Lion

[Bill]

this whole download install thing is to much. So is digging around in finder etc

I think you're over-reacting a touch to the description of the steps required, which are clearly written for a complete beginner.

They come down to:

1) Find the .dmg file
2) Copy it to the desktop
3) Open Disk Utility
4) Burn the .dmg file to DVD.

And steps 2) and 3) aren't actually necessary, all you have to do is right-click on the .dmg file... it's not exactly rocket science!

[Gary]

I think you're over-reacting a touch to the description of the steps required, which are clearly written for a complete beginner.

They come down to:

1) Find the .dmg file
2) Copy it to the desktop
3) Open Disk Utility
4) Burn the .dmg file to DVD.

And steps 2) and 3) aren't actually necessary, all you have to do is right-click on the .dmg file... it's not exactly rocket science!

No Bill, I just don't want to have to burn a copy of an OS that should come on disc, I don't want a 4gb download, Apple have said people can go to the Apple stores to download the new OS that is a 60 mile round trip form here for me and I as of now cant even get in hire car because the seats are to low, well thought out for physically disabled with limited mobility and slow lines (my line is okay but its a valid point) god help people living way out in the sticks on 1mb fixed lines or dial up. Apple really have decided what's best for me once to often. Computing is about having choices both hardware and software wise. I like to know what hard drive I get and what Optical drive is in the computer I get, not play guess the brand with a machine thats £xxxx Apple are very good at removing choice, maybe a little to good...

[Simon]

I think that's a valid point, Gary.  Apple products are great for people who just want it to work out of the box, but perhaps not for those who like to tinker and have more options. 

[Bill]

No Bill, I just don't want to have to burn a copy of an OS that should come on disc, I don't want a 4gb download

I agree up to a point- I'd be annoyed if they fiddled it so I couldn't burn a copy to disc, but provided I've got that option I don't mind too much. I've probably downloaded a lot more than 4GB in updates since the last DVD version anyway, none of which are available on hard media and would have to be downloaded again if I re-installed so I don't entirely see your problem.

Apple have said people can go to the Apple stores to download the new OS that is a 60 mile round trip form here for me and I as of now cant even get in hire car because the seats are to low, well thought out for physically disabled with limited mobility and slow lines (my line is okay but its a valid point) god help people living way out in the sticks on 1mb fixed lines or dial up.

That's a valid point I'll concede, but the update point still applies. For OS X, Windows or Linux.

[Steve]

I can't see what the hassle is to be honest,it's a 4 Gb download,so what ,stick with SL it may well be superior who knows or go back to Windows.


Since  I've got to go away for a few days I will not have chance to update on release but look forward to Lion on my return.

[Bill]

The Apple store is closed at the moment...

[Bill]

And Lion is now available, for those feeling brave

[Bill]

For customers who want a physical copy, Apple is offering a memory stick version for an extra £25.

[pctech]

For customers who want a physical copy, Apple is offering a memory stick version for an extra £25.

Now thats what I call a bloody cheek.

[Rik]

Or a Microsoft.

[pctech]

To be fair to MS, they have an offer for students to download office for only 49.99 (provided they have a university e-mail address) and only charge a tenner for the backup DVD.

I do wonder what will be the state of play with new Macs though,

[Rik]

Expensive?

[pctech]

It's likely I'll be getting my next system from Scan but will be double checking that I get a Windows DVD with it.

[Bill]

Now thats what I call a bloody cheek.

So don't use it.

But it's likely to be cheaper than the 60-mile round trip to an Apple store that Gary was using as an example.

[Simon]

Eighteen months after Snow Leopard padded onto the scene, Apple's latest big cat boasts more than 250 new features. Many are minor tweaks: for example, you can now pause the screensaver slideshow and search the web from Spotlight.

But Lion also brings more significant changes, beginning with improved support for multitouch gestures with animated feedback. It brings more of the flavour of iOS to MacBook users, bouncing the screen when you scroll to the bottom, for example.

Lion finally brings a full-screen application view, too, hitherto a frustrating omission from OS X. Compatible applications can be switched to full-screen with a new maximise button at the top right of the window. To create a distraction-free environment, Lion even auto-hides the menu bar.

Read more: Apple OS X 10.7 Lion review | Software | Reviews | PC Pro http://www.pcpro.co.uk/reviews/software/368803/apple-os-x-10-7-lion#ixzz1SfCYF5PV

[pctech]

So don't use it.

But it's likely to be cheaper than the 60-mile round trip to an Apple store that Gary was using as an example.

I'd never buy a Mac Bill.

The old argument that Apple hardware was in some way unique no longer holds water, what people are sold is an IBM PC clone in a flashy case for twice the price.

Now if Apple were to develop the CPU intellectual property they bought into a chip capable of supporting a desktop machine that blew away the performance of Intel in a benchmark test

[Technical Ben]

Sorry, "full screen application view"? I've just about lost the will to live with all this "reinventing the wheel" business from MS and Apple.  

[edit]
I used both PC and Mac at college pctech. I would agree, the Macs with half the hardware (memory and CPU speed) ran faster or equal to PCs when it came to Photoshop. However, I would guess the Macs still had a cost over that of the PCs. Now? I have seen the PC surge in processing power, but not heard much when it comes to Macs. In fact, a lot of the previous software that a Mac was good for (video editing or photoshop) will become obsolete with "aps" and their new store. So as I'm not a casual user, even if I wanted one, I would need something else.

[pctech]

I do admit that Windows is rather bloated which is probably why the experience was quicker with less hardware.

[Bill]

To be fair to MS, they have an offer for students to download office for only 49.99 (provided they have a university e-mail address) and only charge a tenner for the backup DVD.

I do wonder what will be the state of play with new Macs though,

According to the T&C's (from the App Store), if it's pre-installed you can run one copy on one machine at any one time.

If you bought it from the App Store you can install and use it on any number of Macs that you own or control, personal and non-commercial use only and as an upgrade from SL.

You can make one back-up copy.

Sorry I can't copy/paste the actual wording, the damn thing won't let me select or print the text

[Gary]

I can't see what the hassle is to be honest,it's a 4 Gb download,so what ,stick with SL it may well be superior who knows or go back to Windows.


Since  I've got to go away for a few days I will not have chance to update on release but look forward to Lion on my return.

If you can see the first day chaos on the apple forum with downloads failing or having to restart a download again well a lot can go wrong with a 4gb download it seems...physical media works best for big things like OS updates I think. If something goes wrong you won't have so spend several hours re-downloading because your download failed with an error code, it looks a right mess  granted this is just first day chaos but still it would have been so much easier to have been able to order a copy that popped though the letterbox today or you could have grabbed in the week. I'm steering well clear of lion until .1 or .2 and until I can get physical media.

  As far as staying with Apple, having 4 machines in a row with issues, hardware and cosmetic and all with so much debris behind the glass that when you wipe it it sticks to the inside because of the static, or there are smears and cuts in the LCD panel...and this is better hardware? Yes its a very fast machine, but at a price, and one I think is to high now at least in theory scan will build a great machine for that price and it will be tested way better than any iMac ever will. I will say though the idea of going back to windows with a main machine does fill me with dread as OS X just works so well and the lack of clutter compared with a windows machine is like night and day.

[Gary]

I have seen the PC surge in processing power, but not heard much when it comes to Macs.

The new i5 and i7 sandybridge Macs are lightning fast with massive geekbench scores and when windows is installed will boot faster than alot of windows machines with much more powerful hardware, iMacs for instance are now more powerful than some Mac Pros. As to software becoming obsolete I doubt that will happen, its just the way Apple herd you into downloads, which for small things is great, you buy it and it downloads and installs itself, so simple and very elegantly done, as I have said for OS update... I think thats pushing things it a bit.

[Steve]

I did read somewhere whether is correct or not  that you must copy the Lion .dmg before you install on the machine otherwise it's deleted afterwards.

[lozcart]

It is Steve, when Lion is downloaded quit the installer and locate the update which should be in the Applications folder, right click the file and select open package, locate the .dmg which is in one of the folders and copy it to the desktop, right click the .dmg and burn to a DVD.

[Technical Ben]

Garry, yet for the price I still can't justify it. For example, I went AMD over Intel, as I got a quad core for a much lower price. Unless I'm comparing apples for oranges. In which case all the benchmarks in the world mean nothing if real world use and speed differs from the benchmarks.
Most my software I use is free opensource, free shareware or free indy when it comes to Graphics. Then there are PC games. Even the little £5 ones I get, would not work in most instances. So the savings from not needing to purchase a separate Xbox (most games get ported to pc) or PS3, plus the free software as I cannot afford Adobe, is far too great a draw for me.

[Steve]

Don't be tempted to interrupt the Lion download. I just installed the other software updates and the buggers gone back to square one following a restart, thank goodness I hadn't got very far.