What would you do ?

[camdave]

Given that I prefer to buy my PCs from a 'bricks and mortar' source where I can see the machine before handing over my money I have come down to a choice of two options for spending up to £500 on a replacement for my wife's six year old XP desktop PC.

Typical (desktop) specs are;

John Lewis: HP machine, AMD 6 processor, 1TB hard disc, Windows 8 (8.1 by the time I actually buy), three year warranty and loaded with 'bonus' software – I don't want a Norton trial thank you.

Local computer company: Unbranded, i3 processor, 500 GB hard disc (may be 1TB in a couple of months), Windows 7, three year warranty and supplied only with OS and MS Security Essentials.

I'm not asking for advice as such but interested in which route people would choose; the second option is a bit cheaper in line with the lower spec.

[Simon]

JL are a reputable company, so you may be more certain with them that they will still be around for the next few years, in case any problems arise.  With so many of these little computer shops closing down, have you any guarantees that they won't suddenly vanish one night?

That said, you'd probably get better, more personal service from a small retailer, so I guess it's swings and roundabouts on that score. 

I think, personally, I'd go for the higher spec - you can always remove any software you don't want, or even wipe it and install Windows from new as soon as you get it out of the box. 

But I'm sure others will disagree. 

[Steve]

I think I currently would go for Windows 7 if moving from XP, however does your wife still need a desktop? The advent of tablets, reasonably priced laptops and good performing WiFi have moved a lot of users from the dark recesses of the study although that's still the place if 'real' work needs to be done.

[camdave]

She still needs a desktop as long as she is working on her family history (a never-ending project for both of us) plus accounts etc.
8/8.1 would be OK but I do wonder if we should skip them and wait for the mythical Windows 9 by which time my Vista desktop will need replacing as well. We could then share a computer !!!!!

[MisterW]

The A6, although it looks good on paper, doesn't come out too well against even a low spec I3 http://cpuboss.com/cpus/Intel-Core-i3-2100-vs-AMD-A6-5400K . I'd agree with Steve about Windows 7 vs 8 . The unbranded one from the local shop is going to be better for expanding in the future, as it will use standard components whereas the HP one will likely use proprietary bits. I'd want to know what motherboard and what size PSU were in the unbranded one though.
But then again if it was me I'd be building my own, since I've got Aria just down the road!
and of course Windows 7 vs 8 isn't an issue for me

[pctech]

Personally I'd go down the build to order route with someone like Scan as in my experience the consumer mass produced ones are preloaded with cr*p which maybe baked into the recovery image too.

Saying that though it is by no means certain which PC builders will be left standing if the consumer market dries up so yes you might be better sourcing the machine from someone like JL.

[camdave]

Thanks for all the comments.

On balance I don't think there is much to choose in terms of cost/value between JL and a system builder such as my local company who are actually quite a large outfit. But as 'pctech' says the c*** software on big name PCs will invariably return if you do a system recovery from the hidden partition.

I bought many PCs from Evesham for home and work over a number of years and rarely had any issues (until they sadly went out of business) so I might take my chances with the local source and get the spec. I want.

[Lona]

I would never consider any HP computers as I have had two and both gave problems.

I have had two Medion desktops and would recommend them to anyone. The one I have at the moment is over 6 years old and still in great working order.

[pctech]

I do like being able to select the components I want and although I could quite easily buy the bits and build it myself I didn't want the hassle of having to return any defective parts as my day job is troubleshooting software and online service issues.

This is why in my case I went for Scan and made sure they included a Windows DVD as although the machine was fairly clutter free the first thing I did was completely format the hard drive and just put Windows, the drivers and software I wanted on it.

[Simon]

If it had been built to order by Scan, I would have expected it to be ENTIRELY clutter free, or they're have had the bloody thing back!

[pctech]

In truth it was just simply that I like to ensure that space isn't taken up with stuff I don't want which MS may have insisted they load so that is why I always zap the image on a new system.

I would definitely buy another system from them as you do get exactly what you order.

[camdave]

Interesting to see that the John Lewis website currently offers 31 desktops out of which there are only two sub £500 'traditional' tower PCs compared with six or more a few months ago. Still, there's always PC World !!!

[D-Dan]

You could consider building your own. That way, you get exactly what you want, and you are better equipped to fix it if it goes wrong. These days, the cost will probably be not dissimilar from buying pre-built (unlike yesteryear when you could save a pretty penny, or get better performance for the same money). Personally, self-build remains my personal choice.

[Steve]

They've never added much on top for building a PC compared to the price Joe Blogs can buy the separate items for,  they get the economies of scale and that's where their profit lies. Building your own works well if you do not buy the latest spec but step back 6-12 months. I agree self build gets the PC you want, only if you know what that is!

[Gary]

In truth it was just simply that I like to ensure that space isn't taken up with stuff I don't want which MS may have insisted they load so that is why I always zap the image on a new system.

I would definitely buy another system from them as you do get exactly what you order.

Unless a part fails then they give you the difference back minus wear and tear instead of the components warranty I have read several times. So if  a graphics cards thats guaranteed for two years fails after one you will get a miserable amount back and they wont swap it for a new one, now thats not legal surely?

[Simon]

I would have thought they had to abide by the manufacturers warranty, and also the Sale of Goods act. 

[Gary]

I would have thought they had to abide by the manufacturers warranty, and also the Sale of Goods act. 

So have many people Simon  to be fair they may have cleaned their act up, but many people with components that failed got caught out a few years back.

[pctech]

not good to hear.

[stevenrw]

This may be after the event but..Have you thought of buying a mobo/processor/memory bundle from somebody like Aria. You can save all the bits that are not "obsolete" such as drives, power supply, case etc and just spend on the bits you need. Then you can install the OS of choice. All their bundles are pre-assembled and tested for compatibility so whilst they are not exactly "plug and play" they do offer a mid point between build yourself and out-and-out custom builds. Latest Intel chips offer HD graphics which are fine if you are not a gamer. I'm assuming you dont want to go for overclocked systems, just an updated everyday machine. http://www.aria.co.uk/Systems/Bundles/
I've used them before and find them pretty reliable.

[camdave]

Thanks for suggestion re. Aria. To be honest I am buying only a £400 system for light work so I am inclined to go with the 'off the shelf' option and the current computer is six years old. I stopped re-building work machines twenty years ago - it's all I can do to keep up with the rapid changes in technology today!

[talos]

I've built a couple for myself in the past, but now go for the bricks and mortar option, mainly because of cost and hassle, the hassle being the truism "It only takes a monkey to build them, but an expert to get them working", and of course I got older and less patient   On line from PC world has served me well in the past and the last 3 HP's have not let me down 

[camdave]

Well, it's nearly time to buy the replacement for my wife's desktop.

One more question before I make a decision; is it worth saving seventy pounds or so and buying a (Haswell) Pentium machine or would an i3 be better for future proofing?

Occasional editing of photos is probably the most processor intensive task, the rest is emails, internet, office applications and a family history program.

[Steve]

I think the i3 with hyper threading will be more useful for transcoding i.e. video editing etc.

[camdave]

Well, I collected my wife's new 'tower' from JL at Cambridge today. Lenovo H530s with W 8.1, i5 processor, 1TB HD plus 8GB SSD etc. - cost £500.00 which I am happy with.

Couldn't resist checking it out when I got home. Went through the MS account setup etc. and eventually the start screen came up. I clicked on the 'Lenovo Desktop' tile and what confronted me? - a perfectly normal desktop (even the recycle bin is still there in the top left hand corner)

What is all the fuss about Windows 8/8.1, or am I missing something?

[Simon]

It's probably been set to start in Desktop mode by default.  Click the Start 'button' and you'll see the tiles. 

[Glenn]

Just press the 'Windows' key. I use 8.0 everyday at work, I go on to the tiled screen maybe twice a day.

One of the best features of 8.0/8.1 is the search, no need to find the search option on the tiled screen, just type the name of the application, so you want Notepad, so just type note and it will appear.

[camdave]

Sorry, I have confused you; the computer displayed all the start-up tiles as expected (some/many of which I will get rid off) and also a 'Lenovo Desktop' tile. My point was that so far I have had no issues with 8/8.1 despite all the negative comments for the past year or so.

I admit it is only an hour or so since I set up the PC but I really can't understand why people say it is so different and difficult to use.
The tiles could, I'm sure, be quite useful some of the time.

[Glenn]

The vast majority of negative comments will come from people that have never used it.

8.1 can be configured to boot straight on to the desktop if desired. If you right click a tile it can be added to desktop taskbar or removed from the start screen.

[Technical Ben]

8.1 is fine. It's 8.0 that is problematic. For example, loading up IE may give you the desktop or the Metro version depending on where you were/load it from or it's settings. Each has different features. I think most of the missing required GUI elements and program options are added to the 8.1 update.

Saying that, I still find almost no functionality of Metro helpful. Plus the hot corners are actually counter productive to any work I'd want to do (have painting tools that would activate it in error etc)

[camdave]

Latest update: My wife's Lenovo is great and no issues with 8.1 but my five year old Sony all-in-one running Vista is driving me up the wall. Despite two complete re-installs I am still getting problems with programs not opening properly (usually 'xxxx not responding) and slow startup and shutdowns. I am convinced there is a problem with the hardware which is causing this so I think it is time for a replacement.

I am impressed with the Lenovo, it's a good spec. and not a lot of 'bloatware'. JL are currently offering a machine with much the same spec. as my wife's but with an AMD A8 6500 processor. Given that I don't game, edit video or do heavy photo editing would an AMD (with dedicated graphis card) be OK for general use. I realise it won't be as 'fast' as the Intel i5 but in practice would this make a real difference?

[Technical Ben]

Yep. AMD should still be ok if the price is right. It's only if you can get a comparative i3 or Intel at the same price it's worth going over to intel.

A quick glance says it's comparable to a Intel Core i3-4330T @ 3.00GHz. And priced very competitive for it's performance (though might be American site ).
http://www.cpubenchmark.net/cpu.php?cpu=AMD+A8-6500+APU

PS, by sheer coincidence it is the same performance as my old AMD PhenII, though my experience is bias, as mine is massively OverClocked.
But even normal it runs web and stuff fine. The only thing to watch is power consumption on the higher end AMD, but I don't think it effects that series.