The UK Landline Switch Off - What You Need To Know

[Postal]

I really can't see the rollout being completed by the end of this coming year.  The work that needs doing to every individual property to switch to FTTP means this is a colossal task, and going by my own experience, is by no means a straightforward one.  My bet is that the government will step in and the 'big switch off' will be postponed until at least 2030.

Simon

I think that there is a lot of confusion about the two separate matters of the PSTN (old style analogue) network being turned off and the roll out of full FTTP service.  They are not the same thing and are not related in terms of any implementation plans.

The roll out of the full FTTP service is a colossal task and people who are more versed in these matters than me have posted various dates on the internet but the consensus is that the roll out will take until the mid-2030s and even at that point there will be properties that cannot receive FTTP and who will effectively have there overland communication methods removed to be replaced by mobile signal, satellite WiFi or some other technology.

That is not the same as the switch off of the PSTN network.  This will happen before the end of 2025 and is not related to FTTP.  For those without FTTP but who have "fibre" internet (FTTC or Fibre to the Cabinet) the last bit of copper which brings things to their premises carries two signals piggy-backed onto each other.  The first is the analogue phone signal.  This comes by copper from the local exchange to the cabinet providing service to the premises where the signal for the individual property is split out and run to the premises usually by underground duct or overhead pole.  This signal includes a low voltage DC element which makes the telephone bell ring when a call is received; this DC current is provided by back-up equipment at the exchange which maintains service if there is a power cut.  The second signal coming to the premises along the same copper wire is the VDSL signal providing the internet to the premises.  This reaches the cabinet along an optic fibre cable; this may follow the existing route from the local exchange or may come direct from the "head-end" exchange.  The head-end typically covers the areas of a number of local exchanges; even if the fibre route follows the existing route via a local exchange there is no kit needed in the local exchange to handle the signal.  At the cabinet the optical signal through the fibre is converted to an electrical digital signal and piggy-backed onto the existing copper connections to the premises.  This is dependent on a power supply at the cabinet to make the optical to electrical conversion and will typically provide power for three or four hours so after that time even if the user has local back up to maintain their router, phones etc, contact will still be lost.

The turn off of the PSTN system will then mean that the "telephone" signal will instead come along the optical fibre from the head end exchange, cutting out the switching and interfacing kit at the local exchange and making that building redundant.  This digital telephone signal will either need telephone kit capable of handling digital rather than analogue, a router capable of converting the new signal with a port into which the existing phone can be plugged or an ATA (Analogue Telephone Adapter) that plugs into one of the ethernet ports on the router and has a phone socket into which the existing phone can be plugged.  All of this means that a user wishing to maintain contact needs back-up power supply in case of a local power outage.  This change from PSTN to digital offers up massive capital and revenue savings for the telecom providers (lots of redundant property whose value can be realised and a lot less costly maintenance) so there is a big incentive for the providers to go ahead.  Unless there is a massive change of circumstances those in the know seem to be confident that the PSTN service will be ceased by December 2025 no matter what local objections are raised.

Those of us who live in rural areas which are prone to power cuts (we live in an area which typically has three or four twelve-hour power cuts each year and we have no mobile signal) have been banging on about this ever since the plans were announced but it is only comparatively recently that those in more metropolitan areas are starting to realise the consequences.  The mobile phone operators are finally planning to bring service to our area with a go-live date in the first part of next year but that is no panacea as the mast will be on the same power circuits as the rest of the village.  Masts usually have battery back up giving three to four hours of life during a power cut so that is a sticking plaster rather than a solution.  For those in locations like ourselves, until full FTTP is provided and no matter what local arrangements are made for power backup then in the event of a power cut of the usual pattern that we see there will be an area which is totally devoid of any communications after the first few hours of the power outage.

Not a good situation to which we can look forward!

TLDR:  The turn off of the old style phone signal is not related to the supply of FTTP to bring fibre to the house.  This turn off will happen by December 2025 no matter what.

[Simon]

Thanks Postal.

I did 'know' that, but I don't really think it's all registered in the brain at this time.  Your detailed explanation is very helpful.

[Postal]

Thanks Postal.

I did 'know' that, but I don't really think it's all registered in the brain at this time.  Your detailed explanation is very helpful.

Thanks for the nice words.

One other thing to remember is that service providers are mandated by OfCOM to maintain communication so that vulnerable people can contact the emergency services.  The actual implementation has been degraded after conversation between the ISPs and OfCOM to maintaining communication with the emergency services for up to an hour.  This applies to people that the ISP knows are in the vulnerable category so it is up to the individual consumer to make sure that they are on the at-risk register of the provider.  The communication method may be by giving the at risk person a mobile phone where there is a signal or by supplying free of charge a battery back to power the router for an hour.  There has been at least one case in our village where a couple both in their 70s were charged by BT for the supply of a back up battery as they had not advised BT of their circumstances.  So from a steam-age system which maintained communication 24/7 (faults and breakdowns excepted) modern technology is taking us to a situation where vulnerable people will be effectively cut off from communication for the greater part of a typical power cut in our area.  However, it is enabling the providers to cut their fixed and revenue costs so that their profits increase.  I am no lover of nationalisation per se but I wonder if things would have taken a different route in the old GPO days.

[robinc]

........I am no lover of nationalisation per se but I wonder if things would have taken a different route in the old GPO days.

300 Baud Acoustic Couplers would be my guess....

There has been another bump in the road for the great switch with Telecare systems https://www.gov.uk/government/publications/telecare-stakeholder-plan-analogue-to-digital-switchover-august-2023-update/telecare-stakeholder-action-plan-analogue-to-digital-switchover-august-2023-update however as it only affects a couple of a million old people I doubt OR will do little more than pay lip service to anything that stands in the way of their bottom line. There have already been reports of telecare end users having been switched as they didn't understand what they had to do to be in the 'At Risk' register in the first place and their device providers don't have digital alternatives yet.

[Bill]

300 Baud Acoustic Couplers would be my guess....

Mine too.

On a good day the GPO could be poor, most of the time they were appalling.

[zappaDPJ]

It didn't really occur to me cable companies like Virgin Media are also part of the process. A friend who has an extremely vulnerable partner and lives within a mobile not-spot hasn't had a working phone since it was switched over three months ago. According to a fairly reliable source, Virgin have now put a hold on any further roll-out.

[nowster]

The first is the analogue phone signal.  This comes by copper from the local exchange to the cabinet providing service to the premises where the signal for the individual property is split out and run to the premises usually by underground duct or overhead pole.  This signal includes a low voltage DC element which makes the telephone bell ring when a call is received; this DC current is provided by back-up equipment at the exchange which maintains service if there is a power cut.

Not quite.

There is a DC voltage, typically about 50V when the phone is "on hook" and about 10V when it's "off hook". The sound is modulated on top of that by the exchange and the phone.

When there is ringing present, an AC voltage is applied on top of the DC voltage, typically 80V at 16Hz, with sufficient current to drive a mechanical ringer. You can get a bit of a zing if you're touching the wires of a phone line when it's ringing.

A VoIP ATA reproduces all of that internally.

And then there are the DSL signals modulated on top of all of that, typically from about 100kHz-2MHz.

[Postal]

Thanks for the clarification.  What was that thing about "a little knowledge . . . "

[talos]

We have a cordless phone with answerphone will we still be able to use them after the switchover??

[Gary]

300 Baud Acoustic Couplers would be my guess....

There has been another bump in the road for the great switch with Telecare systems https://www.gov.uk/government/publications/telecare-stakeholder-plan-analogue-to-digital-switchover-august-2023-update/telecare-stakeholder-action-plan-analogue-to-digital-switchover-august-2023-update however as it only affects a couple of a million old people I doubt OR will do little more than pay lip service to anything that stands in the way of their bottom line. There have already been reports of telecare end users having been switched as they didn't understand what they had to do to be in the 'At Risk' register in the first place and their device providers don't have digital alternatives yet.

In our area because Sogea is now a thing the care telecare providers give you a GSM 4G unit which can also be plugged into wifi/Ethernet depending which manufacture of devices they have in stock. Most companies have been aware and have sent out the new equipment up quite quickly around here, I imagine that hopefully will be the same nationwide and the devices they now sent out via parceforce and  are so easy to set up they dot even send out a person to do it. The unit talks the person though the process which is basically pl;ace the unit plug in and wait and then wear a pendant in one of a few ways like on your wrist of round your neck, sadly things like bed sensors, Pill dispensers and Alzheimer voice sensors to stop people wondering off where a family member can record a message are all being phased out.

The care line team in our area, (it was the district council but they sold the service off as it was to expensive to run)  >: have taken away the better Tunstall units and are replacing them with no cheaper more basic units made cheaply and which look ugly plastic that self install.

Its all about cash and suposedly makes people feel safe as its on the cellular system (or Ethernet or Wi-Fi if you have a router and broadband of some flavour. Yes the battery in the GSM units will last 72 hours, but the masts will be long dead by and cabs batteries don't last long. So the more comprehensive monitoring has been removed so it's basic to say the least. Also with 4-5 hours as an average wait time for a ambulance in my part of West Sussex being old and or disabled feels like you have been thrown to the wolves. 
 

[robinc]

......... Also with 4-5 hours as an average wait time for a ambulance in my part of West Sussex being old and or disabled feels like you have been thrown to the wolves. 

SINGLE FIGURES!!!! cor blimey I can just about remember those good old days.... 

Didn't you get the memo? To borrow a seasonally topical phrase it's all about "reducing the surplus population"..... 

[robinc]

We have a cordless phone with answerphone will we still be able to use them after the switchover??

Depending on your router you should be able to either just plug the base station in to the router, or you'll need an ATA adapter to fit between base station and router.
I'm still unclear as to whether we as end users have to buy these or whether iDNet will be supplying them....?

[Simon]

Depending on your router you should be able to either just plug the base station in to the router, or you'll need an ATA adapter to fit between base station and router.
I'm still unclear as to whether we as end users have to buy these or whether iDNet will be supplying them....?

I think you can provide your own router, or buy one from IDNet or elsewhere.  When you go through the ordering process it asks if you have a router or would like to buy one.  I was going to keep the one I've got, but I wasn't 100% sure that it would be compatible, so I've bought one off of IDNet, so if anything goes wrong they can't turn round and say it's down to my equipment!

[robinc]

I think you can provide your own router, or buy one from IDNet or elsewhere.  When you go through the ordering process it asks if you have a router or would like to buy one.  I was going to keep the one I've got, but I wasn't 100% sure that it would be compatible, so I've bought one off of IDNet, so if anything goes wrong they can't turn round and say it's down to my equipment!

Sorry, what i meant was whether iDNet would be providing the ATA adapter (FOC naturally), not the router 

[zappaDPJ]

The recent storms took out the power here. We also lost our mobile connection to two different providers all at the same time. Living in a rural area it makes you realise just how vulnerable you are if an emergency occurs. I can see people, especially the vulnerable having to resort to satellite phones in future.

[Simon]

Apparently, if you were in a real emergency and called 999, your phone will search for any signal from any provider. 

[Postal]

Apparently, if you were in a real emergency and called 999, your phone will search for any signal from any provider.

Indeed so, but that is predicated on having any sort of mobile signal available.  To further cloud the issue most masts have battery back-up that lasts 3 or 4 hours at most so a long-lasting power cut will see all of the mobile signals disappear in due course.  There is also the problem that even if you have a UPS so that you can power your router and maintain communication through internet or WiFi calling on the mobile then that will die fairly soon if you are on FTTC rather than FTTP.  Not sure about the altnets but the BT FTTP offering is entirely passive from the head-end exchange to the premises with no switching gear or anything requiring power and the assumption is that the head-end exchange has resilient power back-up.  So BT-based FTTP should continue to work throughout.  However, FTTC (VDSL) is supplied by fibre from the head-end exchange to the local green cabinet which then has electrical gizmos to convert the optical signal to the copper-wire signal for supply to the premises.  These cabinets also usually have battery back-up for 3 to 4 hours.

We live in a mobile free area and the village have found enough grant funding to install solar panels and a storage battery in the village hall so that the internet in the hall will remain powered during an outage.  However, the last power cut went on for about 6 hours and after 3 hours the hall was nice and warm and the kettle was working well but the internet had gone down.  As we haven't yet hit the December 2025 deadline, those with old style hard-wired phones still had communication but the advances in modern technology (therefore it must be good) will take that option away in due course and we will be without any external communication after the first few hours of a power-cut - and that situation will be the same even if we have a mobile phone mast installed.

[stan]

Sorry, what i meant was whether iDNet would be providing the ATA adapter (FOC naturally), not the router 

Much delayed reply .......  have no doubt that as we speak (January 2024) Idnet do not supply a free ATA.

At the moment they show a Grandstream HT 801 for £79.99 (just one FXS phone port) - and a Cisco SPA 191 for £120 (two FXS phone ports). I'm unsure if they discount these prices if you take out a 12 month broadband plan.

As Simon has recently mentioned they also show one router that has one built in phone port ... The TP Link VX230.(discounted price £59.99 if you take out their 12 month plan)

They show lots of other routers but unless you're very familiar with the numbering routine that ASUS use or can make sense of the (hugely complicated) list of technical specs thast ASUS publish then you've got your work cut out in deciding which is the one for you.

[Simon]

I still find it hard to believe that the TP-Link router with the FXS port costs significantly less than a stand alone ATA. 

[stan]

There has to be a reason why, of all the routers that Idnet show/sell literally only one has FXS ports built in.

There just has to be a reason. In life there's a reason for everything ... it's just that it's not always obvious 

Regarding the switch off, I spoke to a neighbour yesterday. They've recently had FTTP installed by OR and obviously now use it for their broadband. They have BT for their broadband service.  They have retained their old BT master socket (the one that receives the incoming external copper pair) and had the new ONT fitted just above it and they said they've kept the phone line and will continue to use it until it's switched off. The OR installer offered to remove the existing copper cable but they've kept it in place and, by the sound of it, are continuing to use it as per usual.  That must, obviously enough, be a viable option. Maybe it's exclusive to BT customers?? I don't know.

[Simon]

I'm intending to carry on using my old copper phone line, at least for now, and IDNet have confirmed that is an option.  If the OR engineers remove it, I won't be very happy so I will make sure they're aware. 

I may not wait until 2025 to switch over though.  Depending how reliable the FTTP is, I may go over to the IDNet UBOSS service, as that actually works out cheaper than the current phone line, plus I'd get mobile calls included in the package. 

Does anyone know if incoming calls diverted to a mobile would still work when using a VoIP service, in the event of a power outage?

[stan]

I've just been reading this ......

https://www.ispreview.co.uk/talk/threads/best-way-to-keep-landline-when-going-fttp.39599/

Someone mentioned a firm called Premitel there and it does look half reasonable.  There's also further mentions of Andrews and Arnold (AAISP) of course. There always is.

Gotta be honest I'm increasing leaning towards going over to them. I've spoken on the phone a few times and it's always been positive. I would have their most basic FTTP (115/20) at £37 a month and their VOIP phone plan at £1.40 a month. £100 set up includes a router although I'd pay £30 or £40 extra to get a better router.

I had a reply to my enquiry to Idnet and they gave prices for keeping the ADSL and phone service that I'm on at the moment.

To renew next month and stay just as I am is £39 for the ADSL and the phone (or £42 if I paid monthly).  They no longer offer the 'free month' that they used to when you paid annually instead of monthly.  Obviously their FTTP and VOIP prices are on the website.

[zappaDPJ]

Just an observation really; OpenReach have replaced all the copper in my area with fibre. That's approx. 38,000 properties and just to be clear, it's pretty obvious all the copper connections have gone.

YouFibre who appear to have a glowing reputation are offering introductory 24 month packages starting at £19.99 a month for 150/20 + £3 for unlimited evening and weekend landline calls. Even at full price they have 500Mbps @ £34.99 which is £1 less than I'm currently paying for 5 times the download speed. They also offer an existing contract buy out although I don't know the details.

The bottom line, it seems there are an increasing number of competitors out there offering some very attractive deals.

[stan]

That's cheap.

But not availablein the South West where I am. They only started in 2019.

I wonder if we should query how they do it at approx half the cost of the bulk of providers ... and expect to continue for the long term? 

I'm led to believe that people like Idnet (and the other provider who's name Ive mentioned more than once) charge a fee which reflects the cost of providing the long term service and research that they need to remain stable and viable).  But, as always, I know remarkably little.

[peasblossom]

Bit off topic, but as an alternative, I see IDNet are now offering a redirection service for £6 a month, inc VAT. Very tempted. I like having landline number but rarely use it, only having it as a back up really so this might be handy.