Draytek 2860n & G.INP

[Tech Dude]

I have a Draytek 2860n (FTTC) that's been sync'd @ around 52 to 54 MB for ages.

In February / March 2015 my sync rate dropped and latency increased on the back of a line fault. I thought that the DLM made some changes and that I'd have to wait for recovery. Sync rate dropped to mid 30's with latency going up. A reboot after waiting for days often resulted in an even lower sync rate.

I looked at various Draytek firmware revisions with G.INP support: 3.7.5 / 3.7.8 / 3.7.8.1 / recently released G.INP BETA which have improved my sync rate, reduced the latency BUT has introduced a host of issues (as listed below), resulting in me reloading a non G.INP version of firmware (listed a STANDARD, not with Vectoring / G.INP) on the Draytek site.

It seems that G.INP has been activated on my line (down stream only) when looking at the line stats with interleaving either set to Interleave or Fast, dependant on the firmware used during the test. I seem to also get different results when using the BT Wholesale Speed Tester using different firmware (with non G.INP reporting more than a 10+ MB drop in my profile in minutes which I can restore with other firmware.

Results of testing (G.INP / Vectoring firmware:

1. Sync rate recovers significantly (although not holding a stable connection for some firmware with frequent re-syncs)
2. Latency drops (with limited / no packet loss)
3. HTTP traffic is highly erratic (browsing both faster / slower with frequent stalls, not functional - as if name resolution & routing stops working)
4. POP3 protocol fails, STMP seems to work
5. Vodafone Sure Signal (Alcatel Lucent 9361 FEMTO/3G signal booster) is NO LONGER able to establish an outbound connection to a remote host / does not connect using the G.INP firmware which also provides support for Vectoring).
6. Some delays in establishing other outbound VPN services (I have tested with VPN capabilities disables as well)

I'm having to run non G.INP firmware on a G.INP enabled line - running slower with increased latency.

Maybe a 10 day run without a re-sync will help, maybe not ?

Any advice or suggestions will be greatly appreciated !

Thank you.

[Bill]

Any advice or suggestions will be greatly appreciated !

You don't say whether you're on a Huawei or ECI cabinet- if it's ECI then I think you're probably stuffed until BT can get their act together. Gary may have some other suggestions, he's having problems on an ECI cab as well.

If it's Huawei then it's Draytek who need to get their firmware sorted out. Until then (assuming the Draytek has an Ethernet WAN port) you could do worse than getting an HG512 off Ebay and using that...

[Tech Dude]

Hi Bill, thanks for you response.

I'm connected to a Huawei 288 cabinet (Broadcom chipset - I think ?).

The Draytek 2860n is a multi port ADSL/ VDSL router which an ADSL / VDSL interface on WAN1 and option to connect to modem via WAN2, WAN3 & 4 allows connectivity via various approved 3G dongles. http://www.draytek.co.uk/products/business/vigor-2860#9-specification

If I understand the specs correctly, this device should support G.INP / G.998.4.

I've been using WAN1 connecting directly to my BT socket.

I have a Huawei HG 612 which has not been connected since installation which I've wired up and connected via WAN 2. This seems to sync at an even lower rate Draytek when running non G.INP firmware, I suspect it could do with a firmware upgrade to deal with G.INP.

When connecting via (WAN2 / PPPoE) I also run into issue connecting my Vodafone Suresignal, which is reliant on a MTU of 1500, this only available on the Draytek via WAN1 (PPPoA / PPPoE bridge functionality), WAN2 (via PPPoE) is limited to an MTU of 1492 which does not work with the Sure Signal (Alcatel Lucent).

My EE Femto connected to the same circuit (Cisco) works with any configuration.

I see that Draytek has posted new firmware on their UK web site. They seem to be the same version as those available from their global site which I downloaded a few weeks ago and have been testing.

I need to have a look at these, retest and see whether I have any better luck !

I'm wondering whether this (G.INP) is the root cause of the loss in sync / increase in latency ?

Any further thoughts would be greatly appreciated !

Thank you.

[Bill]

I have a Huawei HG 612 which has not been connected since installation which I've wired up and connected via WAN 2. This seems to sync at an even lower rate Draytek when running non G.INP firmware, I suspect it could do with a firmware upgrade to deal with G.INP.

When connecting via (WAN2 / PPPoE) I also run into issue connecting my Vodafone Suresignal, which is reliant on a MTU of 1500, this only available on the Draytek via WAN1 (PPPoA / PPPoE bridge functionality), WAN2 (via PPPoE) is limited to an MTU of 1492 which does not work with the Sure Signal (Alcatel Lucent).

My mention of the HG512 was a typo, sorry, it should have been 612 of course

First- check it's the later version of the HG612, it should have 3B writ large on the label. I'm not sure of the compatibility of the earlier ones. If it needs an upgrade the DSLAM should, afaik, do that automatically when it detects a BT modem with non-G.INP firmware, but it may not be immediate (again afaik).

I have no idea about the Suresignal... but if it won't work with an MTU of 1492 then you may have a problem because PPPoE needs that value to allow for an 8-byte overhead. If you've been using 1500 you may have been getting packet fragmentation.

Frankly, I'm out of my depth on this one. Hopefully someone more knowledgeable can come in.

[Tacitus]

Bit tangential to this thread but I've been running a Draytek 2760 since I got fibre.  I'm actually on the capped 40mbps service so strictly speaking G.INP is not likely to offer a significant benefit.  Like the other Drayteks it uses a Lantiq chipset.  As I've said elsewhere I get a ping of around 31/32, but since G.INP was enabled the max attainable rate dropped from around 56 to some 50. 

I've just swapped to a Zyxel SBG-3300 which has a Broadcom chipset as does the Huawei cabinet I'm on. The reported SNR has doubled from 5 to around 10dB, whilst the ping has dropped to 18ms - still high for a fibre line, but as I'm not a gamer it doesn't really matter that much.  Max attainable is back up to 58 so it does seem as though the benefits of G.INP are mixed. 

Vectoring is also enabled on my cabinet but I've not played with any of the Draytek Vector firmware or the alternative modem codes, which I'm told can make a significant difference.
 

VDSL Training Status:   Showtime
                    Mode:   VDSL2 Annex B
            VDSL Profile:   Profile 17a
            Traffic Type:   PTM Mode
             Link Uptime:   0 day: 2 hours: 2 minutes
============================================================================
       VDSL Port Details       Upstream         Downstream
               Line Rate:      9.999 Mbps       39.999 Mbps
    Actual Net Data Rate:     10.000 Mbps       40.000 Mbps
          Trellis Coding:         ON                ON
              SNR Margin:        9.8 dB           11.8 dB
            Actual Delay:          0 ms              0 ms
          Transmit Power:        7.5 dBm          13.9 dBm
           Receive Power:       -6.4 dBm          -5.2 dBm
              Actual INP:       42.0 symbols      45.0 symbols
       Total Attenuation:       14.0 dB           19.2 dB
Attainable Net Data Rate:     14.889 Mbps       58.053 Mbps
============================================================================
      VDSL Band Status    U0      U1      U2      U3      D1      D2      D3
  Line Attenuation(dB):  6.8    28.5    42.0     N/A    13.7    33.8    53.9   
Signal Attenuation(dB):  6.8    28.0    41.2     N/A    16.9    33.5    53.9   
        SNR Margin(dB):  9.9     9.8     9.8     N/A    11.8    11.8    11.7   
   Transmit Power(dBm):  0.3   -15.3     6.6     N/A    11.6     8.1     5.9   
============================================================================

            VDSL Counters

           Downstream        Upstream
Since Link time = 2 min 3 sec
FEC:      2926      7
CRC:      0      0
ES:      0      0
SES:      0      0
UAS:      0      0
LOS:      0      0
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Latest 15 minutes time = 2 min 34 sec
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CRC:      0      0
ES:      0      0
SES:      0      0
UAS:      0      0
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