advice/reasurance

woppy101 · Sep 27, 2011, 13:50:00

here is mr problem again!!! lol
im looking for advice/reasurance
as every one knows i have been having a few problems with my BB!
quick recap,line starting off @3780 then droping to 2800 then back up to 3200 then dropping again to 2500.
i went home for lunch today and my line is synced @2070(now i have have a rock solid stable 3200sync for the last 18-24 months).
i have phoned up idnet today and they have said that phone lines degrage over time so my line might not support 3200kbps now,now the thing im concerned about is im getting no errors/very few on the line and then all of a sudden im getting a burst of 2000crc errors and 10000fec over a few minutes which is dropping the connection
what does that sound like to everyone?
(i have got no problem bt comming out because i have tried everything on my end and am sure its nothing i can rectify)

many thanks
woppy

Simon · Sep 27, 2011, 14:33:24

Am I right in thinking you're still in a training period? If so, you really need to wait until that is over, and see if things stabilise then. If not, apologies, and please ignore comment.

.Griff. · Sep 27, 2011, 14:36:56

I think woppy is only about 3 days into the training period now?!? Far too early to speculate on anything yet.

Simon · Sep 27, 2011, 14:37:36

That's what I thought.

woppy101 · Sep 27, 2011, 15:57:00

sorry yes i am in the training period,the thing thats worrying is the downward trend of the stats because the way i understand it is on monday the line isnt suddenly going to jump up from 2070kbps to say 2500-3000kbps

Rik · Sep 27, 2011, 16:03:12

A downward trend is the norm. During the training period, DLM will start by trying to run the line as fast as possible. Over the next 10 days, it watches for instability and adjusts parameters to try and stabilise any it spots. The parameters used are interleaving, off/on and then depth, and target noise margin, increasing in steps of 3db, each of which cost about 5-700kbps. At the end of the training period, it sets the Maximum Stable Rate and the Fault Threshold Rate. The latter is the important one as it determines when BT consider there is a fault on the line.

Is the engineer coming out a voice or BB engineer? If the former, it would pay you to disconnect the router before and during his visit.

woppy101 · Sep 27, 2011, 16:13:25

Quote from: Rik on Sep 27, 2011, 16:03:12
A downward trend is the norm. During the training period, DLM will start by trying to run the line as fast as possible. Over the next 10 days, it watches for instability and adjusts parameters to try and stabilise any it spots. The parameters used are interleaving, off/on and then depth, and target noise margin, increasing in steps of 3db, each of which cost about 5-700kbps. At the end of the training period, it sets the Maximum Stable Rate and the Fault Threshold Rate. The latter is the important one as it determines when BT consider there is a fault on the line.

Is the engineer coming out a voice or BB engineer? If the former, it would pay you to disconnect the router before and during his visit.

an engineer hasnt been booked yet im going to wait till monday and see what the line stats

Rik · Sep 27, 2011, 16:15:30

Sorry, misread your post.

woppy101 · Sep 27, 2011, 19:25:20

Well there is another re-sync now down to 2033, I might just ask to put onto a fixed 2mb profile

Gary · Sep 27, 2011, 23:14:31

Quote from: woppy101 on Sep 27, 2011, 19:25:20
Well there is another re-sync now down to 2033, I might just ask to put onto a fixed 2mb profile

Wait for the training period to pass before doing anything, dont panic so much as well, the line will go up and down for a while yet, once its over then decide on what you want to do.

woppy101 · Sep 28, 2011, 07:35:05

I have now jumped up to 3300Kbps and am sure at around 5pm-6pm this afternoon it will re-sync back down to 2100Kbps(the thing that's really annoying is because I'm on up-to 8mb my ip profile is now stuck for up to three days)
The odd thing on this mornings re-sync is on my 2700hgv is it normally says ERR_SIG_INTRUP but this morning it says RETRAIN_HIGHER

woppy101 · Sep 28, 2011, 08:16:55

That didn't last long 15 minutes later a re-sync down to 2336kbps you can not tell me this is normal behaviour during the training period,
here are all the stats from my 2700

2011/09/27 07:55:23 BST   1      2624   2632   3068   3068   9.1   9.0   58.0   17.3   914   3281   1.41   8.00      448   880   19.0   31.5   12.2   23   33      G.DMT Annex A   TI   230/105   ERR_SIG_INTERRUPT   -18.2   -2.3   33.7   47
2011/09/27 11:19:03 BST   1      2048   2056   2636   2636   9.1   14.0   58.0   17.3   0   916   1.75   8.00      448   884   19.0   31.5   12.2   22   22      G.DMT Annex A   TI   230/105   IDLE_REQUEST   -14.2   2.4   33.7   0
2011/09/27 19:07:07 BST   1      2784   2784   3200   3200   9.0   10.0   58.0   17.5   823   2627   1.33   8.00      448   868   19.0   31.5   12.2   57   78      G.DMT Annex A   TI   230/105   ERR_SIG_INTERRUPT   -17.8   2.2   33.7   38
2011/09/28 07:02:58 BST   1      2112   2132   2976   2976   9.2   16.0   58.0   17.2   32   1327   1.71   8.00      448   888   19.0   31.5   12.2   9   18      G.DMT Annex A   TI   230/105   RETRAIN_HIGHER   -16.2   2.5   33.7   0
2011/09/28 08:06:35 BST   1      3360   3416   3348   3348   9.3   9.0   58.0   17.7   977   1609   1.12   8.00      448   864   19.0   31.5   12.2   33   50      G.DMT Annex A   TI   230/105   ERR_SIG_INTERRUPT   -18.3   1.8   33.7   0
2011/09/28 08:13:02 BST   1      2336   2376   2768   2768   9.4   12.0   58.0   17.4   18   2326   1.56   8.00      448   876   19.0   31.5   12.2   0   0      G.DMT Annex A   TI   229/103   N/A   -17.2   2.0   33.7   0

Rik · Sep 28, 2011, 09:41:18

Actually, it looks quite normal. Please just leave it alone until the end of the training period. Any data, error messages etc are meaningless until then, and re-booting the router is inadvisable.

Simon · Sep 28, 2011, 11:49:20

It would also be advisable not to start any more threads on this issue, as this makes it harder to find relevant information later on, if it's required.

woppy101 · Sep 28, 2011, 14:06:18

Now down to 1856kbps so down to a 1.5mb ip profile this is now becoming a joke how can a line be unstable at 3mb,2.5mb,2mb,1.75mb I now have a 15db snr, yet I can still get a 2mb fixed profile

Rik · Sep 28, 2011, 17:04:59

At this point, I don't have an answer, and BT won't give IDNet one. You really will have to wait out the 10 days.

woppy101 · Sep 28, 2011, 17:20:53

I'm considering getting my other line connected up and hoping that one is better than this one,considering next door and the two houses across the road which are on the same pole as me(which is also the closest pole to the green box)get 3100kbps, 3400kbps and 4120kbps.

Rik · Sep 28, 2011, 17:37:01

It may work. I have two lines, one yields 3.5M the other 2M. Both have the same attenuation. Wiring here is all underground, and the distribution point is in my meter cupboard. My neighbours range from 512k to 4M, but we're all on the same cable from here to the cabinet, 213m. After that, it's anyone's guess which cable and which route is used.

woppy101 · Sep 28, 2011, 17:56:22

I was talking to the bt engineer who was part of the team that renewed all the lines on camp two years ago and my line travels from my house to the pole (20m) and then from the pole underground to the green cabinet (80m) and then back to the exchange(4100m-4200m)

Rik · Sep 28, 2011, 18:15:54

Both lines, or the one you're thinking about swapping to?

woppy101 · Sep 28, 2011, 18:43:40

Both lines well the one I might switch too is around 5m shorter in length

sparky · Sep 28, 2011, 19:23:02

Quotei have phoned up idnet today and they have said that phone lines degrage over time

Line Degredation! This is becoming too much of a cop out by both idnet and BT.

http://www.idnetters.co.uk/forums/index.php/topic,26708.0.html

I eventually left my router and line well alone. 6 weeks later after another bout of line problems over a Sat night/Sun morning, my line has mysteriously come back to normal and I'm synching at over 4Mbs.

Line degredation my a**. Someone playing at fixing things more like it and no transparancy to the ISP.

woppy101 · Sep 29, 2011, 07:07:44

How come when I spoke to idnet they said I had a noise margin of 9db yet my router is telling me my noise margin is now at 18db (was at 16db when I spoke to them)

When my training!!! period is over will the 2-3 disconects I get every day stop?(if they don't stop where do I go from there, it does it on every router I have got so it can't be the router)I'm getting a bit annoyed with idnet saying "yeah well bt say your line can only get 1.5mb and that's what your getting so we don't see a problem"

Gary · Sep 29, 2011, 07:41:24

Quote from: sparky on Sep 28, 2011, 19:23:02
Line Degredation! This is becoming too much of a cop out by both idnet and BT.

http://www.idnetters.co.uk/forums/index.php/topic,26708.0.html
Line degredation my a**. Someone playing at fixing things more like it and no transparency to the ISP.

The ISP has had most of its tools to check the line taken away, they do their best...

Gary · Sep 29, 2011, 07:45:47

Quote from: woppy101 on Sep 29, 2011, 07:07:44
How come when I spoke to idnet they said I had a noise margin of 9db yet my router is telling me my noise margin is now at 18db (was at 16db when I spoke to them)

When my training!!! period is over will the 2-3 disconects I get every day stop?(if they don't stop where do I go from there, it does it on every router I have got so it can't be the router)I'm getting a bit annoyed with idnet saying "yeah well bt say your line can only get 1.5mb and that's what your getting so we don't see a problem"

This has been explained to you, you are in a training period, BT uses DLM to stabilise your line, it is their equipment that decides what your line will be like after the ten day training period. IDNet are telling you what your line should be capable of, what happens in reality can vary a great deal, and since you are still in training you need to wait to its over, that simple, no one can help you, and if you muck about with your router say by turning it off and on alot that wont help. Wait and see what happens. There is no point to keep contacting IDNet till this period is over or posting until you know the final results. I dont want to sound harsh but that's the bottom line here.