somethings gone terribly wrong

[coreservers]

absolutely crawling tonight. so looked at router stats

Connection Speed 285 kbps 1040 kbps
Line Attenuation 35 db 9.5 db
Noise Margin 31 db 5 db


and treid to run bt test twice

Download speedachieved during the test was - 164 Kbps
For your connection, the acceptable range of speedsis 600-7150 Kbps.
Additional Information:
Your DSL Connection Rate :285 Kbps(DOWN-STREAM), 1040 Kbps(UP-STREAM)
IP Profile for your line is - 5500 Kbps
The throughput of Best Efforts (BE) classes achieved during the test is - 27.44:18.9:53.66 (SBE:NBE:PBE)
These figures represent the ratio while sententiously passing Sub BE, Normal BE and Priority BE marked traffic.

The results of this test will vary depending on the way your ISP has decided to use these traffic classes.

[Rik]

You know the answer, you've got a low speed sync, so low throughput. The profile will have no effect at the moment, your sync speed is determining your throughput. Do the usual checks, eg connect to the test socket, use a MW radio to try and detect any local noise. If that doesn't help, let support know.

[coreservers]

I notice it's below BT's minimum. these are taken from the test socket. I've mailed support. I did ask support to remove interleaving, to try and improve ping times for gaming, could this have done it?

[Rik]

It's always possible if interleaving was keeping the line stable.

[coreservers]

Well it's improved the ping times, there down from 43ms to 20ms. but I still cant game because the line's too unstable.  .

[Rik]

You may just have your answer there.

[psp83]

If your line is unstable but you still want low pings (interleaving off) ask support to ask BT to increase your noise margin, It will give a lower sync, which means lower speed but might make the line stable without the ping increase.

[Technical Ben]

Sorry to hear it's gone pear shaped. I guess every line is different. I've got a perfect line, but a old exchange. So interleaving is off, and I'm all ok. How far are you from the exchange? Or have you rebooted the router since the swapover? 

[coreservers]

well called support.
basically due to "banding" I have the choice of high pings and interleaving on or low pings and a 164k throughput, both make gaming impossible. Which is one of the things I asked When I started, would it be better than sky's broadband for gaming, yes was the answer.



I've also found out that now it'll take up to 5 days to switch interleaving back on.

Wonderful 

[Rik]

You were given an honest answer, based on what was known at that time, namely the state of IDNet's network. What no-one could know, until you were connected, was just how bad your line was.

[Steve]

Did you get  remodulated back to adslmax or you still on adsl2+

[coreservers]

I did ask to be switched to adsl max, some time ago, but after calling today, I get a mail stating "my new broadband order for ADSL2+ will be done in 5 days time". So I guess if it does come back. I'll have to re-request a move back to adslmax. seems a hell of a roundabout way to go about things

[Rik]

So what are you on atm?

[coreservers]

no idea rik, no idea. other than a crawling service. I was on adsl2+ then adslmax, now I've no idea, but I keep getting mails telling me new broadband service will be ready in 5 days, whenever I request something.

[Rik]

Well, it's too late for me to talk to support now, I can't really do anything till Tuesday. What's your upstream sync speed.

[coreservers]

285 kbps 1075 kbps
Line Attenuation 35 db 9.5 db
Noise Margin 31 db 5 db

[Rik]

That suggests a profiled ADSL2+ to me, but I can't be sure. Does your router indicate what modulation it's using?

[coreservers]

seems now to be getting worse and worse (and ping times are back up to 34ms).

I am a global moderator on a site www.ukdetectornet.co.uk, which is quite photo heavy as it contains archaeological photos etc. Took me 2 minutes just to get logged in
and xbox live wont let me in at all. Which is really annoying as I've just got to a really good mission in red dead redemption!
. tried BT speedtest..... now always failing. speed.io ran after 3 minutes, see below


Getting to the stage I've no connection at all now.

[coreservers]

finally got a bt test to run!
Download speedachieved during the test was - 56 Kbps
For your connection, the acceptable range of speedsis 50-250 Kbps.
Additional Information:
Your DSL Connection Rate :285 Kbps(DOWN-STREAM), 1075 Kbps(UP-STREAM)
IP Profile for your line is - 135 Kbps
The throughput of Best Efforts (BE) classes achieved during the test is - 16.07:17.86:66.07 (SBE:NBE:PBE)
These figures represent the ratio while sententiously passing Sub BE, Normal BE and Priority BE marked traffic.

[DorsetBoy]

finally got a bt test to run!
Download speedachieved during the test was - 56 Kbps
For your connection, the acceptable range of speedsis 50-250 Kbps.
Additional Information:
Your DSL Connection Rate :285 Kbps(DOWN-STREAM), 1075 Kbps(UP-STREAM)
IP Profile for your line is - 135 Kbps
The throughput of Best Efforts (BE) classes achieved during the test is - 16.07:17.86:66.07 (SBE:NBE:PBE)
These figures represent the ratio while sententiously passing Sub BE, Normal BE and Priority BE marked traffic.

135kbps is the lowest profile and would suggest serious amounts of noise or multiple disconnections being seen by the exchange.

[coreservers]

I fear I've been put on the old circuit that they stuck me on when I first transferred to IDnet. it's acting the same way. that was a datastream circuit, and involved 2 weeks of arguing with BT, 
just been off for another half hour.
the disconnects are not being made by me,
I've tried the fm radio, in the test socket etc. the only change was my request to have interleaving switched off. 17070 is perfectly quiet.

[DorsetBoy]

The circuit has not been changed, those stats show you are on a ADSL2+ line , when you went back to 8mb they remodulate the line , not physically change the connection.

What you have is noise/disconnects for some reason.

[Rik]

I agree, Dorset.

[Steve]

Except recent remodulations back to adslmax had maintained the upstream sync if I recall correctly??? But still it has to be a noisy connection

[Rik]

Isn't that what the BT test shows, though, Steve?

[Steve]

Which bit Rik?

[Rik]

Upstream was 1075.

[DorsetBoy]

Upstream was 1075.

Which was how I knew the line was a remodulated ADSL2+ 

[Steve]

I am no disagreeing but for my own education how can you tell adsl2+ and a remodulated back to adslmax from a BT speedtest? When Alan (kinmel) was remodulated back his upstream sync stayed the same I think.

[coreservers]

still falling now 50k throughput

and been offline for an hour. Think I'll call out of hours support, I'm supposed to be working from home tomorrow and monday

Download speedachieved during the test was - 50 Kbps
For your connection, the acceptable range of speedsis 50-250 Kbps.
Additional Information:
Your DSL Connection Rate :285 Kbps(DOWN-STREAM), 1067 Kbps(UP-STREAM)
IP Profile for your line is - 135 Kbps
The throughput of Best Efforts (BE) classes achieved during the test is - 8.0:8.0:84.0 (SBE:NBE:PBE)
These figures represent the ratio while sententiously passing Sub BE, Normal BE and Priority BE marked traffic.

[Rik]

I am no disagreeing but for my own education how can you tell adsl2+ and a remodulated back to adslmax from a BT speedtest? When Alan (kinmel) was remodulated back his upstream sync stayed the same I think.

We can't for sure, Steve, but the connection has to be WBC for that u/s sync. Plus core made a reference to banding earlier, which means he's on, or been on WBC. He says he requested to remodulate to ADSL, so I'm assuming that's been done, but at that point things got a little confused.

[coreservers]

well been unable to connect all afternoon. only just got back on.
I left a detailled message for support at just after noon, stating I was offline, did I get the decency of a call back......... NO.

marvellous

[Rik]

Odd, I contacted support and got a response quite quickly. I'll enquire. (Though I suspect that part of the problem is that there is nothing they can do for you till Tuesday when BT reopen.)

[kinmel]

I am no disagreeing but for my own education how can you tell adsl2+ and a remodulated back to adslmax from a BT speedtest? When Alan (kinmel) was remodulated back his upstream sync stayed the same I think.

My upstream improved to 768 on Adsl2+ and stayed the same when I reverted back to AdslMax , today I am  at 800 upstream on AdsdlMax.  My download stats are now exactly as they were before the upgrade/downgrade.

[Rik]

well been unable to connect all afternoon. only just got back on.
I left a detailled message for support at just after noon, stating I was offline, did I get the decency of a call back......... NO.

marvellous

Support have emailed you. As I suspected, because BT are closed until Tuesday, there is nothing they can do for you over the weekend.

[Rik]

Update:

Support tell me your line has been 'up' since ~10am.

[coreservers]

then why I have been getting "unable to display web page all afternoon".
So it is almost instant to get interleaving turned off, but nearly a week to get it turned back on?

"Your circuit has been banded, this is a result of errors on the circuit. You will need to leave your hardware connected directly to the test port of the main socket. We can request the circuit be unbanded for you however the team within BT who can perform this operation will only be available again Tuesday. The only problem with this is that if there is an underlying fault with your hardware internally the circuit will simply be banded again. If you believe the fault is with BT and would like us to arrange an engineer again this is something we can do for you, but you must be aware of possible charges should BT locate a fault with your hardware."


I am absolutely furious. when I called to ask about interleaving etc, it was vertainly never explained that it could lead to this shambles.

welcome to 21st century british technology. a great achievement.

[DorsetBoy]

Your circuit has been banded, this is a result of errors on the circuit.

Put simply this means there is noise/interference on the line and the BT equipment has responded to that, what is needed is to find the cause of the noise.

[coreservers]

The only change made. was to request interleaving be turned off. is it that difficult to reset it?

[Rik]

It takes time, it's done by BT, and they don't work weekends and holidays.

[coreservers]

ah well thats 6 hours overtime lost this weekend. car boot it is

[DorsetBoy]

If there is a large amount of noise,interleaving will cut back in automatically,BT will not switch it off if the line is unstable in any case. This is why you have been asked to leave the router on so the line stats can be checked.

The "change" as you put it is NOT the cause of the profile drop.

[coreservers]

seems too much of a coincidence. it's been pretty stable for a month or so at 5mb, I call up on tuesday saking about having interleaving turned off, Thursday... it all goes belly up.

it's actually dropped below the "acceptable thruput" for 135k profile now at 40k.   

[Rik]

The key word there is stable. Interleaving helps stability. On a poor line, and that includes mine, your choice is between fast pings and stability. There may be other factors involved, but that's the essential physics of ADSL.

[DorsetBoy]

I call up on tuesday saking about having interleaving turned off, Thursday... it all goes belly up.
 

EXACTLY !!!!!!!!!!! the NOISE is causing the problem, with interleaving on the line is more stable >> INTERLEAVING EXPLAINED

[coreservers]

Frankly dorsetboy with rude abusive answers like that I'd rather you just left my posts alone in future, I debated a point. You've used capitals so in future leave my posts alone you rude man

[Rik]

Dorset was just trying to explain what has triggered your problems. He appears to have used caps for emphasis when I would have used italics, but the essence would have been the same.

[DorsetBoy]

Frankly dorsetboy with rude abusive answers like that I'd rather you just left my posts alone in future, I debated a point. You've used capitals so in future leave my posts alone you rude man

Rude? Venting frustration perhaps but the intention was not to be rude.

However perhaps you should take a few minutes to read over your 200+ posts here .

You continually disparage BT,IDNet and other ISP's  yet fail to listen to the facts that are laid out for you. Your exchange is severely congested,something an ISP can do nothing about, you have an unstable line which is suffering from noise and interference which adds to your problems.

Support, forum staff and many members have over time tried to help you, but, for reasons known only to yourself you choose to ignore all requests to give the required data or do what is requested to assist in finding a solution.

The forum itself contains a vast amount of material provided to help members, this has been linked in your threads yet it is apparently ignored.

You consistently ignore advice that is given and just come back posting with more complaints about speeds,the test results you give it has been explained on numerous occasions are not the ones required to resolve things , in short you choose to do nothing  to help yourself.

From where I stand it is hardly polite to continually post as you do and waste the time that has been so freely given by forum staff and members.

It has been clearly explained to you what the issues are,what interleaving is and why it comes in to play and for some reason you ignore this and carry on posting complaints.

No ISP can switch noise margins up or down nor can they change the status of interleaving,they have to request the action from BT.

BT are only available to ISP's Monday to Friday (unless the line is covered by Enhanced Care).
BT will not make instant changes to a line that is unstable either.

Knowing from past experience how frustrating a bad line can be I tried to assist you.

You have requested I leave your threads/posts alone in future, I will be more than happy to oblige you in this. Rest assured that as of now I will not be wasting any more time reading your posts..

[coreservers]

nice to know Tuesday made all the difference..... not.
Depsite 1st mentioning it to support last thursday. Still got a 32k line. nowt seems to have been done. still 31db snr, still disconnecting every 2-3 hours.

Sorry but it's not good enough. not by a long way, whether it's BT or IDnet, i know it's BT, IDnet are my isp. it's up to them.

[Rik]

As I understand it, IDNet have informed you that they've passed your case to BT and requested unbanding. The removal of interleaving triggered this latest issue, and as you know, that was at your request.

Following a bank holiday weekend BT have, undoubtedly, been swamped by similar requests and you will have to take your place in the queue. As I understand it, you've asked for unbanding before, and it's entirely possible that BT may refuse on this occasion, but let's hope it doesn't come to that.

What you have to come to terms with is that your line is inherently unstable, and you cannot expect low pings and stability at the same time. Either you accept the higher pings, or low speeds, that's simply the physics of ADSL.

[coreservers]

1stly I've not asked for unbanding before, i'd be interested to find out where that came from? The only unbanding done was when BT Screwed up my migration and was their doing not mine,  and I do accept that I requested interleaving taken off, my request, however at no point via mail or phone was I warned of the risks. I'd gladly accept the higher ping times, if I had a useable internet connection.
I understand it was a bank holiday as well. But this has been a bit longer term than I feel it should have been. one of my fellow mods on another forum is also an IDnet customer and is also complaining about lack of service and poor information! 

Now I know I have a record of complaints, but I always speak my mind, it's the way we're brought up in Fife. If that upsets some people, I apologise.
All I want is a reasonable useable service, which is what I pay my money for.

[Rik]

My information obviously differs from yours, so there's nothing much else I can say to you.

This forum is a magnet for people with problems, yet we get relatively few to deal with, so if your fellow mod would care to join, I will gladly follow up on his issues.

[coreservers]

Ok, this is a genuine apology to all those who've taken a broadside from me recently, but I'm getting increaingly frustrated, I need to cover night time support, My wife needs to get online application forms filled in, so I'm getting grief there and at home.
constantly
Had I known this would be a risk I'd never have gone down the interleaving route, certainly now knowing it takes this long to get it rectified. hindsight is a marvellous thing

Overall the service has been pretty good and reliable, but when things go wrong the lack of any concrete information is where I and possibly others get frustrated. That does indeed fall at the feet of BT.

I'm guesing if BT refuse I'm either stuck with a 15k thruput, yup that's what BT speed test tells me. or will have to seek another isp.

and that's not something I want to do. I like IDnet, I like local support, I dont want to end up with mumbai scripts.
It's taken me over an hour to get this posted!

[psp83]

I'm guesing if BT refuse I'm either stuck with a 15k thruput, yup that's what BT speed test tells me. or will have to seek another isp.

and that's not something I want to do. I like IDnet, I like local support, I dont want to end up with mumbai scripts.
It's taken me over an hour to get this posted!

From what I've seen, When changing ISP your line settings at the exchange can follow. So if BT refuse to do it, changing ISPs may not mean you can get your line reset.

I know what you're going through, I have a cr*p line.. But I'm lucky enough that a higher noise margin makes my line more stable, but this lowers the speed. But that's something I'm willing to have so I can leave interleaving off. The day I stop playing online games, I will get it re enabled and my noise margin dropped down.