I really don't want to jump ship but please look at your Caps

[Ardua]

@kerrso05  I got close to switching to BT Infinity but after being told (a) that they couldn't do a simultaneous provide when contributors to the BT forum said that they could; (b) they couldn't guarantee that I could keep my existing telephone number and (c) they screwed up my order and I couldn't action e-mails that had an immediate action on them, I decided to remain with IDNet. One e-mail: job done. That said, I am sure that IDNet will, in the longer term, have to look at what other non-mainstream ISPs are providing in terms of package size, speeds and peak/off-peak hours but, for the moment, the IDNet package works well for me. Also, I can afford to buy 12 months for the price of 11 which helps narrow the cost gap.

PS  It has taken me a month of e-mails and calls to get a £11.35 telephone rental refund out of Talk Talk so poor customer service isn't just a BT issue.

[Glenn]

TalkTalk have made poor customer service an art form, the are the No1 most complained about telecomms provider.

[cavillas]

It seems to me that most of the FTTC users would like more bandwidth at the same price and expect Idcnet to cover the extrat costs incurred from BT's pricing ifrastructure.  That is simply not reasonable to expect from a company that is in the bsuiness to provide a service and make a profti, like all other businesses.

[kerrso05]

It seems to me that most of the FTTC users would like more bandwidth at the same price and expect Idcnet to cover the extrat costs incurred from BT's pricing ifrastructure.  That is simply not reasonable to expect from a company that is in the bsuiness to provide a service and make a profti, like all other businesses.

Cavillas I think that is being a wee bit harsh and unfair, especially those who find themselves in this predicament. We all like Idnet and I personally think it is one of the best Internet Provider company's out there (it's certainly the best I have ever been with but as someone else wrote "I'm not religiously bound to it") and that's why I don't want to leave but I'm asking Idnet to look at their caps to see if they can be more competitive with the likes of similar Internet Providers like ADSL24 and Zen (especially Zen who don't have any off peak and peak allowances) Everybody knows that Idnet are a Business and they're in that business to make profits and I'm not asking them not to make a profit or give us something for nothing, that is a ludicrous suggestion to make especially in these hard financial times we are living in. Are you telling me that Zen don't make a profit on their FTTC business? Of course they do.

The position I'm in is trying to find the best way to get Idnet to look at the Caps for the FTTC. If they look at it and do their calculations and find they can do nothing for us (those that are having problems with the caps) then that's the question answered and we all have to make up our minds what to do next, whether that is to leave or sit up and shut up.........it's as simple as that. I don't think we are being unreasonable but if you do.......then........that's alright...........we will have to agree to differ

[Ardua]

It seems to me that most of the FTTC users would like more bandwidth at the same price and expect Idcnet to cover the extrat costs incurred from BT's pricing ifrastructure.  That is simply not reasonable to expect from a company that is in the bsuiness to provide a service and make a profti, like all other businesses.

With respect, I think that the point that others are making is that in some respects IDNet's FTTC packages are looking increasingly uncompetitive when compared to those offered by other BT resellers. For example, Zen has just doubled its 50GB package to 100GB without increasing the cost. As has been said many times before, IDNet's equivalent package is 50GB/150GB. If one isn't a night owl then the 150GB part of the package is unlikely to be used; hence, the requests for IDNet to consider a review, for example, of it's peak/off-peak hours ratio. I agree though that this is a matter for IDNet. If IDNet's offering is no longer a fit, then I can well see why some long-term IDNet customers may decide to move on. Such is life.

[kerrso05]

Ardua obviously you had a different experience from Griff with BT. It's all good to get these different views of how BT perform.....you were really lucky getting back to Idnet........knowing my luck if I had the same experience as you had I would end up being locked into BT for 18 months.

As for Talk Talk I have had a bad experience with them, so I would never deal with them again but in saying that, I know various people round were I live have them and they are very happy with them including my Uncle, who thought they were great. So it is very hard to give a hundred percent recommendation on these companies which doesn't make it easy on who to choose. It's a case of pay your money take your chance.....I'm afraid

[kerrso05]

With respect, I think that the point that others are making is that in some respects IDNet's FTTC packages are looking increasingly uncompetitive when compared to those offered by other BT resellers. For example, Zen has just doubled its 50GB package to 100GB without increasing the cost. As has been said many times before, IDNet's equivalent package is 50GB/150GB. If one isn't a night owl then the 150GB part of the package is unlikely to be used; hence, the requests for IDNet to consider a review, for example, of it's peak/off-peak hours ratio. I agree though that this is a matter for IDNet. If IDNet's offering is no longer a fit, then I can well see why some long-term IDNet customers may decide to move on. Such is life.

My point exactly...............I'm fed up being a night owl and getting very little sleep

[Steve]

I just get up early.

[kerrso05]

Current Usage
This is the 5th June.... only five days into the month and I have just looked at my figures....here they are:-


During the time period 2012-06-01 to 2012-06-04 your bandwidth use was:
15.64 GB Download - (Peak: 5.71 GB | Off-Peak: 9.93 GB)
1.95 GB Upload - (Peak: 0.89 GB | Off-Peak: 1.06 GB)

These figures cover 3 days. If your previous 7 days rate of usage continues for 30 days then the total for the month will be:
118.71 GB Download - (Peak: 39.31 GB | Off-Peak: 79.40 GB)
18.79 GB Upload - (Peak: 9.68 GB | Off-Peak: 9.11 GB)


That 5.71 Gbs has only been used up by surfing the net and playing back "The Final of The Apprentice" through iPlayer because my wife had missed it because she was a leader at a guide camp. Also look at what they predict I am going to end up with at the end of the month 39.31 Gbs for Peak. As you also can see I am staying up late and downloading.....sometimes to 2.30am in the morning. It's not good.

[kerrso05]

I just get up early.

No I think it would be simpler if they changed the Peak hours to a more reasonable time 

[pctech]

More chance of David Cameron calling a snap election methinks.

[Steve]

Perhaps I'm being naive, FTTC is new technology Openreach needs a return on it's investment and like any new technology it comes in at a higher initial price. I think it will be come cheaper eventually but I've no idea when. I suspect FTTC is still a minority product.

[kerrso05]

More chance of David Cameron calling a snap election methinks.

No I think that is being defeatist....they have to look at it first....surely......and anyway hasn't he David Cameron changed his mind a couple times in this parliament.....there's always hope for us 

[Technical Ben]

More chance of David Cameron calling a snap election methinks.

He already did... They both got the election cards and went "Snap". 

[Simon]

The position I'm in is trying to find the best way to get Idnet to look at the Caps for the FTTC.

I suggest the best way is to ask them, perhaps pointing them to this thread in your enquiry email. 

That 5.71 Gbs has only been used up by surfing the net and playing back "The Final of The Apprentice" through iPlayer because my wife had missed it because she was a leader at a guide camp.

You'll have to forgive me, but this is one thing I don't understand.  With respect, does your wife have to use iPlayer to watch the programme?  Do you not have a PVR / Freeview / Sky box that it could have been recorded on?  That's what I've been doing for years, and I can't see any reason to change from that system, but then, I haven't got FTTC.  My point, however, is that there are alternative means to catch up on TV programmes, rather than using iPlayer.

[Gary]

You'll have to forgive me, but this is one thing I don't understand.  With respect, does your wife have to use iPlayer to watch the programme?  Do you not have a PVR / Freeview / Sky box that it could have been recorded on?  That's what I've been doing for years, and I can't see any reason to change from that system, but then, I haven't got FTTC.  My point, however, is that there are alternative means to catch up on TV programmes, rather than using iPlayer.

Simon, surely how people want to catch up with programs is up to them, iPlayer is easy, its on phones tablets and your PC. Not everyone has sky, and if they do the anytime+ service they promote now for back catalogues is VOD. Telling someone to change their habits to save bandwidth is not really the point surely as these services are there to be used, and are convenient, also sometimes the use of these on demand services is a spur of the moment thing as you see something interesting and just want to watch it.

[Simon]

Simon, surely how people want to catch up with programs is up to them, iPlayer is easy, its on phones tablets and your PC. Not everyone has sky, and if they do the anytime+ service they promote now for back catalogues is VOD.

I'm not suggesting everyone has Sky (I don't), but most people have some sort of TV recording facility, and I'd be surprised if everyone dumped their old PVR boxes (of whatever variety) the minute they get FTTC.  All I'm saying is, there are alternatives to iPlayer.

Telling someone to change their habits to save bandwidth is not really the point surely as these services are there to be used, and are convenient, also sometimes the use of these on demand services is a spur of the moment thing as you see something interesting and just want to watch it.

Again, I'm not telling anyone to change their habits, but merely suggesting that alternatives are available, and stating that, personally, I, myself, don't understand the need to hammer your bandwidth with iPlayer, if there are other means available.

[Anton]

I'm not suggesting everyone has Sky (I don't), but most people have some sort of TV recording facility, and I'd be surprised if everyone dumped their old PVR boxes (of whatever variety) the minute they get FTTC.  All I'm saying is, there are alternatives to iPlayer.

Again, I'm not telling anyone to change their habits, but merely suggesting that alternatives are available, and stating that, personally, I, myself, don't understand the need to hammer your bandwidth with iPlayer, if there are other means available.

Gents,

I've been watching this thread with interest even though it doesn't really apply to me. I pay for Home Pro (100Gb peak) and use around 70Gb peak each month, so as far as I'm  concerned I am on "unlimited". Two points:

1. I pay for the service. Nearly £50 a month should give me no need to worry about caps and I know earlier in the thread the OP was expressing his desire to continue to pay mid £20s per month because he always has. That's not really reasonable. I'd like to pay sixty nine pence for a pint of Bitter and 40 pence a gallon for petrol just as I used to. The leap from £25 to say £35 a month isn't great and it's buying continued quality. I can have free 2Mb capped from Sky, but for me that's bad value. I have decided that sky at £20 a month too will be bad value as I'm certain it'll be loaded to high heaven and then managed to mediocrity.

So on the one hand, buy value - it's far more important than base cost.

2. On the other hand, Simon, there has to be a trade off around what that value buys. One of the key drivers for FTTC is that it's capable of streaming. To set caps so low that streaming isn't practical isn't on. BT provide vision customers with bandwidth that sits *outside* their data cap, so in effect streaming is free. I'm not sure how the financials work, but this seems like predatory pricing and its something IDNet could look at. IIRC BT were in the process of enabling multicast on their whole network, so there may be some flexibility on this in the future?

So on the other hand, the benefits of FTTC can't be negated by the cost. I appreciate IDNet are at the premium end of the market, but they need to find the balance that is say Audi, rather than being either Mclaren or Vauxhall (if that makes sense).

I'

[Simon]

Point taken.

[Lance]

Something which everyone seems to be missing is that as a business, IDNet is always going to be looking to remain as competitive as other ISPs. Reviewing the bandwidth caps isn't going to be a once a year exercise, but something which is going to be under very regular consideration.

Zen, as has been pointed out already, recently doubled their allowances at no additional cost to the consumer. However, what we don't know is how big their user base is. It could be that it is much larger than IDNet's and that is why they have calculated the changes to the packages will still make a decent profit.

Ultimately, we have to remember that iDNet are out to make a profit. I'm sure if they could, they would charge BT prices, have no caps and keep the same customer service but this is not going to happen because they would go bust overnight.

[kerrso05]

Simon in answer to your question why not use alternative catch-up methods to see a program like "The Apprentice"............the answer is simple, we didn't record it....sorry that should be, I  didn't remember to record it because we have one of the latest Panasonic DVD recorders (250Gbs)
So that is the only time we have ever used that facility on our Panasonic Free-sat/Freeview TV (and no I also don't have sky) The point is that with the superior speed of FTTC I can if I so wish watch a program on iPlayer I'm not having to wait for buffering and stuttering and starting with ADSL that is one of the advantages of FTTC but the downside is.....there goes my usage.
But Simon I get the impression from your comments is anything I say or we say regarding this matter wont convince you. As you say you don't have FTTC, so really you don't know what it is like to have the speed and at the same you don't really understand (and I didn't want to say this but I don't think you want to understand....do you?) the problems we have with the restrictive caps.

I also know I am repeating myself in saying that I respect Idnet a lot and I like their business ethos very much but what I don't consider them as Gods and religiously believe everything that they do is right and correct. I'm sure like most businesses and people in general make mistakes and Idnet would be no different. I think in this case Idnet have made a mistake and I want them to look at it again, whereas in contrast you appear to believe they haven't made a mistake and don't think they should look at it (even though you don't have FTTC)

All honestly do you think it is right that I should have to wait till after midnight to use the bulk of my internet usage?.....do you have to wait till midnight to go onto the internet?.....I think not

[Lance]

I have large downloads and BBC iplayer scheduled for off peak times so it downloads whilst I sleep

[kerrso05]

Anton, I think your comments on the situation on the whole are balanced and correct.....thanks for that and yes you are right, I don't want the price too rise too much but if it has to rise then so be it.......I'm not totally concerned about a reasonable rise in monthly charges as long as I see a change in the caps. I would go further than that, I'm willing to accept whatever Idnet come up with as long as they promise to look at the Caps.......I think that is pretty fair....do you not?

[mervl]

Just for  info the workaround I use on iplayer is to download rather than stream, with IDNets off-peak up to 9am on FTTC, even if I'm late up and don't start until 8.30am, on my poor line I can still download [EDIT]  4 hours of HD programming a day before 9am, if I were so minded. A little inconvenience can go a long way.

I'm surprised that no-one who is concerned appears to have had the courtesy to raise this directly with IDNet and posted their response. I suspect it will be that they keep the caps and the market under review, as any good business does. But if there's any thought of coercion, then no business will give in to that. Changes take time to plan (even more so where there is a need for capital or financial investment), and take longer than you think. That's good business, not "head in the sand". I'm not sure with what appears to be an impressive media and quango client list on their information pages, that IDNet would prejudice their network performance in advance of seeing how it performs under the pressure of the Olympics, but there.

I do understand that other members of the family don't understand the restrictions; but I also think that we should consider future generations. It was a great disappointment to me at the time I took early retirement, the number of young people who were also "let go": the reason was that the employer found them unwilling to adapt and compromise - in the eyes of their employer they would invariably "do as they please" and be the first to complain about inadequate resources frequently on the basis that "no one complains at home" - the job market is increasingly difficult and  resources in the real world are scarce, so perhaps it's a sign of old age but I think we all need to start to re-learn the skills of "mend and make do".

I read those people who say "I don't want to have to plan/think" and despair. I wouldn't want to employ or live with someone with that attitude. What do you think we have a brain for?

[andrue]

PS  It has taken me a month of e-mails and calls to get a £11.35 telephone rental refund out of Talk Talk so poor customer service isn't just a BT issue.

That's shooting fish in a barrel. TalkTalk are in a league of their own when it comes to bad customer service.