Good news for Broadband prices?

Technical Ben · Jul 20, 2011, 14:06:43

http://www.theregister.co.uk/2011/07/20/ofcom_bt_wholesale_prices/

From what I can tell, this seems to be related to the ASDL/ASDL2+ divide. Those in rural areas have who not had an upgrade to the newer and cheaper services pay more for slower speeds. Now that BT have an incentive (well, kind of

) to reduce the prices perhaps they will add the upgrades? However, I doubt the cost/savings/pricing system works that way anyhow.

pctech · Jul 20, 2011, 15:59:46

While one BT charge goes down another rises.

Rik · Jul 20, 2011, 16:34:41

I feel so sorry for BT... NOT!

pctech · Jul 20, 2011, 16:43:14

Those that will no doubt jump to BT's defence on TBB seem to forget what a vast operation it is, not just here but overseas as well.

And slthough it was supposedly broken up by oftel decree the money all ends up in the same place when all is said and done and it will always give better service to its own divisions than it does to others.

Terryphi · Jul 21, 2011, 07:31:41

Quote: "The regulator said this morning that BT must reduce its prices to 12pc below inflation by mid-August in areas where it is the only wholesale provider of broadband - 11.7pc of the country. It added that it expects ISPs in those areas to drop retail prices for customers by the end of the year."

So will IDNet be reducing prices for customers living in rural areas where BT is the only wholesale provider?

kinmel · Jul 21, 2011, 07:49:34

Quote from: Terryphi on Jul 21, 2011, 07:31:41
Quote: "The regulator said this morning that BT must reduce its prices to 12pc below inflation by mid-August in areas where it is the only wholesale provider of broadband - 11.7pc of the country. It added that it expects ISPs in those areas to drop retail prices for customers by the end of the year."

So will IDNet be reducing prices for customers living in rural areas where BT is the only wholesale provider?

On present form, most ISP's do not pass such savings on, according to an interesting paragraph in Thinkbroadband's news section

" What many people are not aware of is that some years ago Ofcom allowed BT to have differential pricing across the country for its broadband products, with lower pricing where multiple wholesale providers of broadband were available. Strangely only one broadband provider has passed this differential pricing onto its customers, Plusnet."

talos · Jul 21, 2011, 08:09:31

QuoteSo will IDNet be reducing prices for customers living in rural areas where BT is the only wholesale provider?

I would be interested in an answer to that

Rik · Jul 21, 2011, 08:19:47

I've been with IDNet for going on five years. I'm paying the same today as when I joined. However, I'm getting almost twice the speed and about 30 times the download allowance - even customers on 20CN lines have been given increased bandwidth, plus webspace, photo gallery and blog space if I want it. There's been a huge investment in new capacity in that time, and staff costs have also risen.

I don't know whether IDNet plan to reduce charges, you'd have to ask them, but we should remember how much they've given us already, and the cost of operating multi-tier pricing.

Technical Ben · Jul 21, 2011, 09:08:57

What is 12% of 4% of £24.99? Something like 13p?

Rik · Jul 21, 2011, 09:15:12

Good maths for this time of day, Ben.

talos · Jul 21, 2011, 10:36:03

Quote from: Rik on Jul 21, 2011, 08:19:47
I've been with IDNet for going on five years. I'm paying the same today as when I joined. However, I'm getting almost twice the speed and about 30 times the download allowance - even customers on 20CN lines have been given increased bandwidth, plus webspace, photo gallery and blog space if I want it. There's been a huge investment in new capacity in that time, and staff costs have also risen.

I don't know whether IDNet plan to reduce charges, you'd have to ask them, but we should remember how much they've given us already, and the cost of operating multi-tier pricing.

Thats just fine for you Rik,

my connection has not changed since I joined, but in fairness nor has the price, but I joined them for reliability not price and to a point that I have had, but these days price is becoming more important and even IDnet has to remain competitive has it not

Rik · Jul 21, 2011, 10:41:30

Yes, but see Ben's maths, Bob. The impact is likely to be minimal.

Technical Ben · Jul 21, 2011, 10:44:17

Wow Rik, you agree with my maths?!

5 Years working in insurance and banking and no one listened to my maths. Makes you wonder where we would be today if they did.

[edit]
It's even less savings than that probably. It only applies to "market 1" exchanges. These are the monopoly owned BT only exchanges. One other providers put in their equipment, and it becomes market 2, proper competitive pricing can begin (although not if the past is anything to go by

). Currently, in the market 1 exchanges, there is no competition, so BT have no proper pricing incentives.

Terryphi · Jul 21, 2011, 15:29:53

Quote from: Technical Ben on Jul 21, 2011, 09:08:57
What is 12% of 4% of £24.99? Something like 13p?

Not so. The requirement is to reduce prices 12% below inflation not 12% of inflation as you have calculated.

Those of us on long rural lines have been unable to benefit from increased speeds. If IDNet gets a reduced wholesale price from BT it should be passed on to the appropriate customers. Any other course would be totally unfair.

Technical Ben · Jul 21, 2011, 15:36:59

Ok. 12% of £24.99 would be about £3 then.

Terryphi · Jul 21, 2011, 16:42:53

Quote from: Technical Ben on Jul 21, 2011, 15:36:59
Ok. 12% of £24.99 would be about £3 then.

No. Assuming inflation of say 4%, +4-12 = -8%.
8% of £24.99 = £2. Definitely worth having.

Technical Ben · Jul 21, 2011, 16:46:55

"Ofcom has ordered BT to slash its prices by 12 per cent below inflation" Could mean 12%+4.5%. As inflation is 4.5%, 12% below that would be or 16.5% or £4.12p. See, it's rather an ambiguous statement.

Lance · Jul 21, 2011, 19:01:18

Either way, Idnet should use the saving to balance package allowances. If customers don't like that, they can always go to another BT based ISP which has reduced prices.

Glenn · Jul 21, 2011, 19:04:59

Here is Miriam's response to the question posted over on TBB

Lona · Jul 21, 2011, 20:21:11

Plusnet's offer seems very inviting. I know it's owned by BT but my friend is with them and receives a very good service.

Simon · Jul 21, 2011, 22:14:23

I think PlusNet can be OK, depending on what you use your connection for, as they do, apparently, use traffic management and throttling.

Technical Ben · Jul 21, 2011, 22:25:36

You know, I think my dyslexia has kicked in, inflation is addition not subtraction right? I'm too confused. However, all this legal talk and regulations always seems to have the same effect. See the privacy requirements of websites and cookies passed by the EU for a good example!

Lance · Jul 21, 2011, 23:13:02

Yep inflation is an increase and deflation the decrease.

davej99 · Jul 22, 2011, 15:41:35

Did IDNET not increase allowances for those of us stuck on ADSL Max by way of a cross subsidy, and did they not swallow the cost impact? This includes old exchanges like mine where there is a competitive :eyebrow:Talk Talk LLU presence. So it's hard to be too demanding; but if there was some beneficial impact to IDNET from the proposed pricing changes, and the company wanted to increase ADSLMax allowances a tad more, that might go down well with those maxed out until they are upgraded.

Lance · Jul 22, 2011, 17:00:32

Quote from: davej99 on Jul 22, 2011, 15:41:35
Did IDNET not increase allowances for those of us stuck on ADSL Max by way of a cross subsidy

They certainly did.

pctech · Jul 22, 2011, 19:34:45

Quote from: Simon on Jul 21, 2011, 22:14:23
I think PlusNet can be OK, depending on what you use your connection for, as they do, apparently, use traffic management and throttling.

Unless you go for Pro and/or have a really good line, the traffic management can make the connection unusable when their network is under load.

Gary · Jul 23, 2011, 11:11:22

Quote from: pctech on Jul 22, 2011, 19:34:45
Unless you go for Pro and/or have a really good line, the traffic management can make the connection unusable when their network is under load.

I tend to use my connection more in the day, bit of online gaming at night, its getting to the point paying IDNet + phoneline is expensive and for my usage cheaper ISP's are calling even though I resist. We need to save money and IDNet is just expensive although a great ISP but justifying their prices is getting harder and harder.

Technical Ben · Jul 23, 2011, 11:22:04

True. But can you even game on the cheaper products? I found the answer to be no.

pctech · Jul 23, 2011, 11:58:02

One of the complaints on Plusnet when a new game came out was that the traffic was not prioritised as it was supposed to be on the cheaper products until the network operations staff had loaded the traffic signatures for the game in question so that the device could recognise it.

Technical Ben · Jul 23, 2011, 19:54:02

Exactly. If the service is not congested (usualy for BT resellers) then it's traffic managed. Either way, your game traffic is practically blocked, not just slow.

pctech · Jul 23, 2011, 20:05:35

Plusnet used to announce with great fanfare when a new segment of a BT Central (predecessor to the hostlink on 20CN) was lit meaning they'd have 155 Mbps of extra incoming bandwdidth from BT available so that's not really an issue.

It's the traffic management that stinks.