BT Content Connect service faces 'two-tier net' claims

[DorsetBoy]

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/technology-12112389

BT has introduced a controversial service that some say could allow broadband providers to create a "two-tier internet".

Content Connect, as it is known, allows Internet Service Providers (ISPs) that use BT's network to charge content firms for high-speed delivery of video.

It could spell the end of so-called "net neutrality", where all traffic on the net is treated equally.

Critics say it will also reduce competition for consumers.

"This is a sea change in the way that content is delivered by ISPs," Jim Killock of the net freedom campaign organisation, the Open Rights Group, told BBC News.

"It is essentially them saying: 'Rather than delivering whatever content is on the internet as best we can, here are our services that we will deliver through our own network.'"

He said the result could be a "fundamental shift" from consumers choosing what video and gaming services they buy on the internet to "buying services from the internet to bundled services from ISPs".

"This would reduce competition and take investment away from internet companies - that would be bad for everyone."....... (more)

[Technical Ben]

Hmmm. No problem if this means you pay for "Sky over the internet" or "BT vision on demand". But it is a problem if Youtube is charged just for the fact they have video.
There is an easy way around it. Convert your video to ascii, then reconvert it on the pc. Then your not charge the "video" tax, if that is what it becomes. 

[Rik]

Presumably, this will impose itself on all BT-dependent ISPs by default?

[SSK]

There is an easy way around it. Convert your video to ascii, then reconvert it on the pc. Then your not charge the "video" tax, if that is what it becomes. 

Isn't that what we 'oldies' might call 'usenet'? 
Maybe this will see the rebirth of newsgroups.

Sean

[Rik]

Good thought, Sean, it's quite likely, isn't it.

[Glenn]

Does this mean, BT Vision will have to pay BT Wholesale millions to transmit it's content?

[Rik]

Well, that would be the theory, but I'm sure they'll work around it.

[pctech]

So we're charged for a data 'circuit' that runs at any speed it feels like any time of day and on top of that they are going to impose QoS.

QoS has been on the cards since 21CN (or S21T as I prefer to call it) started to be rolled out but BT have been looking how to commercialise the QoS features already built into the Cisco kit they've been buying and now they've found it.

[Rik]

Welcome to the world of monopoly, Mitch.

[kinmel]

Isn't that what we 'oldies' might call 'usenet'? 
Maybe this will see the rebirth of newsgroups.

Sean

They never went away, many of us never moved on to P2P 

[Rik]

It's odd, though, that most ISPs, it seems, ceased to offer a newsgroup service, isn't it.

[pctech]

Suppose I'll have to start looking into LLU.

[David]

For the uninitiated like me .... I dont watch videos or play games so what difference would folk like me  see if any 

C.mon dont keep it to yourselves 

[Rik]

It shouldn't affect you, David, it seems to be targeted at iPlayer etc.

[David]

I will shut up then 

[Rik]

You?? 

[pctech]

Just put a mail into Zen about it, someone had already asked on their forum but its a bit dead there.

[Rik]

You want me to come across and shake things up a bit, Mitch?

[pctech]

 

Already suggested they need some mods as there was quite a bit of spam over the holidays.

There's only me and a couple of others that post regularly.

[Rik]

That's daft, you can't safely leave a forum to run itself, as we discovered on Sunday.

[pctech]

Indeed Rik.

[Technical Ben]

For the uninitiated like me .... I dont watch videos or play games so what difference would folk like me  see if any 

C.mon dont keep it to yourselves 

As mentioned, things like Iplayer. What I am worried about, is being charge for what type of packet my computer sends. As far as I care, I am sending ones and zeros from my modem. I do not want to be charged for different types of ones or zeros. If they want to charge me for quicker services, higher pings, or longer use, I'm happy. If they want to charge me for using a MP4 video instead of an Apple Quicktime one, I'm furious! 

[pctech]

I think we are already charged too much for 'net access in the UK considering what we actually get.

[Rik]

As with everything else, Mitch.

[pctech]

If a crippled connection becomes the norm I'll go back to that BT owned Yorkshire outfit as 6.50 is more than enough.

[Rik]

Tea anyone?

[David]

two sugars for me please 

[pctech]

 

[esh]

I still use newsgroups a bit. You have to pay for a vaguely reasonable service these days, but it's not that expensive at all.

I remember the days of UUENCODE on Compuserve. I am glad they are gone though

[Gary]

I'm lookimg into Xilo as a reseller now using CPW LLU at my exchange they dont shape or do any of the nasties that CPW do, much greater speeds and I pay a bit less, I will lose my Phone to them with  no plan but with what i save £20 or so its worth it. BT based ISP's are just not really worth the value it seems, and its not even their fault 

[pctech]

You don't need to move your phone Gary, just the ADSL (Xilo don't offer phone service anyway) and I certainly don't intend to move my phone lines away from IDNet.

Problem for me will be that ADSL2+ runs like a dog on my line (I tried O2 for a month and got about 2.5 but it kept having to resync).

In any event I'd rather not have to move as I'm on a negotiated deal with Zen and am very happy with the service, both from technical performance but also technical support.

[Gary]

You don't need to move your phone Gary, just the ADSL (Xilo don't offer phone service anyway) and I certainly don't intend to move my phone lines away from IDNet.

Problem for me will be that ADSL2+ runs like a dog on my line (I tried O2 for a month and got about 2.5 but it kept having to resync).

In any event I'd rather not have to move as I'm on a negotiated deal with Zen and am very happy with the service, both from technical performance but also technical support.

Its full LLU Mitch, your phone has to go along with your broadband.

http://community.xilo.net/threads/cpw-opal-broadband-and-phone-packages.836/

[pctech]

I stand corrected then Gary, sorry.

I'll have to look at something else then as don't really want my phone running on CPW.

[Gary]

I stand corrected then Gary, sorry.

I'll have to look at something else then as don't really want my phone running on CPW.

Its not CPW. Xilo just use there equipment on a one month rolling contract with a cease fee, £25 all in for up to 24mb and you just pay for you calls on top not bad really, CPW have nothing to do with call costs or the package, its just using the equipment at the exchange that's it.

[pctech]

I'll hang fire and see how its implemented.

Will be interesting to see what IDNet do.

[Gary]

Will be interesting to see what IDNet do.

Nothing probably they can do Mitch, who knows, I just know why should I spend £24 a month getting a 8128 connection then telephone on top when I can get maybe 12meg with a 50GB download for £25 phone included. I'll need to think on this.

[Technical Ben]

Been thinking the same Gary.
At least a £5 saving if not more for me. Plus up either 16mb or 24mb possible (depending on package) and unlimited downloads. So more for less. As long as it "does exactly what it says on the tin" it's win win.
It's just a fear of "it will completely crash out" that stops me swapping right now.

[pctech]

Here's the BT blurb on the product http://www.btwholesale.com/pages/static/Products/Broadband/Wholesale_Content_Connect.html

Looks like payday for the ISPs.

[Rik]

I'll be interested to see how the smaller ISPs react, Mitch.

[pctech]

I'm not paying an additional fee to access it, put it that way.

[Rik]

I wouldn't need to, as I've never quite worked out a need for watching TV via the net unless I'm travelling.

[pctech]

useful if you work shifts and forget to set stuff to record.

And of course there's Youtube.

[Technical Ben]

I wouldn't need to, as I've never quite worked out a need for watching TV via the net unless I'm travelling.

If I missed it! (Watch Again )

[Gary]

Been thinking the same Gary.
At least a £5 saving if not more for me. Plus up either 16mb or 24mb possible (depending on package) and unlimited downloads. So more for less. As long as it "does exactly what it says on the tin" it's win win.
It's just a fear of "it will completely crash out" that stops me swapping right now.

I have the same fear but its very tempting I must admit, and its the only way I'll ever get decent speeds as we will not get WBC of FTTC in the foreseeable future, also no more worries about  stupid BT profiles.

[Gary]

I wouldn't need to, as I've never quite worked out a need for watching TV via the net unless I'm travelling.

Well if I miss a program, or Justina is watching something in one room I can catch up on what I want on iPlayer, also I spend a lot of time on youtube, I really enjoy some peoples channels.

[pctech]

Zen Technical Support have said they've no plans to implement it for the moment at least so am staying put as I'm in the position that I trust both IDNet and Zen so would be loathed to move.

[Gary]

Zen Technical Support have said they've no plans to implement it for the moment at least so am staying put as I'm in the position that I trust both IDNet and Zen so would be loathed to move.

If Idnet don't implement it all well and good, I trust IDnet and like them, I would loathe to have to move, the extra speed would be good though  but sometimes don't fix what is not broken comes into play.

[Lance]

I wouldn't need to, as I've never quite worked out a need for watching TV via the net unless I'm travelling.

Some of us don't have DVRs either!

[Rik]

There is that, I guess. Having both Sky & Freeview recorders, I really don't need anything else.

[Tacitus]

If Idnet don't implement it all well and good, I trust IDnet and like them, I would loathe to have to move, the extra speed would be good though  but sometimes don't fix what is not broken comes into play.

I think we need to wait and see.  iDNet are probably doing some deep thinking even as we speak.  We've still heard nothing further about the BT disconnect fiasco from late last year, so what (if anything) they'll be offering in the form of alternative suppliers remains to be seen.  This latest BT attempt to stitch everyone up is probably not high on iDNet's list of priorities at present.

Whilst an alternative would be good although probably not for me since my LLU choices are Orange or TT, whether they can make the sums add up to a viable business proposition is another matter. 

That said offering LLU via CPW wholesale would cover a large part of the country compared to (say) Be.  Certainly if that offered a more flexible set of tools for line management, it's something I would look at.

[pctech]

Looking into the product further it appears that BT want in on a market that is pretty much dominated by Akamai and Limelight Networks.

Akamai embed their edge servers into an ISP's network (I know Zen have quite a few) while Limelight took a different approach and built their own large storage and distribution network all based on fibre optic connections.

Deal here seems to be that BT divert requests for video content away from an ISP's hostlinks thereby saving them money on transfer, in return BT and the ISP take a slice of the revenue from the content provider.

Meanwhile the ADSL customer is still subject to a transfer allowance and appropriate additional charges unless they pay an additional charge for the service.

There is a suggestion on ThinkBroadband that the service has really been cooked up for BT Retail and it is only being offered supposedly openly to satisfy regulation.

[Rik]

The last sentence would not surprise me in the least, Mitch.

[pctech]

Their build out programme will have to go some to compete with Akamai.

[Tacitus]

Their build out programme will have to go some to compete with Akamai.

Some interesting comments here.

[pctech]

Trefor seems to echo a lot of the points made in the thread on TBB.

I don't think BT has a chance against Akamai.

[Technical Ben]

Trefor seems to echo a lot of the points made in the thread on TBB.

I don't think BT has a chance. against Akamai.

I fixed it for you. 

[pctech]

Thanks Ben.

[Technical Ben]

Your welcome. Not often I get thanked for breaking fixing things.