Increasing consistent small packet loss

[Bill]

what as in a " we've made a balls up but wont say so "

Got it in one

[Gary]

I see IDNet had a little glitch yesterday at 4:30pm ish but not at 1:30pm this time... if the could rid themselves of that things would be spot on.

[mervl]

In the absence of the BT Wholesale network achieving a nivana state of perfection (and I wouldn't hold my breath on that one), it seems to me if Ofcom got their finger out and modified the regulatory Network Plan and PIA  to allow alternative network operators access to the Cabs for competing services (at the moment that means Opal, presumably) there'd be competition which is the next best thing. But of course then there would be other things to complain about. 

[esh]

Oddly I've been getting bursts of packet loss since about 2 weeks ago. Before that my graphs were near perfect. The packet loss doesn't seem to coincide with me using the connection so I'm assuming it's not at my end. Seems to be on the 5% level with spikes to 20% and one at 50%.

[Bill]

Spikes greater than about 25% usually mean a brief disconnect, not necessarily long enough for the router to notice. Got a link to a relevant BQM?

It could be that you've been caught in the cross-fire as BT re-arrange their SVLANs (or whatever they've been doing), I noticed something similar around the time my drastic packet loss was cured.

[Gary]

Interesting to see that once again on the weekend IDNets 1:30pm ish and later afternoon packetloss are awol... 

[Bill]

I don't think there's enough evidence to blame that on IDNet... OK, it doesn't happen with other ISPs but it doesn't happen with all IDNet's customers either. Me, for one.

The jury's still out afaic.

[Gary]

I don't think there's enough evidence to blame that on IDNet... OK, it doesn't happen with other ISPs but it doesn't happen with all IDNet's customers either. Me, for one.

The jury's still out afaic.

It happens on IDNets own TBBQM I think that says a lot, Bill... also considering Simon mentioned a business user as possibly  the cause, that gives the game away a bit..

[Gary]

The pattern I mentioned started about the time Mavericks was released, which it was initially blamed on.  We have some good days I will grant you that but that very distinct pattern has been happening for over 6mths, and never at weekends, now once fair enough, twice maybe, but this is beyond a coincidence and is totally unique to IDNet and their dedicated TBBQM and the few others on craigs for instance. That's just my observation.

[esh]

Well this is what I'm seeing on the problematic days. There aren't a lot of spikes, but they are big enough that they cause things actively streaming data (such as VOIP and games) to drop.


This is on the 19th (Wednesday):


And the 21st (Friday) - note that after everyone was complaining about all their games and streams dropping I gave the router a kick at around midnight, hence the big red bit:


Earlier in the month (8th, Saturday):


And another one earlier in the month (5th, Wednesday):


Anyone know if FTTC is better for this sort of thing? I don't care about getting any higher bandwidth connection than I already have (13Mbit) but I'm a bit picky about latency and loss.

[Baz]

Blimey Esh   I wish I could get my latency like that, im on nearly 40 mark at the moment 

[esh]

The latency did increase very slightly when I moved from ADSL to ADSL2 but I suspect that is just part of the technology. Buying newer, more expensive hardware did notably decrease latency and also gave much more stable latencies.

[Bill]

Ah well, it was nice while it lasted... ie from Wednesday all the way to Saturday, a whole 4 days

Yesterday:



Support are aware (and, I suspect, not surprised)

On the plus side, my profile has gone back up to 64 point odd from the low of 52 a week or two back.

[Gary]

The packetloss last night is on quite a few TBBQM's from IDNet, including their own, it seems to be something even Zen get now, but maybe to a lesser degree possible due to their size. BT's graphs show some packetloss last night and a few plusnet ones look scary around the same time, not sure if there was an event of some kind. Sorry to see the congestion back, Bill. Have you got access to any other peoples TBBQM's in your area? Just be interesting to see how it effects each provider, as BT don't seem able bothered to monitor it themselves 

[mervl]

Um, I wonder if for VDSL2 the remaining problems are mainly exchange and region-based. The last detectable packet loss on my TBQM here in the far east, was a brief isolated instance on the 19th at lunchtime; totally clear since and no latency spikes either. Speeds have declined but I suspect that's the DSLAM doing its thing rather than a network issue as it seems to have been adjusted with a lower error tolerance.

[Bill]

Have you got access to any other peoples TBBQM's in your area? Just be interesting to see how it effects each provider, as BT don't seem able bothered to monitor it themselves 

No, those who I know anything about all use dynamic IPs, so no BQM

My own suspicion is that someone moved users off my SVLAN, thus solving my problem, and a few days later someone else (trying to sort out a different SVLAN) spotted an uncongested one (mine) and moved a load of users on to it to solve his problem

Left and right hands etc... or maybe Fred Karno's Army would be more appropriate.

[Gary]

peeds have declined but I suspect that's the DSLAM doing its thing rather than a network issue as it seems to have been adjusted with a lower error tolerance.

If speeds are declining and you have FTTC thats probably crosstalk as more users get plugged in. It appears Vectoring has started in Ireland, sadly in the UK only Huawei cabs can I think at this time be easily updated. The ECI need new line cards, very short sighted of BT using M41's not V41's as a cost cutting exercise on the ECI cabs . No real surprise though but I cant see BT replacing every line card in ECI cabs somehow.

[Gary]

No, those who I know anything about all use dynamic IPs, so no BQM

My own suspicion is that someone moved users off my SVLAN, thus solving my problem, and a few days later someone else (trying to sort out a different SVLAN) spotted an uncongested one (mine) and moved a load of users on to it to solve his problem

Left and right hands etc... or maybe Fred Karno's Army would be more appropriate.

Sounds about right, Bill.  its does seem that when hot svlans get cleared it does not take long for them to get congested again.

[Technical Ben]

The packetloss last night is on quite a few TBBQM's from IDNet, including their own, it seems to be something even Zen get now, but maybe to a lesser degree possible due to their size. BT's graphs show some packetloss last night and a few plusnet ones look scary around the same time, not sure if there was an event of some kind. Sorry to see the congestion back, Bill. Have you got access to any other peoples TBBQM's in your area? Just be interesting to see how it effects each provider, as BT don't seem able bothered to monitor it themselves 

That is very interesting. If it's congestion, pushed towards the smaller ISPs, but effecting all, and "not there" as BT say, but effecting BTs own network... I might get some popcorn to watch what happens next.

[Bill]

What is likely to happen is that BTW will shuffle the SVLANs around a bit, announce that they have taken action to cure the technical problems (without claiming to have succeeded!) and that a packet loss of 5% is now considered to be within acceptable limits.

And I wish I were joking

[zappaDPJ]

Ah well, it was nice while it lasted... ie from Wednesday all the way to Saturday, a whole 4 days

Yesterday:



Support are aware (and, I suspect, not surprised)

On the plus side, my profile has gone back up to 64 point odd from the low of 52 a week or two back.

That's really disappointing and quite worrying. I'm currently living in dread that the same thing will happen to my connection but seems ok so far. One slight oddity since my connection has been fixed, iPlayer buffers every 10 minutes or so but I think it must be their end as Netflix and the other streaming services I use are fine.

[Bill]

I've seen a few other complaints about iPlayer recently, so I suspect the Beeb are having troubles. I seldom use it.

So far the congestion is nowhere near as bad as before, as you can see- only a little bit of red. But I'm crossing everything I've two of that can cross!

[Gary]

Anyone else notice a drop in IDNet yesterday at 2PM Packetloss shows 100% so not quite sure what happened. Its shown very clearly on IDNets dedicated TBBQM. Its also on a few other peoples BBM that I can see.

http://www.thinkbroadband.com/ping/share-thumb/3e9f40bbdf719aef79db49d8d5f4522c.png

[Bill]

Anyone else notice a drop in IDNet yesterday at 2PM

Announcement
We just experienced a brief routing interruption and are investigating the cause.

The problem was caused by a configuration error. This has now been rectified. We would like to apologise for the inconvenience.

Posted: 2014-03-27 14:03:47 Updated: 2014-03-27 14:36:41

[Gary]

Announcement
We just experienced a brief routing interruption and are investigating the cause.

The problem was caused by a configuration error. This has now been rectified. We would like to apologise for the inconvenience.

Posted: 2014-03-27 14:03:47 Updated: 2014-03-27 14:36:41

Cheers, Bill  I wondered why everything went pear shaped when I was downloading. I rarely check the status page as it does not always show incidents.