Noise problems on internal wiring

[Tanzanite]

I've read that already thanks.

I have a master socket downstairs with sky box in with a filter. Upstairs is the phone socket I use for the router , sky+ box and phone. They all have a filter. Well, it's one filter with 3 holes for sky box, phone and router thats the best filter, I've tried 4 lots.

I've disconnected everything except the phone when using the test socket, no noise or echo. Then I put the router in on it's own , nothing else in any phone socket. Sync speed is what it should be, pretty much.

[Rik]

The best filters I have used, Tanzy, have been the ADSL nation xf-1e. That said, what happens when you connect a phone and the router at the test socket, does the line remain stable, do you hear noises on the phone? If things are OK there, try the router in its normal place, with the same filter and phone. Still OK? Start plugging in other devices one at a time until you spot problems. If it's not OK with just the router and phone in your normal socket, then your wiring is the issue.

[Tanzanite]

The best filters I have used, Tanzy, have been the ADSL nation xf-1e. That said, what happens when you connect a phone and the router at the test socket, does the line remain stable, do you hear noises on the phone?

I found the ADSL nation worse than the one with 3 places and surge protected. Yes line is stable, no noises.

If things are OK there, try the router in its normal place, with the same filter and phone. Still OK? Start plugging in other devices one at a time until you spot problems. If it's not OK with just the router and phone in your normal socket, then your wiring is the issue.

No, not ok with same filter and phone in normal place. I've done things one at a time, still have problems. What wiring is interfering with it though as I've tested everything one at a time and have the problem with everything and one at a time.

Edit: Markup fixed

[Rik]

Hi Tanzy

When you use the test socket, you disconnect all your internal phone wiring and connect directly to the exchange pair. Once you replace the faceplate, all your telephone extension wiring is re-connected. If the problem occurs at this point, then your wiring is either picking up noise, in which case disconnecting the ring wire may help, or it has some bad joints on it, in which case it needs re-wiring.

I had a stable, fixed-rate connection for three months, then it just died. A BT engineer came out and tested at the exchange pair, the signal was fine. He fitted an NTE5 and tried from the master, no ADSL. He then re-worked the wiring, losing some of the sockets I no longer need (gone DECT, so don't need a socket in most rooms), and got me to the point where there was no difference between the test socket and the socket I normally use. Since then I've had no problems, except external ones.

From what you say, your problem is in your wiring, but I can't tell you if it's noise pickup or a physical connection issue - the best you can do is disconnect the ring wire and see if that helps.

[Tanzanite]

I have a DECT but only need one.

I think what I'll do is disconnect the ring wire as you've said, I've ordered ADSL nation filtered faceplates so put those in as well, well, my Dad will have a go! DorsetBoy is on standby to help if need be, can't believe how nice and helpful everyone on here are! 

If that all fails then maybe BT will have to have a look because  I really have tried everything else.
No doubt I shall be back next week with an update. Fingers crossed this sorts it out!

Thanks for everything, so grateful. You're all  LOL

[Rik]

Hi Tanzy

Don't fit a filtered faceplate in place of your current master socket. Unless I've misunderstood you, the master is downstairs and router upstairs? The filtered faceplate would take ADSL off the wire which runs upstairs.

You could use it in place of the upstairs socket, so that you don't need a filter there.

I was hoping Dorset might not be too far from you.

I don't know about angels, but we are here to help each other...

[Tanzanite]

Yes, the master socket downstairs has a sky box in it, thats it. Upstairs socket has router,  sky+ box and phone in.

Not sure what you mean by taking adsl off the wire. The noisy line is on both sockets (just not the test socket).

[Rik]

Hi Tanzy

The filtered face plate does the same job as a plug in filter. All your extension wiring will connect to the filtered side of the face plate and have no ADSL signal. Only the RJ11/ADSL socket on the faceplate would give your router a signal. The only way round that would be to run a cable from the filtered side up to where your router is.

[Tanzanite]

Ah, ok. So just fit the faceplate on the socket upstairs, gotcha.

[Rik]

That's it, Tanzy. 

[MoHux]

I don't know about such things, never having had one, but what is the REN number of a Sky-box??  Tanzy has two on the system.
One thing I haven't seen since the advent of ADSL, is what effect a too high a REN (used to be 4 max') would have on the connection.  Does removing the ring-wire disable/lower the REN (Ringer Equivalence Number)?

She said she plugged in to the test socket, but I thought the Master was downstairs??

Just thinking out loud really ................ 

[Rik]

Hi Mo

Sky boxes are rated as a REN of 1, but like most modern devices are actually a fraction of that. In addition, they don't actually respond to a ring signal, so may draw no current when one is present. Over-loading REN should have no effect on ADSL, since it only affects the ring voltage when it's on the line (though that, like the voice signal, would be presented to the router, which makes me think that routers/modems have a high-pass filter built in).

Afaik, Tanzy moved her router downstairs, unless I misunderstood her.

[Tanzanite]

Yes, I moved the router downstairs to the test socket just to test it.

[Tanzanite]

By the way, Rik, this new email addys. Will the idnetfreemail ones still be active or do I have to change them all again?

[Rik]

Hi Tanzy

Thanks for the confirmation on the test socket.

The older idnetfreemail addresses will still be functional, so you don't have to change anything, you just can't create any new addresses on that domain.

There may come a time, and I have no knowledge on this I'm just thinking aloud, when IDNet will feel that they need to cease the idnetfreemail domain, but I am sure they would give us plenty of warning. If you're anything like me, you choose the account you send on and people reply to it, so it's only critical where you register an address with a website etc.

[Tanzanite]

Yes, pretty much the same as you with email. Thanks for the info.

Just rang BT, they confirmed it's my problem and I'd have to pay a charge for them to fix it. They said it's a common problem with extension sockets and the extension socket needs rewiring and it'd be cheaper to get an electrician who knows about phone sockets to do it.So cancelled Mon's visit, shouldn't be too much of a problem with getting an electrician, my Dad knows loads of them. Maybe they can do the ring wire and fit the filtered faceplate at the same time.So getting there slowly!

Do wish people at BT wouldn't call me Ma'am though! Feel like a right old duffer 

[Rik]

Hi Tanzy

Yes, pretty much the same as you with email. Thanks for the info.

Nae bother.

Just rang BT, they confirmed it's my problem and I'd have to pay a charge for them to fix it. They said it's a common problem with extension sockets and the extension socket needs rewiring and it'd be cheaper to get an electrician who knows about phone sockets to do it.So cancelled Mon's visit, shouldn't be too much of a problem with getting an electrician, my Dad knows loads of them. Maybe they can do the ring wire and fit the filtered faceplate at the same time.So getting there slowly!

Be wary of electricians who don't know enough about phones. You need to ensure that they use the right cable, CW1308, and that they don't split the pairs. That said, the task itself is simple enough. You may find there are specialist companies in Yellow Pages for phone/network wiring - they seem to be a growth industry these days.

Do wish people at BT wouldn't call me Ma'am though! Feel like a right old duffer 

I have the same problem with 'Sir'. I keep thinking they must mean my father.

[Tanzanite]

I'll only be 30 in Sept, don't feel like a Ma'am just yet  First it was Lady when I was about 20, I used to look around thinking it must be someone else, looks like I'm past it now 

I did have a quick look under electricians and some of them say they do BT sockets, is that good enough? LOL

I need a man who's handy lmao.

[Rik]

I'll only be 30 in Sept, don't feel like a Ma'am just yet 

A mere stripling!

I did have a quick look under electricians and some of them say they do BT sockets, is that good enough? LOL

It should be, but remember to specify that cable you want, either CW1308 (phone wire) or possibly Category 5/5e network cable, which can give better performance.

I need a man who's handy lmao.

Don't we all, there's things I can do and things I'd really rather not do and then there's things I can't do...

[Tanzanite]

LOL funnily enough when I was around 17 people thought I looked much older and I used to get into clubs for over 25's  Nowadays they think I look younger!

I think my moan on the phone to BT did something. 45mins ago I had a BT engineer turn up (and on a Sat too!) he had a quick look, and confirmed I need a new extension socket upstairs due to faulty wiring, he recommended an ex BT man who could do it at a really good price (approx £35), he also fixed the wire outside that was flapping in the wind for free.

Though when he opened up the master socket then put it back , my sync speed went plummeting down to 160kbps  so when he went, mum opened it back up, gave the wires a wiggle, put it back and sync speed shot up to 4416 kbps lol the best it's ever been since the noise on the line, though of course I'll have to wait a few days for the actual speed to go back up though I doubt it will due to disconnections. It's soooooooooooo slow, it's just under dial up speed now 

[Rik]

LOL funnily enough when I was around 17 people thought I looked much older and I used to get into clubs for over 25's  Nowadays they think I look younger!

Which all goes to show that Einstein was right all along.

I think my moan on the phone to BT did something. 45mins ago I had a BT engineer turn up (and on a Sat too!) he had a quick look, and confirmed I need a new extension socket upstairs due to faulty wiring, he recommended an ex BT man who could do it at a really good price (approx £35), he also fixed the wire outside that was flapping in the wind for free.

Did he say what the fault was?

Though when he opened up the master socket then put it back , my sync speed went plummeting down to 160kbps  so when he went, mum opened it back up, gave the wires a wiggle, put it back and sync speed shot up to 4416 kbps lol the best it's ever been since the noise on the line

Well, that suggests loose wires or poor contacts. It might be worth getting a new master socket fitted, or at least draw the attention of the ex-BT guy to what happened.

[Tanzanite]

He just said that the extension socket is faulty (the wires anyway) and I need a new one. Common problem apparently.

I think the ex Bt man said he would fit a new master socket and use a filtered faceplate (had to cancel my order for the one's I ordered yesterday) and do something to it that would make the new extension upstairs filtered too. Something like that anyway LOL

He's coming Tues afternoon and said my internet will fly when he's finished with it  Sorting broadband probs is his favourite job. Sounds like he knows what he's doing.

By the way, call me Eve 

[Rik]

Hi Eve

Sounds like you've got hold of someone good there, I'll be interested to hear how your figures are once he's done the work (and also what he actually ends up doing). The problem with the wiring that most of us have is that it was installed long before ADSL was thought of, and while it was fine for voice, it's just not good enough for ADSL. Of course, Max tests things even more. I want fibre to the home.

[Tanzanite]

I'll try and take notes to give you a full report on what he's done 

Well fibre's meant to be good for every body (sorry bad joke!)

[Rik]

I expect more than notes, Eve. I want full diagrams, photographs and maybe a movie!

As to fibre, welcome to the club!