Looking for Android device

[Steve]

Probably wanting the impossible, however I've been playing around with the Torque Pro app on an old 'simless' HTC phone. I'm just wondering whether it's a passing phase or time to invest. I'm not desperately keen to swap from iPhone to Android but it is an option but I think it may add hassle as the rest of my kit is Apple although I welcome comments on that aspect. Obviously it's nice that everything is in sync across all devices but I assume there are ways round it.

I need a reasonable size screen, (I think for instance the Fire HD is too big for mounting) with a sharp display and it needs reasonable cpu performance . My son's got an S4 mini but that's too small for my fingers and eyes to use comfortably so am I stuck with the S4 possibly (is that not due an update?) or the cheaper Nexus 5 32Gb which seems value for money from Google Play. I would apreciate any comments regarding the Nexus and the S4.


I can't do what I want on the iPhone as the car's ECU custom PIDs i.e. knock retard etc don't seem to be available, I could buy a custom gauge but that's about the same as a phone

[Simon]

I suppose you have to weigh up whether what you can do with an Android device is worth the cost of what you're likely to lose in terms of compatibility with your other devices, and, of course, there must be things which the iPhone can do that the Android device can't.

I've also considered a platform change, at various times, but it always seems to come back to compatibility with current accessories, and the general ease of use (syncing, etc) with Apple devices.  Also, there's just so much choice now with the Android platform, it's almost overwhelming, and I think I'd find it hard to decide just which brand / device to go for, as there are quite a few that I initially like the look of, such the HTC One (apparently being updated early next year), and the top end Sony handsets.

[pctech]

My Samsung is now quite a solid device (it received a firmware upgrade yesterday), its running 4.1.2 Jelly Bean

Current price for an Ace 2 from Amazon (SIM Free) is 157 quid

[Steve]

I can probably drop the iPhone anywhere to a certain extent and it will survive, compatibility with other devices is not crucial with the phone as I tend to use the iPad for smartphone like apps. I'm quite tempted by the Nexus 5 largely because of the screen size but the reported battery life is a worry.

[Glenn]

Is a Samsung Note 2/3 too big?

[Steve]

Is a Samsung Note 2/3 too big?

I think it probably is for me to use as phone as well, they are quite a size and sit somewhere between a phone and tablet imo likewise I think I need something bigger than an Ace to get a few dials on display although most of the data will be logged. Obviously the more data you log the more oomph is needed!

[MisterW]

Have a look at the new Moto G , it's comparable in performance to the Nexus 4 but only £130 Sim free for the 8gb version.

[Steve]

That's quite a bargain especially considering what I'm used to paying although if I replace the 4S I would need a decent camera. I appreciate it's not all about the number of pixels but the 8MP on the iPhone is a nice compromise . The next question is memory I know I can live with 32 Gb but 16Gb not sure as neither the Nexus or the Moto G have SD expansion although I'm happy to use cloud storage.

[pctech]

From 4.3 onwards Android doesn't support running apps from the SD card so that's prob why Steve.

Bit short sighted (from Google's point of view) though

[Steve]

Ah! It's quite interesting for me looking at Android I've had it running on VM on OSX for a week or so, you are released from the strait jacket of iOS somewhat but I would like a phone that get's an update during it's lifetime as well . I wonder if they've sorted the camera out on the Nexus otherwise a Moto G 16mb really is a bargain.

[pctech]

I suspect the G  will get KitKat soon as it is designed to improve performance on all types of devices

[Glenn]

http://www.pocket-lint.com/news/125189-motorola-moto-g-will-hit-us-with-android-4-4-kitkat-while-uk-must-wait-until-end-of-january

[Technical Ben]

From 4.3 onwards Android doesn't support running apps from the SD card so that's prob why Steve.

Bit short sighted (from Google's point of view) though

There official phones don't even have card readers, from any of the manufactures. So it seems a requirement, not a missed opportunity.
If I could sing, I'd let anyone hear. If I could paint, let anyone see. If I could write, let anyone read. Who am I to say they cannot? Don't think they'd let me starve either.   

I#m especially not worried about the Google directors starving! 

[Steve]

There's an additional bit of background info, last week off Flea Bay I took delivery of a secondhand supposed Grade A iPhone 4S(universal gadgets) this was bought to replace my wife's 3GS. On arrival the battery was flat and the power button had no discernible click but otherwise it looked ok. On charging it started to beep every 5 secs with no screen display whatsoever, so I thought it's knackered although iTunes was happy.  It took some fairly pointed emails from myself for them to agree to take the phone back and issue a refund. All ended well I have my £234 back but my wife still needs a phone. She is happy to buy my 4S and I intend to see if the grass is any greener elsewhere.

I've done a bit of preparatory work this AM regarding contacts syncing with iCloud and Gmail (CalDAV) it all seemed very painless , so I'll have another look at phones, it's probably going to be the Nexus 5 but the Moto G seems a bargain.

[Simon]

This might be worth remembering:

http://www.pcpro.co.uk/blogs/2013/11/28/switching-from-iphone-to-android-switch-off-imessage/

[Steve]

Thanks, it's not only on the phone though iMessage is in OSX and on the iPad so you've got to be careful they don't end up somewhere you never look often, I've also cancelled my iTunes Match subscription which renews shortly, I am being radical. Currently uploading my songs to Google Play which is free for 20,000! As they say frying pan and fire, if it doesn't work out I'll be back to the 4S which is no problem to me and my wife will gladly accept the Android I'm sure.

[Gary]

I did like the Note 2, great phablet, If you get something like the Sony Xperia Z1 you can move your iTunes and iPhoto accounts to your phone via a Sony app which links with iTunes. The only issues I see with android is fragmentation, and a lack of updates unless you have a nexus. Also getting something bigger than 16GB as with OS on board you loose alot of space. the S4 came with 8GB out of 16GB at first release. Also there is malware to be aware of, lookout seems to be one if the best antivirus/malware apps.

Personally I am far to invested with apps etc to swap and having seen android phone have issues running current apps because they only got one upgrade and that was maybe 6mths behind the original Google release because the manufacturer wants to sell a shiny new handset and not and provide regular updates, I would not move. Also having seen HTC's so called 'support' I would really miss Apples support network with Applecare+. I know my phone can stay current for up to 4 years on iOS and that suits me better at this time. If I wanted something bigger I would get an iPad mini to take out an about rather than an Android handset, I think Windows phones may be something to look at over the next year, less fragmentation and Nokia are building some great handsets now.   

[Steve]

It may a dangerous world outside Apple's walled garden and I'll miss AppleCare, however the 5S doesn't inspire me to spend an additional £300 but then again that's not the main reason for considering the move, as stated in the OP the App I need does not run on iOS and there's nothing comparable that will read Mazda ECU custom PIDs. So hopefully My wife and I will be happy with our 'new' phones.

[pctech]

It's not dangerous at all, just needs caution.

Provided you have up to date AV and anti malware (I'm currently running Webroot Secureanywhere and Malwarebytes mobile) and don't get cracked apps and sideload them you will be fine.

I expect the author of the app probably did try and write it for iOS but as it doesn't have the blessing of the motor manufacturers it didn't make it through approval.

[Steve]

There are apps for iOS but it's the uniqueness of custom PiDs for a particular Marque. Car manufacturers don't publish their PIDs however OBD2 and CANBUS has a generic standard PIDs which give limited information, some of the more important tuning sensors are not available without knowing the custom PID address and that's where the money comes in. There's nothing illegal or hacking involved all your doing is asking the ECU what's present at a particular address. Why is it not on iOS I've no idea, it does use a bluetooth port scanner which is an absolute no no for iOS like ad hoc WiFi is for Android without root access.

Most Apps used to start on iOS and then port to Android but I guess times are changing.

[Glenn]

Torque pro isn't new, it's been around for at least 3 years now, the programmer is very active keeping it updated, issuing updates almost weekly.

[Steve]

It does seem to be a well sorted App Glenn and you can log the data online as well . As I said before there's nothing on iOS to compare it with. Innovate OT2 is a OBD2 scanner for the iOS however there's no Mazda custom PIDs, you can get a Ford plugin to which they are related but no guarantee it will work as you wish, the outlay for this is not insignificant either.

Perhaps the author has no interest in iOS or can't afford the entry into the bluetooth stack that Apple would no doubt charge.

[pctech]

Wasn't for one moment suggesting anything was illegal but as the manufacturers would rather you go to a dealer who has bought the appropriate software from them or their preferred software company they aren't going to make it easy are they.

Good luck with your new phones, I think you will like them.

[Steve]

I also think the third party tuners who have discovered the specific addresses aren't going to give the information away either for free. EcuTek for instance have made it their business and I suspect there's a bit of trial and error involved in finding the information.

I think I may enjoy the new phone but only time will tell, distant selling regulations and my wife's need for a new phone are my back up.

[Gary]

It may a dangerous world outside Apple's walled garden and I'll miss AppleCare, however the 5S doesn't inspire me to spend an additional £300 but then again that's not the main reason for considering the move, as stated in the OP the App I need does not run on iOS and there's nothing comparable that will read Mazda ECU custom PIDs. So hopefully My wife and I will be happy with our 'new' phones.

Good luck with your new phones, I'm sure you will be well happy with them. I need phones to be one handed, its hard going out with a dinner tray sized phone while in a wheelchair, and I have no love for Android or Google.

When Apple next years ups its screen size I'll be sticking with the 5S, its faster than even the fastest Androids out there at this moment (that will change in day or so I bet) but I can use it one handed, that's the most important thing for me. If phones get bigger and bigger I may go retro and grab the old Nokia 8210 I bought a while back, and be happy with whatever tablet I have by then.

[psp83]

Something must be in the air, I know quite alot of people going to Android from iOS.

I am changing over myself in the new year, going with the Note 3 as I find iPhone's are just to small for my large hands.

[Gary]

Something must be in the air, I know quite alot of people going to Android from iOS.

I am changing over myself in the new year, going with the Note 3 as I find iPhone's are just to small for my large hands.

I think its swings and roundabouts, as I see it phones are phones should be one handed devices, not dinner plates. Tablets are for computing really. Also iOS7 is on 74% of iPhones 1.1% of Kitkat is on Android Phones, froyo has more penetration than even jelly bean, that kind of fragmentation, on the non nexus phones put me off. Android is given away free to manufacturers for a reason...to make shiny new phones every six months and then in-between multiple versions of the same thing with tweaked specks. But each to their own, as I said if the iPhone gets big I'm going old school 

[pctech]

Something must be in the air, I know quite alot of people going to Android from iOS.

I am changing over myself in the new year, going with the Note 3 as I find iPhone's are just to small for my large hands.

You'll need a wheelbarrow to carry that bad boy around 

[Glenn]

Chap at work thinks the Note 3 is the best phone he has tested, he may only have a phone for a couple of weeks at a time. If you want a good camera in your phone he did recommend the Lumix 1020.

[pctech]

Hi Glenn

Dd you mean the Nokia Lumia 1020?

[Glenn]

  yes I do.

[psp83]

You'll need a wheelbarrow to carry that bad boy around 

Hehe, I don't mind the larger screen size, just right for my hands

[Steve]

I think its swings and roundabouts, as I see it phones are phones should be one handed devices, not dinner plates. Tablets are for computing really. Also iOS7 is on 74% of iPhones 1.1% of Kitkat is on Android Phones, froyo has more penetration than even jelly bean, that kind of fragmentation, on the non nexus phones put me off. Android is given away free to manufacturers for a reason...to make shiny new phones every six months and then in-between multiple versions of the same thing with tweaked specks. But each to their own, as I said if the iPhone gets big I'm going old school 

I agree Gary it is swings and roundabouts although I've never forgiven Apple for consigning my iPad 1 to the iOS scrap heap at an early stage in it's life . Ultimately I've no loyalty,I will use whatever suits me, my move to Apple was a revelation for me some 4-5 years ago, Android may well be like my flirtation with Linux before the move to Apple, it was interesting but it just didn't suit me at the time.

[Steve]

Well the Nexus 5, I ordered Sunday arrived yesterday bloody hell , I picked it up from the PO this AM . No impressions yet except it works and I've just spent an age trying to workout how to upgrade Kitkat 4.4 to 4.4.2 manually . I've got there in the end. The iPhone is all backed up, it will be soon time to swap the SIM. Just wondering whether I need a screen protector , I hate them on the iPhone and the Nexus is in an official case.

[Glenn]

I've not scratched the screen my Nexus 4 so far, it lives in my pocket for a few hours each day.

[Steve]

I am tempted not to bother. I'm cr*p at applying them and then a month later they look bloody awful in my experience.

[Steve]

Initial impressions: flimsy,poor sound quality,screen colours washed out. I'm enjoying the OS, so we'll plod on it is after all £300 cheaper than an iPhone 5S equivalent.

[Simon]

I guess, as with most things, you get what you pay for.   

[Steve]

That's my opinion although people criticise Apple for the cost of their products there is in my opinion an inherent quality in the build. I was not expecting the Nexus to be a robust piece of hardware and I'm glad it's not cost a fortune, but I am enjoying the android OS at the moment. There's degree of flexibility about the OS, it's customisable, you feel to a certain extent your in charge and not the other way round. It will be good to try the camera out in daylight as I think that will be the deal breaker, if it's comparable to the 4S in PQ it's probably for keeps.

[mervl]

That's the "trouble" with Android - you have to do your homework.  Some of us find that's the beauty of what we enjoy about it. I've still got the "old" Moto RAZRi, and I like their build. (But it fails at being a piece of electronic jewellery). I find the xda forums a useful source of advice as long as you put the effort in to recognise the dross. All the cameras, I think, are disappointing, but I usually find I can improve the pics with the right software apps for what I want to do.

[Technical Ben]

Initial impressions: flimsy,poor sound quality,screen colours washed out. I'm enjoying the OS, so we'll plod on it is after all £300 cheaper than an iPhone 5S equivalent.

No expansion slot put me off. Being able to use it as an SD card drive (usb etc) is a big bonus even if they don't allow sideloading anymore (I'd only go open source etc, but not having that function is annoying).

[Steve]

As Mitch said earlier I think the expansion slot is a luxury of the past, however for me it's not a problem, don't forget I come from an iPhone.

[Technical Ben]

It's the simplicity of it all. Yes I can save to a cloud, but if I set the phone to default to the memory card, and it bricks, I can just swap it out.

It's generally about selling less for more these days. With the exception of the CPU/RAM, but it's not always put to good use. (Do we need 2gb for candy crush? )

[Steve]

Camera seems to be ok for a phone not quite the quality of the 4S if I'm being honest. Stuck an order in today for the official wireless charger (which I'd not seen available until this am), that will make life easier as that miniusb I find needs my specs on to connect without damage.

[Steve]

Google Play seem a bit odd. I've just received an email this am to say my phone has been shipped with tracking information, the first attempt at delivery was on the 9th and picked up by myself on the 10th.

[mervl]

Google Play seem a bit odd. I've just received an email this am to say my phone has been shipped with tracking information, the first attempt at delivery was on the 9th and picked up by myself on the 10th.

They rely on the information they receive from the carrier. So if the carriers systems are slow (and it's not an uncommon occurrence recently - perhaps a reflection of the volume of business) . . . depends whether you think too early is worse than too late, I suppose. Can't see why Google Play is "odd" in this respect?

[Steve]

Odd perhaps was the wrong term but I did find it strange to receive notice of a dispatch with tracking (by email) from google 3 days after the order had arrived at it's destination. Therefore it was unexpected and delivered to the sodding PO. I have another order with them for the Wireless charger which is said to be for dispatch on the 15th I guess that will arrive today. Of course I'm glad it's arrived early but I rather not stand inline at the PO either.

The carrier was Parcelforce which could explain everything I suppose.


Edit: I've just received tracking for the wireless charger and it's not arrived yet, perhaps there's something amiss!

[MisterW]

Have a look at the new Moto G , it's comparable in performance to the Nexus 4 but only £130 Sim free for the 8gb version.

Well I succumbed and ordered one from Tesco at the weekend Cost me £47 and £26 in Clubcard vouchers for the 8Gb version. Collected Monday evening and got unlock code from ebay for £2.03 on Tuesday. Now working fine on Giffgaff!. Very impressed so far, superb display and performance. Had a bit of a problem with the Bluetooth Hands free on the car, the phone kept crashing and rebooting when it tried to download the contacts. Seems that some odd characters had been inserted in the data when exported from my old phone. A quick edit of the contacts and it's all fine now. Only problem I have now is where to put it in the car, the oddments tray where the old phone used to sit isn't quite wide enough to take the Moto, it catches the power button on the side of the tray and shuts it down if you're not careful

[Simon]

You can get various stick on windscreen mounts from Amazon from as little as a fiver. 

[Steve]

Not keen on windscreen mounts, one they leave a mark and two they are with phone attached a dangerous projectile if you hit something. I've invested in a couple of bits from Brodit which should arrive sometime in the new year. Btw I'm keeping the Nexus and my wife is happy with the 4S, I'm currently off work with a back problem and the inbuilt pedometer comes in handy , minimum 10,000 steps per day!

Glenn, press quote not modify 

[MisterW]

I don't need to see it, the car has Bluetooth  integrated with the SatNav display. I just need somewhere for it to sit. The oddment tray between the front seats is ideal as the 12v socket is conveniently situated close by for charging. I'll have to knock up some form of holder to hold the phone vertically in the tray so the power button can't contact anything.

[Glenn]

Not keen on windscreen mounts, one they leave a mark and two they are with phone attached a dangerous projectile if you hit something. I've invested in a couple of bits from Brodit which should arrive sometime in the new year. Btw I'm keeping the Nexus and my wife is happy with the 4S, I'm currently off work with a back problem and the inbuilt pedometer comes in handy , minimum 10,000 steps per day!

Only 9000 to go Steve, hope the back improves soon.

[Simon]

Indeed, not what you need over the festive season. 

[Steve]

The alcohol is good for it, it takes me about 80 mins to walk 10,000 steps I've managed it for the last couple of days so hopefully on the mend.

[Glenn]

Rubbing or drinking alcohol? 

[Steve]

If it's less than 40% I'll drink it 

[psp83]

So I bought the Galaxy Note 3 earlier than I planned, oh well... 

Paid £500 for it (sim free / network unlocked)... I'm not missing iOS one bit, I'm wondering to myself why I waited this long to change from Apple.

Its a great phone 

[Steve]

Certainly Paul it's not something to be afraid of, I'm quite pleased with myself that I've made the transition without too much trauma.

[psp83]

Certainly Paul it's not something to be afraid of, I'm quite pleased with myself that I've made the transition without too much trauma.

The only issue I had was the phone importing everything and anything from my Google account, then I had to download an app to remove all the synced contacts I didn't want.

I'm sure there was a way of avoiding this if I read the manual, but I'm typical bloke, get the device, turn it on and start filling in the on screen prompts 

[Steve]

I miss the iOS control centre but it's nice to have the apps in alphabetical order, one issue so far with WiFi authentication which resolved with a reboot.

[psp83]

I miss the iOS control centre but it's nice to have the apps in alphabetical order, one issue so far with WiFi authentication which resolved with a reboot.

I'm sure there's a way to add widgets to the notification panel, I've seen some apps add it (e.g. Samsung TV remote) added a basic controller to my notifications panel..

The thing I like with Android is having nearly all the control options in the notification panel or 2 finger swipe down, at least I don't have to keep going into the settings any more

[MisterW]

The only issue I had was the phone importing everything and anything from my Google account, then I had to download an app to remove all the synced contacts I didn't want.

Yes I had had a slightly different issue with that!. I've had a Nexus 7 for a while now and it's never had anything in the contacts list cos it's no use , it's not a phone. Anyway having got the Moto G recenetly and imported contacts from my old Nokia N95 I was sort of surprised to see my contacts magically appear on my Nexus as well. Figured it had to be via my google account but I'm not really happy with google having all my contacts details. Having discovered that Android enables all the sync options by default I then went through and disabled most of them. Exported my contacts from the Moto for safe keeping and then removed them all from my google account.
A tip for easy editing of contacts on an Android phone, use Airdroid, it's an app which allows access to the phone via wifi from a browser. I've only used it for transferring files before but it has facilities to access the Call Log, Messages and Contacts as well.

[Steve]

Interestingly that's the app I installed this morning. I keep wondering if I should gain root access but since I'm not sure what extra it will give me I'm probably best not bothering.

[MisterW]

I did originally root my Nexus 7, mainly to be able to use a 3g dongle and Stickmount. TBH it was more trouble than it was worth as OTA updates tend to get upset.
Airdroid is very useful though.

[Steve]

Thanks, it would be a bit of time and effort to do so, I can perhaps see an argument for it in 18 months time.