SIM cryptography cracked by sending a single text

pctech · Jul 22, 2013, 19:35:26

http://www.theregister.co.uk/2013/07/21/researcher_cracks_sim_crypto_to_own_phones_via_sms/

Simon · Jul 22, 2013, 22:48:53

Hell, if you worried about all this stuff, you'd never do anything!

Gary · Jul 22, 2013, 23:49:31

Considering the number of phones that are possible effected and we don't know of ours are or not, and that they can clone your sim, make calls send texts access baking which in some countries is done from the phones sim etc, just like the days of analogue devices except now its much more lucrative, this has the potential to be a biggy with the phone market so huge, world wide that's a big chunk of cash for the unscrupulous, and big bills for those who are caught by it.

Simon · Jul 22, 2013, 23:57:47

I wish I could clone my SIM, then I could have the iPhone for the fancy stuff, and a proper phone for making calls.

Gary · Jul 23, 2013, 09:25:33

My phone makes calls fine, whats up with yours, Simon?

Gary · Jul 23, 2013, 09:26:39

I meant banking way up there ^ not baking

saying that I bet they could watch you bake

Simon · Jul 23, 2013, 13:53:19

As I've said before, Gary, mine keeps flitting in and out of 3G, and every time it does so, the call is dropped. If I leave 3G off, Internet use is practically impossible, but if I have 3G on, I lose call stability. I guess it's not the phone's fault that I'm in a dodgy signal area, but it could handle the 3G / 2G switch better, in my opinion.

pctech · Jul 23, 2013, 19:32:11

While I'll never do banking from my mobile and will stick to PAYG as I don't have auto refill turned on or anything and the maximum credit I keep on the account is 14 quid.

nowster · Jul 24, 2013, 04:05:04

Quote from: Simon on Jul 23, 2013, 13:53:19
As I've said before, Gary, mine keeps flitting in and out of 3G, and every time it does so, the call is dropped. If I leave 3G off, Internet use is practically impossible, but if I have 3G on, I lose call stability. I guess it's not the phone's fault that I'm in a dodgy signal area, but it could handle the 3G / 2G switch better, in my opinion.

It may also be a fault in the network. Not all networks handle the transition that well.

Gary · Jul 24, 2013, 10:22:17

Quote from: Simon on Jul 23, 2013, 13:53:19
As I've said before, Gary, mine keeps flitting in and out of 3G, and every time it does so, the call is dropped. If I leave 3G off, Internet use is practically impossible, but if I have 3G on, I lose call stability. I guess it's not the phone's fault that I'm in a dodgy signal area, but it could handle the 3G / 2G switch better, in my opinion.

I cant remember previous conversations very well Simon, as you know. My Phone transfers fine between 3G and 2G in a call with no drop. My 4S was the same, as I go into 3G just up the road when we are in the car. Sounds like a network issue, have you asked for a new sim? It may help. Or you could report it to O2. Did your phone do this from new? Maybe change network, I know you have a good deal on O2 but 3 do unlimited internet with loads of texts and call time and if you are in the right area its much faster then O2 , You could get a p&g sim to try out the signal in your area. You can get 2000 minutes 5000 texts all you can eat data and if you get HSPA+ it leaves O2 in the dust, for £18 a month sim only. The iPhone 5 does DC-HSDPA which is about 5X faster than standard 3G. right now I'm happy with that and will leave 4G alone.

Simon · Jul 24, 2013, 11:10:05

That looks tempting, Gary. It's a bit of a devil you know kind of thing. My opinion of 3 has always been that they're the budget end of the market and you often get what you pay for, but I've no experience of them. £18 per month beats my £20 O2 deal, but... Hmm... I'll give it some thought. I'd need to find out what sort of coverage 3 have in this area before making any decisions.

mervl · Jul 25, 2013, 14:06:38

My experience of Three over a couple of years is that they used to be budget and aren't now, either on price or QoS.

However like every mobile operator service is variable depending on the level of congestion at the mast (and obviously, reception). Three have therefore, in my experience, struggled a bit in the major urban areas - which may be better served by more established operators with a greater number of longstanding masts, conversely Three seem to have been more active so far in improving coverage elsewhere.

EE seem to have got themselves into a mess with the decommissioning overlaps following the merger with T-Mobile but seem to be sorting themselves out.

On my edge of urban area, Three came along and have kept their mast up to date, Orange have eventually got round to improving theirs, and O2 and Voda have always been hopeless and still are, but are great in town. It's economics I suppose.

O2 might improve eventually with their recently won national spectrum obligation and using the proceeds from their sale of the landline business to Sky, but it all takes much longer to upgrade technology than we think. As always the unknown quantity is the backhaul which doesn't improve by magic.

Three, I surmise, score with a later and hence potentially more modern network. And none of them are charitable enterprises, they have a market and improve the network where it makes them more money. Voda, perhaps O2, have a strong business legacy as the earliest operators, Orange at least initially seemed to roll out along the major road networks beyond the urban areas (they used to claim to have a network designed for those "on the move") but I suspect backhaul is an issue from their low usage limits; and Three perhaps went for the domestic users "gap". All generalisations are wrong, I know, but I think they contain a grain of truth.

Glenn · Jul 25, 2013, 15:52:54

I got this sound bit from Graham Baxter COO at Three, "Over 50% of UK mobile internet traffic is handled by Three's network." Now whether that is solely Three's own network, or includes the network shared with EE as part of the MBNL project, I don't know.

mervl · Jul 25, 2013, 16:18:05

Could it be the major growth in mobile traffic is personal use; and how EE get away with the small allowances, high speeds on 4G for business users. And why Three are relaxed about 4G as for the type of personal use on smartphones, speed isn't a real issue beyond 3G+ but the amount of data allowances is.

Simon · Jul 25, 2013, 16:21:48

As I guess with all networks, it just depends on your area. I'll look at getting a Three PAYG Sim and see what the coverage is like here. Our trouble is Nimbyism. I am surrounded by little villages, who all object to having masts nearby. As has been said, O2 is fine in the town - but I'm just on the outskirts.

mervl · Jul 25, 2013, 17:14:07

Have you tried the check coverage query box towards the bottom of this page: http://www.three.co.uk/Support/Signal_and_Coverage
Fairly accurate in my area, but in others I'm sure it's probably a waste of space (as all these computer-generated things are).

Simon · Jul 25, 2013, 17:45:10

Yes, in the town it says Excellent, but where I am it says Good, but signal strength may vary, especially indoors, which is about where I am with O2.

I did do a rough calculation of my current usage on their PAYG tariff, and it would have cost me more than double I'm paying now, just on calls alone, without texts and Internet usage, so I'd need to go onto one of the set tariffs, but at first glance, I didn't see anything about contract terms. I'm sure it's there so will look properly later.

I have to say, it would need a significant improvement on my current deal for me to move from O2, as I'd never get the deal again if things didn't work out with a new provider.

Glenn · Jul 25, 2013, 17:52:31

They launched a 3,2,1 tariff a couple of weeks ago, 3p/min, 2p/text, 1p/mb, was it that one Simon?

Simon · Jul 25, 2013, 17:59:59

Yes. I used 137 minutes last month on calls, so at 3p per minute, that would have been just over forty quid. not including texts and Internet. I currently pay £21 for my O2 deal, which includes 600 minutes, 600 texts and unlimited Internet.

Simon · Jul 25, 2013, 18:01:32

Oh, hold on... It's four quid isn't it.

Glenn · Jul 26, 2013, 19:56:10

Here's one for you Simon http://www.hotukdeals.com/deals/three-mobile-sim-only-600-mins-5000-texts-1gb-data-9-90-a-month-min-12-months-after-1615552

Simon · Jul 26, 2013, 20:00:32

pctech · Jul 27, 2013, 17:31:12

While the coverage checkers are a good start from my days as mod on a mobile phone related forum I can tell you a lot of people took up contracts on the strength of these and then were somewhat agitated to find they couldn't actually get decent quality coverage where they actually wanted it where the coverage checker had allegedly said it was good.

I don't know whether this is still the case but most carried small print that it was based on computer predictions rather than actual drive testing by engineers but as I've not checked one in years I don't know whether this is still the case.

Coverage where I am in MK isn't particularly great on any network due to the large amount of plant life that adorns every spare patch of ground but is better than living in a complete concrete jungle I guess although it is becoming like that.