Test Router

[annc]

Hi - I am asking this forum for help once again.  My daughter has returned from holiday and has received a test router from IDNet.  She has plugged it in, but her laptop (running Windows Vista) cannot detect it!  Also - IDNet have not given her any method of return which has to be within 7 days and she will have to buy a jiffy bag and do this at her own expense.   

Has anyone here ever used one of these test routers and if so is there something she could be doing wrong.  Seems to be quite straightforward, plugged into power socket and into filter.  Any idea why her laptop can't find it?

Thanks
Ann

[Steve]

Hi Ann

I think we need to know which router she's been given i.e if it's a Netgear DG834 it won't have wifi or if it's a Netgear DG834G the wireless could be turned off.

[annc]

Hi Steve - you have hit the nail on the head.  Both of us had told IDNET that she connects wirelessly.  Her router is next to her front door so she can't stand in the hallway to use her laptop!!!  They have sent her a Netgear DG834.  Now she will have to return it at her expense.  This is all becoming a bit of a joke  I will have to phone them on her behalf tomorrow as she will be working from 8.00-6.30pm.  The support hours aren't very helpful if you are working.  

[Steve]

If your prepared to get your hands dirty, you can connect the DG834g which I think you also have in bridge mode to the DG834 so it will act as a wireless access point

Essentially log into DG834g turn off the DHCP server and then connect it to one of the ethernet ports of the DG834.

[annc]

Hi Steve - thanks very much for that.  I think I could do that, but she isn't quite so IT savvy and I am not sure she would know how to do it.   She lives quite a distance from me, so I can't just drop in and do it for her.  IDNET will have to send her a wireless test router. 

In the meantime, the drops she is getting are less, but only getting between 1-2Mbs download speeds which needs sorting by someone.

Thanks again for your help re: the router type, it never occurred to me that they would send out a wired router.

Ann

[Simon]

I would assume that they want to eliminate the wireless connection as being part of the problem, hence sending a wired router for testing purposes.  Can your daughter not use the packaging IDNet sent it in to return it?  I'm always using second hand jiffy bags.   I further assume that IDNet paid the postage to send it, so it's even, really.  

[Lance]

The postage on the router and any packing is a significant reduction in cost to a customer than purchasing a new router themselves or paying for a BT visit.

I don't know of any other ISP which offers this service (that's not to say there isn't any).

Legally required, by the way, is a break when working from 8 to half 6. If she chooses not to call support during this break, she could maybe email and request a out of hours support call.

[annc]

Thanks Lance

She requested a phone call from out of hours support last night but didn't get a call back.  She leaves for work at 8.15am and sometimes doesn't get back until after 6.30pm  Yesterday she was up in London organising a conference so no chance of phoning IDNET - today it is teleconferencing with the US until 6.30pm. 

Everything to do with her broadband connection was organised by IDNet 6 months ago, from the installation of the phone line to her broadband connection. 
It is only when things go pear shaped that you realise that an ISP that is only open from 8.00-6.30 Mon-Fri is absolutely useless if you are working.

Ann

[Steve]

I'm not sure we at the forum can offer any more help until a test router is connected and working, I sympathise with your daughters plight but some accommodation has to be made to resolve these issues. Although you will find extended out of hours support with other ISPs one has to be careful that this does not involve some script monkey based outside the UK

[annc]

Hi Steve - she will plug the test router in on Friday evening before she goes away for the weekend and will remove it when she returns Sunday.  Hopefully this will be enough time to monitor.  This of course is only to identify the stability of the router she has (that was bought from IDNET) and will not help to find the cause of her very low download speeds, not sure what the process will be after that.

Thanks again

Ann

[Steve]

If she can manage to get some stats from the router when she returns and also a BT speedtest it would be very useful, all this providing she has a length of ethernet cable to connect to the laptop.

[annc]

Hi Steve - this all gets curiouser and curiouser.  I did a search regarding the telephone line and the BT Wholesale Checker states that the maximum speed her line will take is 500Kbs.  I have phoned BT who say that the line up to her building will take up to 7Mbs.  I had phoned IDNet about this and they just said there was nothing they can do, however, this line was wired in by BT in April this year.  So if the line up to her building will take 7Mbs surely they did something wrong with her internal wiring?  She has nothing plugged into the master socket but the router (no telephone) and she has plugged it directly into the socket having removed the faceplate. 

I don't understand why the line up to the building would take a high speed but her particular line is only supporting 500Kbs - seems ridiculous.  Any suggestions as to how to proceed on this? 

Thanks

Ann

[annc]

Ah - forget last post.  I finally spoke to someone at IDNet who has explained it all to me and the light has dawned   Apparently, until her connection is stable the speed will be driven down in an attempt to provide something/anything.  Once we get to the route of the disconnections the line can be reset and hopefully maintain higher speeds.   I must say that I was very surprised that in the middle of a busy town she should have such poor speeds, while I am out in the sticks and get a constant 6.5Mbs.

So it is now all wait and see with fingers crossed. 

[Steve]

The joys of BTs IP profile system and the imposition of banded profile's on adsl2+. A lot of the issues relate to noise or interference induced into the adsl signal by internal wiring and also in addition faulty adsl routers and filters. BT charge £160 + vat to check a broadband line if no fault is found between the master socket and the exchange, we the user, therefore have to make sure  first of all that there are no issues our side of the master socket.

[annc]

Phone IDnet this morning to say test router had been plugged in all weekend (not connected to laptop so computer is out of the frame).  They said there had been constant drops on the line - so looks like it isn't her router that is to blame. 

BT set this line up in April.  There are no extensions, no phone connected and the router is plugged directly into the master socket with the face plate off.  Any thoughts as to what the cause of this could be?

Thanks
Ann

[Simon]

Could be a line fault.  It might actually help if she had a phone to connect, as she could then do a 'quiet line test'.  If there is noise or crackling on the line, that could cause problems.

[annc]

Thanks Simon - but what can be done about noise on the line?  Her broadband is virtually unusable at the moment.  She was getting better speeds from the Orange dongle that I bought for her when she first moved in. 

[Simon]

Well, if there's noise on the line, that can be reported to BT as a voice fault, which they are more likely to fix. 

[annc]

Ah - thanks for that.  IDnet have said that they will do some tests on the line this morning and phone me back, so will wait for that, might then just report as a line fault anyway - must be that as I can't think of any other explanation.  If it is her wiring, then they are responsible anyway because they did it only 7 months ago!

[Steve]

I think we need to be clear of the difference between reporting a line with voice fault and a broadband fault. The voice fault is noise heard on a non portable phone during the quiet line test, with regard to a broadband fault, I would be directed by IDNet who have the experience to tell whether a BT call out is warranted . If BT find no fault between master socket and exchange, the user ends up paying.

[annc]

Thanks Steve - If there is no fault between the master socket (router plugged directly in) and the exchange, then the fault is down to IDnet.  It is all well and good for each service to blame the other, but if the broadband service is unusable through no fault of the customer then what to do?

[annc]

Ok - it is being referred to BT as there is no equipment fault.  Will take approx 24 hours for them to check - hoping that they will find fault and rectify     Thanks to everyone for input and for putting up with my ranting.  Problems like this are very frustrating. 

PS - can't find an edit button to help modify previous post.  I know my eyesight isn't as good as it was but 

[SSK]

If there is no fault between the master socket (router plugged directly in) and the exchange, then the fault is down to IDnet. 

Perhaps that depends on exactly what is meant by 'between the master socket and the exchange'.
Does that actually include the equipment in the exchange?
My understanding is that any fault in the exchange is BT's responsibility.

Last year I totally lost all internet connection (no synch at all) for over 2 weeks because there was a fault in the card at the exchange. For 10 days BT claimed there was a synch and that their remote diagnostics showed no fault at the exchange. I had to buy and test another router before they would believe there was no problem at my end. Only then did they agree to send an engineer to the exchange. It took a couple of days for them to do that, then another few days to get a new card and fit it.

Anyway, the points I'm trying to make are: 1) the fault may not be BETWEEN the test socket and the exchange but can still be BT's problem; 2) BT will always deny anything is their problem; 3) BT's remote diagnostics don't always give correct results; 4) BT will try any delaying tactics they can to avoid sending an engineer to the exchange.

Sean

[Simon]

That is your own experience though, Sean.  Others have fared better. 

Ann, you can only edit a post for a certain time, after which the Edit button disappears.

[annc]

Anyway, the points I'm trying to make are: 1) the fault may not be BETWEEN the test socket and the exchange but can still be BT's problem; 2) BT will always deny anything is their problem; 3) BT's remote diagnostics don't always give correct results; 4) BT will try any delaying tactics they can to avoid sending an engineer to the exchange.

Sean

Hi Sean - yep I have had that myself.  Even had a BT engineer out to test my wiring (phone kept cutting out as well as broadband but I have got 5 phones and several yards of extension cable  )  They insisted that the fault lay with myself, but later it was discovered that there was a fault at the exchange that was affecting a number of users.  I had already been billed by BT by this time, but complained and eventually received a refund.  Anyway - I am well aware of BT's tactics but am hoping that something will be done in this case as it is much more simple, no phone and no other equipment or extension cable and router - now proved to have no fault - plugged directly into master socket, they simply can't blame anything else. - Or can they 

[Steve]

Unfortunately BT are judge and jury, they have no obligation to provide a broadband service and in some cases they can just deem the line suitable for voice calls only.

[Rik]

Last year I totally lost all internet connection (no synch at all) for over 2 weeks because there was a fault in the card at the exchange. For 10 days BT claimed there was a synch and that their remote diagnostics showed no fault at the exchange. I had to buy and test another router before they would believe there was no problem at my end. Only then did they agree to send an engineer to the exchange. It took a couple of days for them to do that, then another few days to get a new card and fit it.

Same thing happened to me, Sean. For 10 days BT swore all was well and I was in sync - there wasn't even a router connected to the line! Eventually, they sent an engineer to the exchange and found a faulty line card. As Steve says, judge, jury and executioner. 

[annc]

Well IDNet are saying that the line hasn't dropped in the past couple of days and that the speed should pick up in a few days time.  We will wait and see.  They have asked BT to do a manual reset (whatever that is)  She is still only getting 500kbs download speed however.

When I phoned BT they said that the line was configured to 7Mbs so if her speed doesn't pick up by Monday has anyone any ideas where to go from there?

[Steve]

The line speed is also controlled by BT line management i.e IP profile which sets a maximum download speed. I suspect that in this instance the IP profile is low due to previous instability and it will rise automatically if the connection remains stable. Details of the current IP profile can be found by performing a BT speedtest.

Unfortunatley the way BT's line management works the IP profile can drop in minutes but takes days if not upto a couple of weeks to fully recover.

[Simon]

Did they give a reason for the new stability, Ann?

[gyruss]

Unfortunatley the way BT's line management works the IP profile can drop in minutes but takes days if not upto a couple of weeks to fully recover.

as i found out myself.   i was on 1.2 to 1.4 connection for nearly a month due to the constant re-sync events which were caused by 'problems on BT's side of the NTE5 box in my hall.  I'm still not wholly convinced the fault i've experienced has gone away totally as i do hear noise on my line sometimes during phone calls and on quiet line test, but with my router permanently now connected on a 1m cable to the master socket, I still see 'zero db noise margin' events on router stats periodically.  My noise margin however has stabilised around the 8.5 db mark now which is far different to the 14.5-15db that it had been in the lead up.   BT had to snip the wires in my junction box as they found a seriously bent (and quite possibly fractured) wire there.  Currently sync'd at 7300 and profile is over 6000 now which is all i've wanted since joining idnet.

So yeah, i'd recommend checking for noise on the line mostly as this potentially can be causing resync events even with the router connected directly.  The 17070 test or lift the receiver and press 1 (and then listen).   I feel your frustration though, its no fun.

As for reporting the problem next, well, you could tell IDNET to get BT out for an S.F.I. visit which will be my next cause of action if my issues resurface over the coming days/weeks.

[annc]

Hi Simon, No they didn't give a reason for the constant drops.  Thanks gyruss, if her speeds haven't improved by Monday, I will insist that they get BT out for a visit.  I think that should be long enough for the speed to adjust upward to some degree.  500kbs is just not acceptable on a line that should deliver 7 Mbs.  Fingers crossed for now 

Thanks to everyone on here.  It's great to be able to let off steam and get some support

[gyruss]

I found this document a worthwhile read : http://www.thinkbroadband.com/files/broadband-max-myths-and-legends.pdf

[.Griff.]

When I phoned BT they said that the line was configured to 7Mbs so if her speed doesn't pick up by Monday has anyone any ideas where to go from there?

Something doesn't add up with that statement.

Your internet service is provided by BT Wholesale, via IDNet.

BT Wholesale do not speak to the general public period and as you're not a BT Retail customer they'd bounce you back to IDNet.

Did someone from BT really tell you what the line was "configured" for or did they simply take your details and tell you an estimated speed the line should support?

[annc]

Hm - well - posing as a new customer I asked them to check what speed the line for the telephone number would support - they said that particular line would support 7Mbs.  I said that at the moment it would only support 500Kps and was told that there must be something wrong because that particular telephone number is down as supporting 7Mbs.  I again said - is that up to 7Mbs and was told no that is what the line to that building will provide. 

Certainly, when broadband was first set up on the line, the speed was fine.  Over the past 2 months however, there have been frequent disconnects (like one every half hour or so) and the speed has dropped to what it is now.  The router has been ruled out as being the problem.  This is why I believe what I was told by BT that the line to the building is down as supporting 7Mbs.

[.Griff.]

See that is different to what you implied before and makes much more sense.

If you give BT a telephone number they will give you an estimate of the speed the line will support. Sometimes these estimates are accurate and sometimes they are completely incorrect as I know from personal experience.

Personally I stopped trusting their "estimates" years ago and I advise you not to pay any attention to it or failing that atleast don't assume it's 100% accurate.

[Steve]

As I mentioned earlier I would be interested to see the IP profile for that line.

[Rik]

if her speeds haven't improved by Monday, I will insist that they get BT out for a visit.

Bear in mind, Ann, that any reluctance they show to getting an engineer out is simply to avoid you getting a hefty bill from BT.

[Lance]

I never trust the BT estimates as they've been wldly inaccurate in the past. Plus just because a line may once have supported a certain speed, there is nothing to say its going to support that speed in the future.

[annc]

Well all I know is that if the speeds don't improve it will be back to the Orange dongle - cheaper and at least she got 1Mbps with that.

[annc]

Hi Steve - this is what BT wholesale comes up with when I put her telephone number in :

Your exchange is ADSL enabled, and our initial test on your line indicates that your line should be able to have an ADSL broadband service that provides a fixed line speed up to 512Kbps. However, due to the length of your line, an engineer visit may be required, who will, where possible, supply the broadband service.

Our test also indicates that your line currently supports an estimated ADSL Max broadband line speed of 500Kbps.

Our test also indicates that your line currently supports an estimated ADSL2+ broadband line speed of 1Mbps.

Your cabinet is planned to have WBC FTTC by 31st December 2011. Our test also indicates that your line currently supports a fibre technology with an estimated WBC FTTC Broadband where consumers have received downstream line speed of 21.9Mbps and upstream line speed of 9.9Mbps.

The actual stable line speed supportable will be determined during the first 10 days of use. This speed may change over time, to ensure line stability is maintained.

If you decide to place an order, a further test will be performed to confirm if your line is suitable for the service you wish to purchase.

Thank you for your interest.

Please note that dates and exchanges are indicative and subject to change.
Please note that postcode and address check results are indicative only. Most accurate results can be obtained from a telephone number check.

Note: If you already have a Broadband service enabled on this line and you want to switch service providers, you will need to contact both your current provider and your new provider to get your service changed over new and existing service provider to have this service transferred.

[Rik]

That's not the profile, though, Ann. For that she needs to run a BT speedtest:

http://test.speedtester.bt.com:50301/

That said, the estimator is showing a markedly different result from that quoted to you by BT Retail, and it's the database which they should have checked.

[Steve]

So the BT data has now been updated so to speak to reflect what I suspect is the current or recent IP profile i.e around 500kps. She may be syncing a lot higher now and the profile should move towards the sync if the connection remains stable over the next few days.

[.Griff.]

Hi Steve - this is what BT wholesale comes up with when I put her telephone number in :

Your exchange is ADSL enabled, and our initial test on your line indicates that your line should be able to have an ADSL broadband service that provides a fixed line speed up to 512Kbps. However, due to the length of your line, an engineer visit may be required, who will, where possible, supply the broadband service.

Our test also indicates that your line currently supports an estimated ADSL Max broadband line speed of 500Kbps.

Our test also indicates that your line currently supports an estimated ADSL2+ broadband line speed of 1Mbps.

Your cabinet is planned to have WBC FTTC by 31st December 2011. Our test also indicates that your line currently supports a fibre technology with an estimated WBC FTTC Broadband where consumers have received downstream line speed of 21.9Mbps and upstream line speed of 9.9Mbps.

The actual stable line speed supportable will be determined during the first 10 days of use. This speed may change over time, to ensure line stability is maintained.

If you decide to place an order, a further test will be performed to confirm if your line is suitable for the service you wish to purchase.

Thank you for your interest.

Please note that dates and exchanges are indicative and subject to change.
Please note that postcode and address check results are indicative only. Most accurate results can be obtained from a telephone number check.

Note: If you already have a Broadband service enabled on this line and you want to switch service providers, you will need to contact both your current provider and your new provider to get your service changed over new and existing service provider to have this service transferred.

That completely contradicts what you posted earlier about BT quoting speeds of 7Mbps over the phone.

"If" that latest "guesstimate" is anywhere near correct then your daughter must have a very long line and low speeds are to be expected as a result.

[annc]

Griff - not sure what you mean by a very long line.  She is 0.8 kilometres from the exchange - router plugged directly into the main socket with faceplate removed. 

My line is well over a mile from my exchange - I have a long extension cable and 5 phones plugged in and still manage to get well over 6Mbs.

It may contradict BT but if you read my post I queried the 7Mbs they quoted me several times - they insisted they were correct.  However, when her broadband was first installed in April she was getting closer the 7Mbs figure.  Everything went pear shaped a few months ago.  If you are suggesting that I am not being truthful regarding my call to BT then I am really amazed    I was told one thing by BT and have found different information on the BT wholesale phone checker site.  What exactly I am to make of this.

Must be nice to be sitting on a download speed of 37Mbs

[Rik]

What you should make of it, Ann, is that a BT rep wanted to sell you broadband and didn't do a thorough job of looking at the checker. However, your daughter is currently in sync at ~7M, so we know the line can do it, the question now is why it can't do it consistently.

[.Griff.]

If you are suggesting that I am not being truthful regarding my call to BT then I am really amazed    I was told one thing by BT and have found different information on the BT wholesale phone checker site.)

I'm not questioning your honesty I am however questioning the accuracy of the information BT are passing onto you.

Like I said earlier I don't trust these estimates and advised you not to do so either which seems wise now you've been told one thing verbally and another thing via the BTW checker.

Must be nice to be sitting on a download speed of 37Mbs

It would be if it worked that way but that's a story for another day..

[annc]

Things have gone from bad to worse.  Constant drop outs and speed down to dial up.  It seems that BT have to come out to check the wiring.  My daughter can't take time off work and BT want either a whole morning or whole afternoon slot, they won't phone to say they are on their way so she could get back and only have to take an hour off.  Looks like I have a 180 mile round trip to sit and wait for BT so I really really hope this gets fixed 

Ann

[DorsetBoy]

A shame the numpties in their offices can't be more helpful, it has to be said the engineers will often phone ahead to check you are home or ask if they can come earlier than planned.

Which part of the country are we talking about?

[Simon]

Kent / Sussex, Dorset.  That's two counties, not three.   

[Rik]

Sorry, Ann, but BT - having an effective monopoly - can get away with customer service that no other company would survive.

[annc]

Hi DorsetBoy and Simon - My daughter is in West Sussex, I am in East Kent.  Oh well - we can get a nice dinner in the evening before I negotiate the M25 again.

It's not so much that I mind doing the trip, what worries me is that it may well get her no further forward (taken from my own previous experience!)

Yep Rik - BT's monopoly is ridiculous and they are fast eliminating any potential for competition re: fiberoptic lines.

[Rik]

I love the TV ad which implies only they can supply fibre.

[Steve]

Bullsh*t is high in  fibre I believe.

[Rik]

And grows great mushrooms.

[annc]

Hm - Back again 

I have just downloaded the manual for the router that IDnet sent my daughter and it states the following:
Note: Do not connect the DG834G to the ADSL line through a microfilter unless the microfilter is a combination microfilter/splitter specifically designed for this purpose. Doing so will prevent the built-in ADSL modem in the DG834G from establishing a connection to the Internet. If you have any doubts about this, connect the DG834G directly to the ADSL line.

Now - as she has no phone connected, could she just try plugging the router directly into the socket without the splitter.  I am not sure what type the splitter sent with the modem was.

Thanks
Ann

[Steve]

I think the manual is just stating that the correct type of filter is required and if no phones are connected no filter is required. I think it unlikely that the filter is of the incorrect type if it came with the router.

[annc]

Thanks Steve - just wondered if she should try plugging the router in directly without the splitter (should that be done?).  Do you think that is worth a try?  Sorry Steve - just reread your post.  I think I will get her to remove the filter and plug the router directly into the socket - that way another piece of equipment will be eliminated.

IDnet didn't really comment on the results of the test router and whether that also dropped.  I think I will buy another wireless modem router and take it down with me next week just to try.  Does anyone have any suggestions as to a good router?

Ann

[Steve]

Can you recall which router was attached when you posted below?

Well IDNet are saying that the line hasn't dropped in the past couple of days and that the speed should pick up in a few days time.  We will wait and see.  They have asked BT to do a manual reset (whatever that is)  She is still only getting 500kbs download speed however.

It is obviously possible that the supplied Netgear is faulty but I believe a BT visit has been organised? Is it worth spending more money until you have the results of this visit?

We've had good reports of users with the Draytek 2710N recently (it's not cheap or in a fancy case)

When you do visit can you post a BT speedtest and the router stats please. -http://www.kitz.co.uk/adsl/frogstats.php

We also recommend for those users with frequent resyncs using a 24hr margin monitoring program called routerstats

http://www.vwlowen.co.uk/internet/files.htm


It might pay dividends to take a length of ethernet cable so you can eliminate poor laptop wifi performance as a possible cause of poor throughput.

[annc]

OM Goodness - yes they obviously did comment  - must be having a senior moment  I wonder why they have called BT out instead of replacing the router    Will still buy another to take down and get it configured.

I will try and run a BT speedtest when I am down there - although when my own internet was playing up last week and my speeds dropped for a couple of days (think BT was messing around somewhere) I just couldn't get anything from the BT speedtest site - just kept getting error messages.  Will also get router stats and bring back with me.  

Don't know how much will be possible - especially downloading any software - because her connection has now dropped to dial up - practically nothing.  

Thanks again for all the help and support    

[sobranie]

I'd be very interested in the speeds that her neighbours are achieving. Eg: If she is the only one getting 500k in the building then there is something sorely amiss of course.
Here's a shot in the dark, new carpet maybe and the fitter has driven a nail through the bt cable. jftr ..... not so much a shot in the dark really 'cos it happened to a friend of mine last year.

[annc]

Hi Sobranie - No - no new carpet - she moved into an unfurnished flat last April - carpet was not new.

I am seriously beginning to think it is her router.  I have been reading reviews of the DG834G (not sure whether she was sent that or the DG834GT - again will check when I am down) anyway seems like a lot of people have experienced continuous drop outs with this particular router. It also gets extremely hot! As I said before, if the test router didn't drop out ??   However, reading reviews of various wireless ADSL2+ modem routers none of them seem brilliant so not sure what to get that will be relatively cheap and easy to set up.  I have a belkin N+ which has never caused any problems for me - but that also doesn't get particularly good reviews. Ho hum - the joys of broadband !

[Steve]

Unfortunately when one looks at reviews and comments on adslrouters there's a lot of bias,people who are unhappy tend to post.

[sobranie]

I use a netgear V4, far superior to the V5 which did tend to go haywire occasionally. (Lots of comments around on this I believe).

Back to the prob, I really really do think she should liaise with neighbours to ascertain whether their speeds are lousy too and, if so, report it to IDNet.

Sorry to harp on but 'nail in the wall' is a possibility too!

[annc]

Can someone confirm this or not.  Went to PC world to buy a different router and was told by salesperson that as ISP is IDNet I could only use a Netgear router.  Is this true, would a belkin or other make not work with IDNet?

[Rik]

Typical PC World rubbish I'm afraid, Ann. Any ADSL router will work, but avoid Belkin, we've seen a lot of problems with those.

[Simon]

It's cr*p!  You've only got to look around the forum to find people using Belkin, 2Wire, and any other router you can think of, with IDNet.  Netgear do, of course, also make cable routers, which can't be used with ADSL.  Maybe you happened to pick one of those up in the shop? 

[annc]

Thanks for that - I thought it sounded a bit weird.  I hadn't picked up any router and to be honest they didn't have a very large range - mostly belkins.  Think I might just buy another DG834G from Amazon - they are only £29. At least then if BT insist that there is no problem their end I can try a different router .  Unless anyone can suggest something else that is stable and easy to set up and not too expensive (ADSL2+ wireless modem router).  DG834G she has at the moment gets red hot - doesn't seem too good to me.

[Rik]

Do you know her line attenuation off hand, Ann? (Oh, and have you tried the Netgear stood on its side?)

[talos]

I know it's fashionable to diss Belkin at the moment, but let me put it into perspective.
                                I bought a Belkin wireless modem/router 2 years ago, mainly because of the promised "lifetime warranty" and I had bought Belkin products in the past and found them to be expensive but reliable.      Two weeks ago I began to have connection drop-outs when using a laptop wirelessly at extreme range, I did all the usual checks and concluded the router was failing, so I Emailed Belkin support for advice, they took me through the usual diagnostic routines and agreed to change the router under the G'tee, all this was achieved within 3 days last weekend, which I thought was quite impressive given their recent reputation.    On Tues this week I received an Email from their returns dept requesting me to return my faulty unit to them using the enclosed prepaid label,  I explained again by Email that to return it would leave me with no Internet connection at all since I do not have a spare modem, they asked do I rely on having a connection at all times to which I said yes and explained my circumstances,  by return I received another Email to the effect that they had decided to forgo their usual returns system and had released a replacement for immediate dispatch.  A new unit arrived by courier next day.
                                          All this was achieved by Email within a total of four days including a weekend.    Now I will reserve my judgement on the reliability of their products, but the quality of their customer service was outstanding and I would happily recommend their routers to anybody,  but please don't listen to the children who work at PCworld, they have no idea of what they are talking about.

[Rik]

Have to agree with your last remark, Bob.

[DorsetBoy]

Can someone confirm this or not.  Went to PC world to buy a different router and was told by salesperson that as ISP is IDNet I could only use a Netgear router.  Is this true, would a belkin or other make not work with IDNet?

Ann, PCW stands for Positively Clueless Wallies .........  if you know how to switch a PC on you are usually far better educated than the staff in that wonderful place, it is very easy to make them cry if you ask a really interesting question.

I dare not go back to our Poole branch, the last time I went in my nephew was with me, a staff member repeatedly came up to us and asked if they could help,no matter how many times they were told "no thanks, just browsing" back they came. At the last try my nephew said "Ok, I can't seem to find any sepia cartridges for my HP printer ..... if you don't have those do you have any sepia filters for a Humax scanner so I can scan direct in sepia colour?" ..........  " I'll just go and ask my supervisor" and off trots the unfortunate chap.

[Rik]

 

[annc]

Update:

Was down at daughter's yesterday.  Very helpful BT engineer turned up and found fault on the line.  Put it right (not sure I understand what was wrong but fine now).  

Before I left this morning the results of a BT speedtest were as follows:

download 4949
DSL Connection rate 6688 down
                              448 up
IP Profile 5500

Noticed from Speedtester.com that her pings were quite high at 75 - well they are much higher than mine.

Before he left the BT Engineer told me to contact IDNet as they may want to reprofile her connection.  I did this.  The person on support felt that it may not be neccessary.    I know that she is on ADSL Max.  I asked whether, now the connection is stable, she could be upgraded to ADSL 2+.  He felt it best left a few weeks as moving her on the exchange could cause further problems.  
Still getting a whole 5Mbs down is such a vast improvment on 500kps  

Ann

[Glenn]

Good to get a helpful BT engineer. 

[Steve]

Thank goodness BT found a fault

[annc]

Yep - so nice when someone goes out of their way to do a really good job.  He was very young but very thorough.  My daughters connection box is in a downstairs cupboard in the block of flats.  It was locked with a key and she had never been given one to access it.  The engineer went down to her letting agents in the town and picked up a key to the box - how's that for service    He was also so helpful explaining what he was doing (although a lot of it went over my head)  Anyway - he was really good. So - awards to BT on this occasion - hope he gets rapid promotions.

[Simon]

Thanks for letting us know, Ann.

[Rik]

Phew, say I. Glad it's sorted, Ann.