New IDNetter, Advice on speed?.

[TomSG]

Hey there,

Just recently got my service migrated from plusnet to over here at IDNet, I have a few questions regarding the speed I can/can't get.

So, I recently had my interleaving turned off, was giving me ping times of 100ms to my favourite servers, now there down to 60-70 so im happy with that. However, I have a few questions about my speed.

Here are some router stats

Connection Speed:     4128 kbps             448 kbps
Line Attenuation:       35 db                     9.5 db
Noise Margin:            7 db                       23 db


This is my most recent sync, now to me, 35db attenuation is fairly decent, and as far as im aware, should be able to support around a 6mb sync, and the noise margin seems ok, fluctuates to about 6-9db. Haven't really checked, ill look into it more. So, 4128 kbps sync seems a little low to say the least, I live in rural Scotland around 1.5miles from the exchange located in my village, exchange code: NSNDR. Only does 600 odd residential places and has never had any problems as far as im aware.
I use a netgear DG834v3 which truth be told is a little old now, is it possible the router may be causing the slow sync, or perhaps other factors im not aware of?. Internal wiring isnt brand new, but it all seems in good order, was replaced around 7 years ago when I used ISDN from BT. The master socket has the ringing wires disconnected and using the test socket doesn't make any difference, so I guess its not internal.

If anyone has any thoughts on what my actual speed should be and why I'd be very grateful, I'm thinking the router may be at fault, but don't have another to test without buying. Any light shed would be much appreciated.

[kinmel]

That connection rate is low, I am currently connected at 4192, but my Attenuation is 58.2 with a 6 SNR.

You seem to have covered all the likely causes, other than the router.

If you contact Support they may lend you a router to see if that helps.

Please do a series of speedtests using http://www.speedtester.bt.com.

[Ray]

  I can't add anything to Alan's advice.

[Glenn]

  Tom

[Rik]

Welcome to the forum, Tom.

Do you have a record of your previous router stats? How is the router connected to the phone line, ie master socket or extension, what other devices are on the line, eg Sky box?

[Simon]

  Tom.

[sof2er]

  Tom!

On my previous connection I used to have a 35db line with a 8128 synch, so something must be definitely wrong. I'd suggest lending a router and see if that makes any difference.

[TomSG]

Wow, thats good to hear, so somethings definately a miss then?.


I don't really have a log of previous router stats, the sync has always been very random, ive seen it sync at 7 before, but it doesnt hold for long I guess.
The router is plugged into the master socket via a short 1.5ft RJ11 cable, then 30m of ethernet cat5e upstairs to my computer. The only device that uses the line is the phone. It's just the router -> filter -> socket, with the phone plugged into the filter.

I found a spare router in my stash of electronic things, although it looks pretty nasty, a generic Conexant of some kind. I guess i'll give it a bash.  Is it possible that the DSLAM isn't letting me take 4 based on a bad 10 settle period that was formed probrably years ago?.

[Rik]

That router setup sounds fine. Can you run a BT test and paste the results back here?

[TomSG]

Download speedachieved during the test was - 3209 Kbps
For your connection, the acceptable range of speeds is 600-7150 Kbps.
Additional Information:
Your DSL Connection Rate :4128 Kbps(DOWN-STREAM), 448 Kbps(UP-STREAM)
IP Profile for your line is - 3500 Kbps



Seems to be in check with the sync and IP profile.

The only problem here is the low sync.

[Rik]

That's spot on for the sync, the question is why is the sync so low. Given the age of your router, I'd be inclined to try another if you can borrow one from someone. Meantime, I'll see what I can find out.

[Rik]

Support have just reset your target margin down from 15db to 6db. This should take effect in 2-24 hours. Once this happens, you sync speed should follow and with it the profile. However, if the problem returns, there is definitely interference pickup and we'll need to do some digging.

[TomSG]

Thanks Rik! Really awesome help from everyone here.

I gave that generic router a shot, and look at this:

Speed           Latency        Speed                 Latency
448 Kbps       Fast             7072 Kbps             Fast

Now that's more like it! 

The question is though, for how long will this sync hold?.

I've really just accepted the speeds I've had for a years now without question, only recently have I thought about it.
Basically, If I'm right in thinking, I should be getting nearer 7mbit and than 4 right?. Seems a bit of a shock I've been all this time without my potential!.

[Rik]

Right, the 4M was way too slow and shows the havoc a router can wreak. Providing you don't get a high error count, then your speed should hold.

[Rik]

Just checked in with support, your line is already showing errors. Keep an eye on things and if the speed drops again, you may have to make a choice between fast path (low pings) and interleaved (stable line with higher sync speed).

[TomSG]

I'll take fastpath everytime, as my ping times are whats most important. Still, I'd be more than happy with a 5mbit sync, which should surely be achieveable seeing as how I can sync at 7.1. Everything seems stable so far, I'll post again if anything unexpected happens.

[Lance]

I wonder if a 9db noise margin on fastpath would give the balace required?

[Rik]

What Lance suggests may be a good compromise for you, Tom. Support can 'pin' the target NM at a level which will give a mixture of reasonable speed without interleaving.

[TomSG]

Ok, IP profile is still stuck at 4 so will wait for that to change, the sync is still holding at 7 with no problems. I'll give it a few days to see what comes of it. If its unstable. I'll contact support to see if I can set a good NM margin.

The support here has been phenomenal, honestly. Many thanks.

[Rik]

Our pleasure. The profile can take up to five days to shift.

[TomSG]

Updates.

The sync dropped around 10 minutes ago and I've resynced at 6112kbps. The noise margin is dangerously low at 1-2db!. What's up with this?. Anyway to make this more stable. I'd be quite happy with a 5-6sync. Surely this is achieveable, really dont understand whats causing the instability. Any suggestions on how to achieve this?.

[Simon]

Is there any noise on your phone line?  A 'quiet line' test may be useful.  Dial 17070, option 2, and you should just hear a low background hum.  Anything else, and you may have a problem with the line. 

[TomSG]

The quiet line test seems to be ok, I can hear a generic hum or buzz, but theres not crackles or pops, just a steady hum.

The sound margin is so low, went right down to 0db didnt lose sync though, perhaps its time to set a target DB of 9.

Oh yeah, im getting packet loss on servers too. 30 tick rate, and around 0-5 loss.

[tKe]

Hey, sorry to hijack your thread but it put me to thinking about my possible speed and I didn't want to flood the forum with another thread on the same topic (although different target).

I'm fairly happy with my current sync and speed but from the attenuation and noise margin I have I'm wondering if I can get the full 8Mbps profile.

Details (copied straight from my DG834v3):

Connection Speed	7264 kbps	672 kbps
Line Attenuation	4 db	2 db
Noise Margin	11 db	7 db

[TomSG]

You must live literally ON the exchange. You can achieve maximum for sure, however, your IP profile will give you 6.5mb at the moment, the best you can hope for is 7.5. Your only a meg off your maximum speed, is it really that important?. I suggest resyncing your router in the morning to see if you can get higher than your current 7.2. Once your router syncs higher, wait for your IP profile to change which will take some time and you'll have to hold this sync or resync higher to achieve the full speed.