HELP!! Network => 2wire and Linksys (x3) at arts co-operative in Bristol

[mulch]

Hey guys n gals...

My first post here... some background information for you firstly...

I am in the process of setting up a network at our artist studios in Bristol UK. The building is quite complex and the walls are thick in places, but I think I have managed to work out the best areas to sit an initial install of wireless routers and switches. I have laid cables ready for everything to work but as you will discover as you read, I have pulled all the routers back to try and test them in one room.

Our ISP is currently BT Business Broadband (forgive us, not my choice) and they have supplied the 2wire 2700hgv modem.

The service was ok in the first month and then I started laying out the network and problems started to happen. Connection to the ISP dropping out and although bandwidth was relatively high (average 8mbpsDownspeed), browsers would freeze in mid-load and we initially thought it was BTs fault. When I started to lay more network down, in the form of another wireless router, the network pretty much stumbled to a spasmodic halt. After much wrestling with BT (who never once asked whether I had other routers in the network) it dawned on me that we could be having some router conflict issues. So, now... I have unplugged everything and we are back to square one. Primary router seems relatively happy and seems to have been achieving a consistent connection to isp for about 4 days now. However, i am now in the position of trying to get the network up and running. I understand this means getting the routers setup correctly. If anyone can help it would be great. Here are some more details.

We have anything up to a maximum of about 25 devices connected (rarely). On average though, about 9-12 PCs using a combination of OS's - Apple , XP, Windows7, Vista, iphones and android phones. Ideally, we want the linksys routers to provide wireless zones and allow us to plug into the back with CAT5 if someone does not have wireless.

Here is as concise a 'map' of our existing network as I can write down.

1 - Primary Router (BT's 2wire hgv2700)
IP - 192.168.1.254
Pretty much all default settings except for I have turned off Openzone and BTfusion. Note that the DHCP range is from 1.64-1.253
As far as i am aware, this router is responsible for DHCP.

2 - Secondary Access Point - Linksys WRT54GL WhiteRussian (RC5)
Kernel Version    Linux version 2.4.30 (nbd@ux-2y02) (gcc version 3.4.4 (OpenWrt-1.0)) #1 Sun Mar 26 19:02:04 CEST 2006
IP - LANside - 192.168.1.2
WAN - Connection Type : disabled
This router is fed from Primary Router and cable feeds into port 1 here (not using the WAN 'internet' port)

Now then... I want to stop there because i dont want this to get too confusing. So to summarise, the finished network will ALSO include an 8port switch and 2 more Linksys Routers hanging off the main router. For the purposes of testing this and making it a step by step simple operation to make best use of any help anyone here can offer, I have stripped down the network so the 2 items listed in bold above are the only ones active at the moment. All other routers are unplugged for now.

If anyone can hold my hand through the basics here it would be greatly appreciated. I have very basic knowledge but i am methodical and patient. And if i can get you any more info to make helping easier, just ask!!

yours hopefully - mulch

PS - almost forgot to mention the current symptom - so... I am currently getting good internet connection from Linksys (via ethernet) but not via wireless (even though I can SEE the linksys via wireless)

[mulch]

JUST NOTICED that the Wireless Status on the Linksys currently says:
eth1      IEEE 802.11-DS  ESSID:"IC-RK1" 
          Mode:Master  Frequency:2.412 GHz  Access Point: 00:16:B6:D9:34:2C   
          Tx-Power:19 dBm   
          RTS thr=2347 B   Fragment thr=2346 B   
          Encryption key:off


not sure if that helps or not.
:]

[Simon]

I can't help with the tech stuff, sorry, but I'm sure someone will be around soon with some advice, or questions!

[mulch]

thanks... makes me chuckle and wonder how on earth you got so many posts and not picked up tech knowledge!!!

mulch :]

[Steve]

 

Not an expert either but it looks right, bridge routers are outside DHCP range of the primary, DHCP . I guess DHCP and NAT are off on the secondary routers. Not sure why the wireless isn't working puzzled by that one. My other thought was to link the bridge secondary routers via the switch to the primary in my mind you should get better throughput from the primary router that way.

[mulch]

cheers guys.... not totally sure what you are getting at there Steve. i am probably much more out of depth than you... I have yet to spy any Nat settings on the Linksys here in the office (although I notice the 2wire has Nat settings - i dont properly understand implications of these yet)

anyway... I shall come up with some solutions influenced by your suggestions and post them here sometime soon so you can check whether i understand your ideas..

In the meantime i notice the 2wire seems to have stopped providing wireless...generally this is a problem with the Linksys routers but now it has happened to the 2wire!!! (nothing really surprises me now though!!)... This Could have something to do with me plugging in another of the Linksys Routers down the hall and seeing if i could connect to internet... (just troubleshooting and experimenting)... cable to that Linksys seems fine (because i can unplg the ethernet feed from Linksys and plug direct into laptop and internet is right there)... but cant get anything through that one... cant even get onto the console!!! (192.168.1.2 doesnt work for that one down the hall)

anyway/// i am loathe to power down the 2wire but perhaps tomorrow... i am tired... bed calls... nice to meet you all...

mulch :]

[mulch]

mornin all!!

ok. here is an interesting symptom.

Just booted the desktop here in the office and couldnt connect for some reason.

Ran an 'ipconfig' and noticed that the default gateway was 192.168.1.2.

This is the IP of the Linksys (i forgot that it was sat here hanging off the 2wire via ethernet cable.)

I am not sure why the linksys would be acknowledged as the gateway in any case with this setup. after all I disabled all WAN settings within it..... errr..... perhaps its a 2wire setting that would look to another router to gain WAN connection??? i am confused!!



anyway. I disabled the network adapter and unplugged the linksys. now gateway back to 192.168.1.254 (the 2wire)

this may be pointing to the main problem somehow???

mulch :]

[Ray]

  mulch.

[Steve]

Is the dhcp server turned off on the Linksys? Your original description sounded ok with the 2wire acting as wan access and DHCP server, your secondary router (although router is not the best term) is purely acting as a wifi/ethernet access point , all functions disabled dhcp,firewall etc and you gave it a static IP outside of the primary DHCP server. There may be some oddities with the 2wire which I'm not familiar with, This setup normally works,currently I'm using a Billion 7800N with a Apple Extreme base station connected via ethernet cable.The Billion is the DHCP server and the AEBS is in bridge mode,static IP and provides me with an additional 5GHZ wifi Network. In my case AEBS TCP/IP settings are static IP 192.168.1.99 (outside of DHCP) subnet mask 255.255.255.0 router(gateway) address 192.168.1.254. No modifications to the Billion settings were made.

[Rik]

Welcome to the forum, Mulch.

[mulch]

Hey Steve... thanks for info...

Well there is no specific option for me to turn off the DHCP server in the linksys router. I am assuming the closest setting to this is within the NETWORK // WAN Configuration menu, The drop-down options for Connection Type are : None / DHCP / Static IP / PPPoE.... i have selected NONE.

From your post I will try and mimic those AEBS settings.... because currently i have the Linksys setup as an Access Point. - doing this may not help me, but  i like experimenting...

A vaguely related question - is it necessary that the router nearest the WAN (the primary) manages the DHCP leasing? If not then feasibly i could try making one of the linksys the DHCP server? Sounds like complex territory to me... especially since i cannot even bring up the console on the other two Linksys...... (but THATS a problem for another day i think!)

Anyway... onwards to discover more!!!

mulch :]

[psp83]

This might help you out : http://www.voipmechanic.com/turning-off-dhcp-wireless-router.htm

[mulch]

Thanks psp83...

however, these Linksys routers have been installed with White Russian OpenWRT... i am not really sure of the intention of the person originally setting this up, but either way, the menu system is not similar to the one indicated in the link you sent... There is no menu called simply DHCP... interesting reading nonetheless...

mulch :]

ps - i still cannot connect to the 2wire from my Dell XP laptop, however, the iMAC G5 desktop seems happy connecting through 'airport'....

anyway... back to the mission....

[mulch]

while thinking about it... perhaps its worth restoring these Linksys back to factory settings... any comments about that process?

Ive heard mixed opinions about being able to achieve this...

These Linksys Routers are - Linksys WRT54GL v1.1
Wireless-G Broadband Router with 4-port switch
all with Serial Numbers starting thus: CL7B1

WHITE RUSSIAN details from Router Info page of the Linksys console:
Firmware Version - WHITE RUSSIAN (RC5)
Kernel Version - Linux version 2.4.30 (nbd@ux-2y02) (gcc version 3.4.4 (OpenWrt-1.0)) #1 Sun Mar 26 19:02:04 CEST 2006
Current Date/Time - Sat Jan 1 02:39:47 UTC 2000

[mulch]

Hey Steve... just realised something.... when you referred to 'give it a static IP outside of the primary DHCP server'... do you mean make the 3rd number (as in the '1') a different number?

for example, should i name this first linksys 192.168.2.2 for example? if not then it is certainly out of the range of the 2wire because the 2wire (primary) is ranged at 1.64 and above...

mulch :]

[Steve]

No the static IP was correct. I think your setup is beyond my abilities as if I'm correct your running multiple DHCP servers on the same network. My setup essentially converts the secondary router into an ethernet switch with a wifi access point.



Any use http://wiki.openwrt.org/doc/recipes/bridgedclient#step.2disable.the.dhcp.server


http://martybugs.net/wireless/openwrt/

https://forum.openwrt.org/viewtopic.php?id=4427&p=1

[MisterW]

for example, should i name this first linksys 192.168.2.2 for example? if not then it is certainly out of the range of the 2wire because the 2wire (primary) is ranged at 1.64 and above...

No , you are correct with it at 192.168.1.2. It must be in the same subnet 192.168.1.x as the 2700 but outside of its dhcp range I.e < 64. I think Steve has hit the nail on the head, you need to disable the dhcp server on the linksys, and just let the 2700 be the dhcp server. Steve's first link show how to disable it.

[mulch]

brilliant....

however, how do i write to the router?>?? the instructions ask me to enter code!!! not sure how to do that... i will have a deeper look and see where i enter the codes...

thanks guys... hopefully getting somewhere...

mulch :]

[Steve]

Presumably via telnet

[mulch]

cool...
i am looking into it now....
at first i thought i would need to enter code from the command prompt console!!
Telnet you say... ok... im already confused!!! but persevering...
The instructions Steve linked to are as follows:
*******************

Step 2: Disable the DHCP server

Since the device is operating as client in another network and relays all communication from the associated Access Point to its LAN hosts, the local DHCP server should be disabled to avoid collisions.

Edit /etc/config/dhcp and set the predefined LAN DHCP pool to ignore:
config 'dhcp' 'lan' option 'interface' 'lan' option 'start' '100' option 'limit' '150' option 'leasetime' '12h' option 'ignore' '1'

Apply the change by restarting dnsmasq:
root@OpenWrt:~# /etc/init.d/dnsmasq restart

*************************
Very confused!!   Mulch :]

[Steve]

The file modifications can be performed by Telnet/SSH, the text editor 'vi' is installed by openwrt but in my brief linux experience I didn't find it easy. You should be able to see all the files  and edit via WinSCP

Instructions for Telnet/SSH are here http://mattventura.net/openwrt-stuff/ plus use of PuTTY and WinSCP ( it's GUI and easy to use.) Obviously you telnet/SSH into the static IP you assigned earlier.

"First, you need to connect to the router. By default, on 8.09 wireless should be enabled, but it will be disabled for earlier versions. So if you don't see a wifi network called "OpenWrt," grab an Ethernet cable and connect to your router. Open up a command line and run 'telnet 192.168.1.1′. You will get in without a password if you have not set one. You should really set one by running 'passwd' on the router and typing a password, if you don't set one, by default, outside attackers can't hit either the router's Web UI (for 8.09+) or SSH. Now, close your telnet session and make sure you have an SSH client. For windows, you can use PuTTY, available at http://the.earth.li/~sgtatham/putty/latest/x86/putty.exe. Log into the router (192.168.1.1) using username 'root' and the password you set in the telnet session or in the web interface. You should now be logged in. Now, if you know how to use a unix text editor (vi is the only one that comes standard on OpenWRT, see the 'installing software' section if you don't like vi) you can use one. If you don't, I recommend downloading WinSCP (available at http://winscp.net/download/winscp419.exe), which will let you browse and edit files and folders with a commander-style GUI, and will make many parts of this much easier if you aren't familiar with traditional Unix text editors since it has a built in text editor. WinSCP connects to your router through SSH, so just connect to 192.168.1.1 with username 'root' and the password you set. You will see your computer's files on the left and the router's files on the right. You can change it from commander-style to explorer style if you are more comfortable"

[mulch]

wow!!! this is great!!! see you on the other side!!

thanks all!!!

mulch :]

[mulch]

well... i have disconnected everything. Powered down XP desktop. Powered down Linksys.

Plugged ethernet in Linksys.

Powered up pc and Linksys.

Open Command Prompt.

typed: telnet 192.168.1.2

my firewall asked me to allow the traffic. I did and it said
login failed
connection to host lost
(infact i disabled my firewall and tried again.... it also failed)

Hmm... i am getting ever closer to thinking about purchasing new routers.... its been over a week of trying to get these things to get along with each other... grrrr.... if anyone has any inspiration or ideas i am very receptive...

anyway... i will observe Steves links and the telnet instructions further... I can indeed grasp the last post by Steve... but when i encounter errors like this along the way, im likely to get completely stumped.

thanks again folks... i will be back online asap to continue this saga...

mulch :]

[Steve]

From my limited reading 'telnet' should work if you've got the right location what's the result from XP>cmd>ipconfig

Unless of course a previous user due to the lack of security with telnet, it has been disabled and SSH has to be used instead but your then stuck without a password

[psp83]

It does sound like something is wrong with your Linksys routers / firmware.

If this is any help to you, here's how I've set my netgears up.

Current setup :
Netgear DGN2000 (main router) goes to a 8 port switch and also a Netgear DG834G router.

Netgear DGN2000 IP range is 192.168.0.1 > 192.168.0.254

Now the Netgear DG834G router has NAT off, DHCP off, Wireless on or off (depends if its being used), static IP is 192.168.0.200 ( i know your meant to have one outside the main DHCP server range but mine works fine )

Logging into the DGN2000 and viewing the lan setup you see the other router in the list (.200)

I can also enter 192.168.0.200 IP into the browser and can log into the control panel for this router.

DGN2000 Lan setup :


DG834G Status :