, 2010, 09:18:35

Must I?

Gary · May 05, 2010, 09:26:19

Quote from: Rik on May 05, 2010, 09:18:35
Must I?

Well if we had RON lite to vote for........

Rik · May 05, 2010, 09:28:22

That would make me much happier...

Den · May 05, 2010, 11:20:08

I was not trying to start a operating system row, I was just pointing out that Apple restrict the manufacturers from producing a Mac compatable machine and if that was Microsoft then we would all be up in arms.
My comment on IE8 was based on IMO it is now the nicest and best browser in the market and I make that statement after trying most if not all the others and not by reading reports in the computer press. I think it's by far the best IE that Microsoft have brought out and think they have got it right this time.

Rik · May 05, 2010, 11:21:48

Each to his own, Den, it's like religion and politics, we're all convinced we're right based on our personal preferences.

Simon · May 05, 2010, 11:41:54

Very true.

Technical Ben · May 05, 2010, 11:49:05

I think it's more to do with the fact no one bothered to write another browser. Once Fire fox etc were written for Windows, the death knell was sounded. If the same happened for Apple (which it is on the Mac, and Iphone currently) then people have more choice. More people will choose another browser. Will it be leading the market? Well, probably not, but at least if gives people options to suit their needs. It also encourages competition and gives a reason to better your product. (See BT monopoly for a counter example!!!)

Perhaps the difference with Apple and MS is that Apple have a much stronger footing in their browser to begin with. MS had massive security holes, compatibility problems, speed problems and bloatware. So an easy target to better. Apple have quiet a tightly run and fast browser already, so less reason to change.

Rik · May 05, 2010, 12:00:12

Much of the problem with MS browsers, Ben, is that MS have been trying to define the web standards, despite a set of standards already being well defined.

zappaDPJ · May 05, 2010, 16:17:34

When I saw the statistics yesterday coupled with the headline of 'Microsoft Losing Browser Wars' it did make me wonder. A win is a win in my book and Microsoft have more IE installations than all the other browser vendors put together. The 60% is the give-away.

As to which browser is best, I would have thought the best browser is the one that suits you most. Currently for me it's Firefox purely because of the plug-in system and the fact that it renders according to web standards. Prior to that I used IE and I'll probably use it again. There's no point in having allegiance to a particular vendor, it's far better to use whatever suits you and switch if something more suitable comes along.

Rik · May 05, 2010, 16:22:26

I agree with you, Zap. It's pointless arguing with people about browsers, we each have made our choices depending on either what suits us best or the comfort of the inbuilt MS offering.

Gary · May 05, 2010, 18:42:44

Quote from: Technical Ben on May 05, 2010, 11:49:05
I think it's more to do with the fact no one bothered to write another browser. Once Fire fox etc were written for Windows, the death knell was sounded. If the same happened for Apple (which it is on the Mac, and Iphone currently) then people have more choice. More people will choose another browser. Will it be leading the market? Well, probably not, but at least if gives people options to suit their needs. It also encourages competition and gives a reason to better your product. (See BT monopoly for a counter example!!!)

Perhaps the difference with Apple and MS is that Apple have a much stronger footing in their browser to begin with. MS had massive security holes, compatibility problems, speed problems and bloatware. So an easy target to better. Apple have quiet a tightly run and fast browser already, so less reason to change.

Im a bit confused, you can run Opera, Chrome and FF on the mac

Inkblot · May 05, 2010, 19:35:03

I happened to use my wife's computer a couple of days ago - she is not the most tech-savvy person in the world but was using Chrome instead of IE, when I asked her why she didn't even know she had changed. She had realised that it looked different but had no idea of how she had managed to install Chrome.

As mentioned in these forums before, Apple like you to use Safari if you are an iTunes user and at one point installed it as a 'recommended update' although I don't suppose they still do that but in both case it's extra installations for them and maybe some of the people either don't know, don't care or don't want to change back to IE so it's no great surprise that IE has slipped to below 60% - many of us will remember when it was Netscape with over 90% and IE3 was the new kid on the block with single digits!

Rik · May 05, 2010, 19:36:37

Netscape, I loved that browser.

Steve · May 05, 2010, 19:45:32

I've just used it for this post,support ended in 2008

Rik · May 05, 2010, 19:47:11

Well done that man.

Steve · May 05, 2010, 19:50:59

They're all archived if you wish to try again

Gary · May 05, 2010, 23:18:26

Quote from: Inkblot on May 05, 2010, 19:35:03
I happened to use my wife's computer a couple of days ago - she is not the most tech-savvy person in the world but was using Chrome instead of IE, when I asked her why she didn't even know she had changed. She had realised that it looked different but had no idea of how she had managed to install Chrome.

As mentioned in these forums before, Apple like you to use Safari if you are an iTunes user and at one point installed it as a 'recommended update' although I don't suppose they still do that but in both case it's extra installations for them and maybe some of the people either don't know, don't care or don't want to change back to IE so it's no great surprise that IE has slipped to below 60% - many of us will remember when it was Netscape with over 90% and IE3 was the new kid on the block with single digits!

People who install browsers etc with out knowing why worry me, no offence meant, my own wife has done it, but it shows they don't read what's in the box, like with Safari, you just untick it, saying that it should be opt in not opt out, but there has been a move more so in Europe to FF and Chrome as a deliberate trend. I say each to their own, there is no wrong or write answer as long as you are happy with what you have, who really cares, its an OS, a phone, a browser it isn't hurting anyone.

Inkblot · May 06, 2010, 07:15:01

They worry me too! How can anybody manage to change from one browser to another without knowing how they did it and in the case of my wife without even realising it was a different browser

The point is though that there are many people out there who may have done similar - some of them are the same people who have 14 different toolbars installed with the browser display area being less than 1/2 the screen high! Having said that, most if not all of us here have some degree of tech ability and are unlikey to get caught like that. On the other hand I know that if I went to look at a 2nd hand car by myself I would most likely end up with a ringer whereas others who aren't as tech savvy will spot the head gasket has blown and the shock absorbers are worn - that's why whenever I go to buy a car (Always buy used cars, never been able to afford a new one!) I always take a mechanic friend along. Thankfully browser choice is simpler and doesn't require a techy friend - it's not going to crash and burn on you....well, not in the same way a car might!

Gary · May 06, 2010, 07:24:57

Quote from: Inkblot on May 06, 2010, 07:15:01
They worry me too! How can anybody manage to change from one browser to another without knowing how they did it and in the case of my wife without even realising it was a different browser The point is though that there are many people out there who may have done similar - some of them are the same people who have 14 different toolbars installed with the browser display area being less than 1/2 the screen high! Having said that, most if not all of us here have some degree of tech ability and are unlikey to get caught like that. On the other hand I know that if I went to look at a 2nd hand car by myself I would most likely end up with a ringer whereas others who aren't as tech savvy will spot the head gasket has blown and the shock absorbers are worn - that's why whenever I go to buy a car (Always buy used cars, never been able to afford a new one!) I always take a mechanic friend along. Thankfully browser choice is simpler and doesn't require a techy friend - it's not going to crash and burn on you....well, not in the same way a car might!

I used to work on cars so that was al right, I know the tricks of the trade when buying, our last two cars hav been new but even then thats no guarantee of trouble free motoring, saying that the second has been a little beauty. Back to browsers, I installed Opera a few times I just never got on with it, or it crashed at some point, or I had to disguise it as another browser, tbh far to much work. That's like giving your browser a service on each outing. As for toolbars, don't get me started, hate the damn things never use them.

Rik · May 06, 2010, 08:20:29

Quote from: Steve on May 05, 2010, 19:50:59
They're all archived if you wish to try again

I think I have a set of floppies still, Steve.

Technical Ben · May 06, 2010, 10:19:34

AFAIK, and with a little google, FF and opera have mac flavours, so mainly yes. Don't think chrome has yet.
My mother also tends to just click things on the pc without looking at what it says. When I hid all the task bars (never got around to uninstalling) I was greeted with a "what have you done to my PC!". She did not even use them, but was angry I got rid of something that must have been important. I fixed Word, by just clicking the "ok" box on the error report, as it was a corrupt file, that it fixed itself. After a month, my mother had not fixed it, as she never read the error box. Lets just say, as soon as I fix the corrupt instillation of .net (probably an entire windows reinstall as it's quite trashed) I will neve do any computer/software repairs for family again.

Gary · May 06, 2010, 10:25:33

Quote from: Technical Ben on May 06, 2010, 10:19:34
AFAIK, and with a little google, FF and opera have mac flavours, so mainly yes. Don't think chrome has yet.
My mother also tends to just click things on the pc without looking at what it says. When I hid all the task bars (never got around to uninstalling) I was greeted with a "what have you done to my PC!". She did not even use them, but was angry I got rid of something that must have been important. I fixed Word, by just clicking the "ok" box on the error report, as it was a corrupt file, that it fixed itself. After a month, my mother had not fixed it, as she never read the error box. Lets just say, as soon as I fix the corrupt instillation of .net (probably an entire windows reinstall as it's quite trashed) I will neve do any computer/software repairs for family again.

Chrome is available for Mac as well if you want to use it, I know a few people using it. http://www.itproportal.com/oss/news/article/2010/5/5/google-debuts-fastest-chrome-browser-yet/

And I sympathise with the family puter issues, best avoided