FTTC now available, want to move from SKY, few questions....

[shorn]

Hi all. I have been watching the Openreach engineers around my way doing work for the last few months, and have now seen that FTTC is available in my area! Thank god as I am over 5KM away from the exchange, and currently get about 1.5mb connection. I've also found speeds being a bit slower during peak hours, which, when I don't have much to play with, can be crippling. 720p youtube or iPlayer content is a no-no, even on a good day.

So initially I though BT would be my only option, and I was VERY unenthusiastic about them being my ISP, when, with a bit of net research, I cam across IDNet. I like the look of the packages.

So, i'm almost ready to order, But just wanted to check a few things. Am I right in thinking that it doesn't matter who my telephone provider is? i.e I can stay with sky, and just cancel broadband with them, get my MAC code and move to IDNet?

I'm also a tiny but concerned about my current wiring at my house. When I moved in I had one single phone line. This came in from outside, but was connected directly to the wall, it ran down a length of wire a few meters long and was in a normal socket. I'm guessing this is the master socket. I do not have another socket anywhere else in the house.
I was just concerned as the installation guidance states that there cannot be any extension.

Also it states on the order page that someone can be out within 5 days to install/activate it. I have to give Sky 31 days, but can I still go ahead and have IDNet connected within that time (obviously still paying for the final month with Sky)

Also it states that I can supply my own router. I have the standard Netgear Sky router at the moment and an Apple Airport Extreme. Is the supplied (at cost) router from IDNet the best option, or would people recommend purchasing my own, any recommendations? (I got the Airport Extreme as the Sky router doesn't play nice with the iPhone 4, so I'm guessing that if the new router needed for IDNet has 802.11n, then I might be able to do away with the Airport if I so fancied?)

Many thanks for any feedback. I'm keeping my fingers crossed that all will go well. I moved from a rented flat with 20MB ADSL, out to our first house, in a semi rural area. I had a slight shock to the system when I found out what our speeds would be out here, so I am sure you can imagine how much i've anticipated Fibre since it was announced in our area!!

[Anton]

Hi,

I moved from Be a few months back, but the move from Sky should be more or less the same, so i offer my £0.02 bellow! i would add that I'm just an IDNet customer, I don't work for them or have any connection beyond paying them each month.

> So initially I though BT would be my only option, and I was VERY unenthusiastic about them being my ISP, when, with a bit of net
> research, I cam across IDNet. I like the look of the packages.

Personal view is avoid BT at ALL costs - do some mooching on their support site and you'll see just what a hash they've been making of their service over the last 3 months or so. This gives you a flavour...

http://community.bt.com/t5/BB-in-Home/INFINITY-Netwrok-wide-Issues-IMPORTANT/td-p/81365

Suffice to say, IDNet and Zen customers saw little if any impact, Infinity customers were up in arms. IDNet are a little dearer than BT, but like everything else you get what you pay for.

> So, i'm almost ready to order, But just wanted to check a few things. Am I right in thinking that it doesn't matter who my telephone
> provider is? i.e I can stay with sky, and just cancel broadband with them, get my MAC code and move to IDNet?

I may be wrong but I believe you need a BT line, so you'll have to leave Sky Talk. Sales will help you but IDNet offer voice lines or you could do what I do and have your line from BT and IDNet providing the broadband. In effect you'll just have Sky TV and none of the bolt ons.

> I'm also a tiny but concerned about my current wiring at my house. When I moved in I had one single phone line. This came in from
> outside, but was connected directly to the wall, it ran down a length of wire a few meters long and was in a normal socket. I'm
> guessing this is the master socket. I do not have another socket anywhere else in the house. I was just concerned as the installation
> guidance states that there cannot be any extension.

I don't think that's of any concern It sounds like standard "rural" post wiring - and internal wiring shouldn't be a problem as the engineer fits a faceplate that isolates any extension wiring when he does your install.

> Also it states on the order page that someone can be out within 5 days to install/activate it. I have to give Sky 31 days, but can I
> still go ahead and have IDNet connected within that time (obviously still paying for the final month with Sky)

When I migrated from Be, I was without service for 10 minutes. It no doubt could be longer, but the engineer disconnects the line to Sky at the same time as they install the Fibre service so I don't see why it should be longer (that said my install was *very* smooth).

I did exactly what you are proposing - used my MAC early and was turned off and on at the same time but I was BT line to BT line, moving your line from Sky to BT may complicate things.

<snip router choices>

You need buy nothing. All you need is your existing Airport Extreme - it plugs straight into the BT modem, so you don't need to buy anything, your existing kit will be fine. The only thing for you to worry about is which model of Airport you have - if it's one of the dual band ones it's perfect - if it's one of the older (say 3 year+ old) Airports, it will struggle to keep pace with the 40mbps service. it will maintain around 30mbps but for the full 40mpbs you'll need one of the newer ones.

The faster models are MB053LL/A MB763LL/A and MC340LL/A.

FWIW I'd rate the Airport as a far better piece of kit than the Netgear, but them I use Apple throughout the house so I might just be a bit biased. ;-)
Configuration is easy too - just connect up once the engineer says you're live and then run Airport Utility. Select the PPPoE checkbox and tell it your username and password when it asks for them.

--
Anton.

[Glenn]

  shorn

[.Griff.]

As long as you have a physical BT phone line then it doesn't matter if the voice aspect is with another reseller. I was with Talk Talk when I joined IDNet so the fact you get your voice aspect provided by Sky should make no difference at all.

[Anton]

As long as you have a physical BT phone line then it doesn't matter if the voice aspect is with another reseller. I was with Talk Talk when I joined IDNet so the fact you get your voice aspect provided by Sky should make no difference at all.

Were you LLU unbundled though? I'm not sure if that makes a difference or not, but (as far as I'm aware) the physical line is owned by the LLU provider so BT are a bit limited as to what they can do with it?

[.Griff.]

Were you LLU unbundled though?

Yes. With Be.

However thinking about it some more didn't Sky start offering "fully unbundled" services where they used their own equipment for both the voice and data aspect of the line? If so then granted the OP may have a problem.

In my case Be only unbundled the data aspect of the SMPF.

[Anton]

Didn't Sky start offering "fully unbundled" services

I have a feeling you're right and I think OpenReach then operate the line for them as owners. I'm pretty sure Sky offer two levels of LLU (one voice only and another line unbundled).

Question for OP is who invoices him for Line Rental? If it's BT, he's good to go, if it's on his Sky invoice things could be more complex.

(mutter mutter bl&*dy Murdoch...) ;-)

[shorn]

Hi there. Thanks for the reply.

So we agree on avoiding BT, thats good.

With regards to the phone line. It gives an option on the sign up page to "keep my current telephone provider" - This is why I assumed that it didn't matter who you were with. There is also nothing on the website that states you must have a BT line. I assumed that the fibre was separate to standard ADSL so your broadband and telephone were separate, therefore it doesn't matter if you have different providers? Again its just assumptions!

Thats good news about my current kit, as the Airport Extreme is one of the latest dual band models. (Only a few months old) and I got it as I knew it had internal revisions over the last AE. However I'm a tad confused as to what you mean by it plugs into the BT Modem. I do not have a BT modem, just a Sky Router. (Netgear DG834GT IIRC.)

Think I'm gonna call Sky and get my MAC code. Will sign up online and speak to sales on Monday, check all is OK with the line.


EDIT: OK typed the above and realised that there were a few more replies....

To answer another question raised, yes I get both Talk package and pay Sky for line rental. Guessing I could just sign up for the lot with IDNet?

[Glenn]

If you line is LLU IDNet will accept the migration http://forums.thinkbroadband.com/which_isp/t/2654786-re-list-of-isps-that-accept-llu-mac-keys.html

That was for IPstream, so they may have changed the way they are handled.

[shorn]

OK, whats the easiest way to tell if my line is LLU?

[Glenn]

I think the quickest way will be to call Sky and ask.

[Anton]

Thats good news about my current kit, as the Airport Extreme is one of the latest dual band models. (Only a few months old) and I got it as I knew it had internal revisions over the last AE. However I'm a tad confused as to what you mean by it plugs into the BT Modem. I do not have a BT modem, just a Sky Router. (Netgear DG834GT IIRC.)

The sky router is no good for FTTC. When BT come to install you, they'll bring with them a new modem, specifically for VDSL. The Sky router is then disconnected and disposed of.

The Modem BT install gives you a single WAN port. The WAN port of the Airport Extreme plugs into that.

You have no option but to use the BT supplied modem, it's integral to their service. You do have to provide a router though (I.E. your Airport) as otherwise you'll just have a single socket to connect a single Machine to.

Added Dodgy and very poorly done schematic... ;-)

[davidthornton]

A few things...

i) I'm unsure about the situation relating to broadband from any provider when paying line rental to anyone other than BT Retail. A friend of mine has Sky TV, pays his phone line rental to Sky and has Sky Talk for calls but he used to have Bethere for broadband. He's now switched that to Sky. When I was with Bulldog for Broadband and phone line rental, it was suggested on thinkbroadband.com to contact BT and do a "request to doner" whereby BT Retail would take my line back under their control. That is what I did and how I finished with Bulldog. I was then able to keep the voice element with BT and have the broadband element with anyone I wanted. I'd like some more clarification on this myself.

ii) It is possible to have Sky Talk and keep phone line rental with BT Retail. I know several people who have. In relation to (i) I am not sure about paying line rental to anyone other than BT Retail if you want broadband from an unrelated provider.

iii) If you are on Sky Broadband, excluding their Connect product, you'll be LLU.

[shorn]

This is looking good!
I understand now that the engineer will bring a BT Modem, and I will connect that into my Airport Extreme. Sky router gets retired.

I have checked on SamKnows and it states that my area is enabled for Sky LLU. I know for sure that I am not using there connect package, so I will happily take a stab at the fact that I am on LLU.
WIll be phoning very shortly for my MAC code, with an order for IDNet going through very shortly after the MAC is received. Anyone know how long a MAC code takes to come through?

[davidthornton]

This is looking good!
I understand now that the engineer will bring a BT Modem, and I will connect that into my Airport Extreme. Sky router gets retired.

I have checked on SamKnows and it states that my area is enabled for Sky LLU. I know for sure that I am not using there connect package, so I will happily take a stab at the fact that I am on LLU.
WIll be phoning very shortly for my MAC code, with an order for IDNet going through very shortly after the MAC is received. Anyone know how long a MAC code takes to come through?

MAC code request time depends how how quick the supplier is at progressing it. I think there is a rule that they must supply it within a certain period. I forget if it it is 7 days or what. You might want to look on skyuser.co.uk and see if it's being discussed there in relation to Sky.

Please let us know if you do/are able to keep paying your phone line rental to Sky, but can successfully switch your broadband element out to an unrelated provider (i.e. IDnet), or whether you are forced to switch your phone line rental back to BT Retail (which would allow you to keep Sky Talk), or pick IDnet for your voice calls.

[shorn]

On the phone to Sky now, confirmed it was LLU. Just processing MAC code now.....

(I guess I'll see whether it is ok when the order goes through to IDNet and they process it!)

[shorn]

Woohoo, MAC code provided straight away over the phone!

[Anton]

On the phone to Sky now, confirmed it was LLU. Just processing MAC code now.....

(I guess I'll see whether it is ok when the order goes through to IDNet and they process it!)

Blimey - talk about striking while the iron's hot!

You're as excited as I was now! ;-)

PS - What exchange are you on?

[shorn]

Order placed with IDNet. I'm on the TOTTON exchange.

Very Excited! 

[shorn]

This is what I currently get. I'm keeping all fingers crossed, and hopefully soon I'll see a bit of a shift!

[Anton]

And this is mine...

Oh, and when I just ran this, My eldest was streaming a 720p rental on the Apple TV and my beloved is downloading a moving from iTunes.

Life is good... ;-)

[shorn]

Very nice.

To be honest I don't think I'm gonna get that fast. The availability checkers all say 26 Down and 5.5 up. Still a helluva gain over what I have now.

My move to Apple products started with the iPhone. I then got an iMac (given to me, can you believe!), and upgrading the broadband will help with the AppleTV that I purchased, so I could do away with my Media PC. (Windows will finally be gone from my life!)
This should make browsing more enjoyable on my much anticipated iPad 2 when its finally released!

I know people complain that their products are expensive, and they are, however I remind people that I'm running a 5 year old iMac, with all the latest software an updates. It fly's and gives me no issues whatsoever. I'm pleased to be finally (hopefully) treating it to some decent internet speeds!

[Steve]

    shorn

[Ray]

  shorn.

[Rik]

Welcome to the forum, shorn.

Nice answers from the rest of you guys, have a karma too.