sync speed

[Colin Burns]

Hi everybody

Ive been having some interesting problems with my internet connection.  I was getting some jolly good syncs on my connection about 7MB which lasted about a month and a half.  this was a rather sudden increase from the 4MB i used to get.  But sadly my internet connection has plummeted though the floor and I'm back to the old 4MB again.  my downfall is that i have to have 2 phones and 3 sky boxes plugged into my phone line at the same time.  would i get much benefit from giving up completely and ordering a new land line just for the good old broadband.

[Sebby]

Just to make absolutely certain, when you say sync speed, do you mean the speed you're getting when you do a speed test, or the connection rate reported by your router?

[Inactive]

Why have you got 3 Sky Receivers connected to your phone line?

Unless they are part of a Multi Room Package, I would disconnect the phone line from them.

That is of course unless you use the costly interactive service, then you only need one connected.

[Colin Burns]

its part of multi room and they start to send fun letters when disconected

the sync i refered to was what my router was reporting

my profile was 6500 i think

and is now about 4500

and there has been no change to the internal wiring

[Sebby]

Thanks for providing those details. You mention your profile; is that what the BT speed tester tells you? What we really need to know is the sync your router is reporting.

Probably something is wrong with your line or equipment, but it's certainly not an ISP issue as sync is not related to the ISP.

Do you have a socket that looks like this? If so, could you remove the front plate (be careful as the extension wiring is connected to the inside of this plate, so just let it dangle) and connect your router to the socket behind.

This is the test socket and it will eliminated your extension wiring. Please then re-post your stats. If there is an improvement, we can say with some certainty that the issue is your internal wiring, probably picking up noise, for which we can make suggestions.

[Colin Burns]

i do sadly im currently 3 miles away from it
though the last time i plugged my router straight into the test socket about 2 months ago got just under 6mb reported by the router

[Inactive]

its part of multi room and they start to send fun letters when disconected

Fair enough, do you have ADSL Filters on each Sky Receiver?

I thought that the multi room set up only involved 2 receivers, ( I may be wrong ) if that is the case, then disconnect the third one from the phone line.

[Colin Burns]

all the sky boxes are on filters.  the internal setup is the same just the obtainable sync speed my router can achieve has tanked.

[Colin Burns]

might go for round 2 and completely rewire the houses internal wiring and replace it with CAT5

u think it could help

[Sebby]

i do sadly im currently 3 miles away from it
though the last time i plugged my router straight into the test socket about 2 months ago got just under 6mb reported by the router

might go for round 2 and completely rewire the houses internal wiring and replace it with CAT5

u think it could help

You've answered your own question there.

If you get 6Mb in the test socket and around 4Mb on an extension, internal wiring is to blame. Cat5 would certainly help as it is far more noise resistant. Alternatively, you could do is remove the ring wire from every socket (the wire connected to terminal 3, which is usually orange in colour). Having the ring wire connected picks up a lot of noise, and it's not generally needed for today's phones. It must be disconnected from every socket, including the master.

[Inactive]

all the sky boxes are on filters. .

Fair enough, I am no expert on routers etc. but I do know that Sky Receivers are notorious for giving off noise, you could try disconnecting them briefly and see if that has any effect, Sky will not even know as long as it is only a short period.

[Sebby]

Fair enough, I am no expert on routers etc. but I do know that Sky Receivers are notorious for giving off noise, you could try disconnecting them briefly and see if that has any effect, Sky will not even know as long as it is only a short period.

This can be the case, In, though I suspect his issue is just general noise pickup on the extension wiring, but we shall see. Removing the ring wire should prove it.

[Inactive]

Agreed Seb, I was just trying to exclude any sources of interference from the loop.

I am sure that the internal wiring, including the ring wire are the probable cause.

[Colin Burns]

hmm will try it out

that's one thing i don't think ive checked for i have the new style face plate. if i have a ring wire is it connected to the removeable part or is it inside the main box?

[Sebby]

The removable part, so you are allowed to do it.

Would it be possible to site your router at the master socket? As you have a NTE5, you could fit a filtered faceplate, such as the ADSL Nation XTE-2005. You then wouldn't need to remove the ring wire. What this would do is terminate the ADSL signal at the point where the line enters the property, then send filtered telephone signal to the extension sockets. The results is ADSL signal that hasn't suffered any noise pickup, and extension sockets that are already filtered, so no microfilters are required. IMHO, it's the best solution, though I appreciate it's not always a feasible setup.

Let us know how you get on.

[Colin Burns]

i could resight my router next to the MS but it would result in having to wake my parents up every time i need to restart my modem at early hours in the morning will see if i have a ring wire and report back but sadly will have to be later today

[plugwash]

I've also heared some people advise using two filters in series on sky boxes.

[Danni]

You do not know how many times I've told him it's internal wiring (or a broken phone). I can't even hear him speak when he calls me from the landline because there is so much static and noise. I think the cheapest way would be to buy new phones, maybe ones that are not broken.

I also think the filtered faceplate would be a good idea. There are more cables in his house than there are in my local telephone exchange. Unfortunately I don't want to get on the bad side of his dad so cannot recommend disconnecting sky boxes

[Colin Burns]

hmmm gotta admit i never noticed the noise. thanks Danni. no more 2 am trips to ASDA for you.  i would have to say the internal wiring in my house is more like a very small BT telephone exchange in the middle of nowhere that one serves one house mine he he. wait but since I'm the only IDnet customer on my exchange that we know of. (every one else uses tiscali or TALKTALK) lol  and most of the wiring is for my LAN Danni as you well know.  for the 5 to 8 computers i can be running at any one time.

[Danni]

I have your login details...

[Colin Burns]

to what

my internet connection
3 dedicated webservers
whmcs account
anything else that i could ever possible want to login to including this forum

but wait im next to your internet connection and im going to steal it

[Danni]

Yes.

[Colin Burns]

damed i am in the intenal fires of wiring hell

[Danni]

Indeed.

[Rik]

Just to add my thoughts to this.

1) @In, with Sky multi-room, you can have up to 8 boxes, or four Sky+/HD boxes, on the same account, all must be connected to the same phone line.

2) I do feel a filtered faceplate is the answer here, and if the router can't go to the faceplate, then run Cat5e or 6 cable to the router.

3) As Plugwash suggests, double-filtering Sky boxes can help.

4) It would be worth thinking about REN. The Sky boxes have a REN of 3, how many phones are there?

Have you done a quiet line test, Colin? Dial 17070 and select option 2. If that sounds noisy, report it as a voice fault.

[Colin Burns]

its defenety looking interanal as i have my router pluged and im getting these figures from the test socket

DSL Line (Wire Pair):     Line 1 (inner pair)
Protocol:    G.DMT Annex A
Downstream Rate:    6208 kbps
Upstream Rate:    832 kbps
Channel:    Interleaved
Current Noise Margin:    21.0 dB (Downstream) 16.0 dB (Upstream)
Current Attenuation:    24.4 dB (Downstream) 12.5 dB (Upstream)
Current Output Power:    19.8 dBm (Downstream) 12.4 dBm (Upstream)
DSLAM Vendor Information:    Country: {0xB5} Vendor: {TSTC} Specific: {0x00}
PVC Info:    0/38

also it turned out i did have a ring wire connected so have removed that as well

[Rik]

That noise margin suggests that DLM has been at work, Colin, and raised your target margin to 15db to stabilise the line. It also looks like your last re-sync was at night, hence the higher margin now (plus removing the ring wire). With that attenuation, you should be synching at 8128, so it might be worth forcing a re-sync to see what you get, I'd expect somewhere around 7,000 right now.

[Colin Burns]

after a forced reboot

DSL Line (Wire Pair):     Line 1 (inner pair)
Protocol:    G.DMT Annex A
Downstream Rate:    6560 kbps
Upstream Rate:    832 kbps
Channel:    Interleaved
Current Noise Margin:    15.0 dB (Downstream) 15.0 dB (Upstream)
Current Attenuation:    24.1 dB (Downstream) 12.5 dB (Upstream)
Current Output Power:    19.8 dBm (Downstream) 12.4 dBm (Upstream)
DSLAM Vendor Information:    Country: {0xB5} Vendor: {TSTC} Specific: {0x00}
PVC Info:    0/38

[Rik]

Didn't gain as much as I would have expected, Colin, but it's a step in the right direction. Did you disconnect the ring wire at every socket?

[Colin Burns]

not yet still connected to the test socket.  need to find a screw driver so i can do the rest is the ring wire connected to 3?

[Rik]

Yup, ring wire is always on 3, you just want 2 & 5 connected. While you;re in there, make sure that all the wiring is paired, eg blue/white and white/blue.

[Colin Burns]

well its disconnected its creeping up slowly

DSL Line (Wire Pair):     Line 1 (inner pair)
Protocol:    G.DMT Annex A
Downstream Rate:    6752 kbps
Upstream Rate:    832 kbps
Channel:    Interleaved
Current Noise Margin:    15.0 dB (Downstream) 16.0 dB (Upstream)
Current Attenuation:    24.2 dB (Downstream) 12.5 dB (Upstream)
Current Output Power:    19.8 dBm (Downstream) 12.4 dBm (Upstream)
DSLAM Vendor Information:    Country: {0xB5} Vendor: {TSTC} Specific: {0x00}
PVC Info:    0/38

will do another restart sometime early tomorrow and see if i hit the magic number

[Rik]

500k for the day, not bad... Wait until the sun's up in the morning, that should give you your highest speed.

[Colin Burns]

wakes up in the early afternooon to check the sync and its gone to

DSL Connection Details
DSL Line (Wire Pair):    Line 1 (inner pair)
Protocol:    G.DMT Annex A
Downstream Rate:    6816 kbps
Upstream Rate:    832 kbps
Channel:    Interleaved
Current Noise Margin:    15.0 dB (Downstream) 12.0 dB (Upstream)
Current Attenuation:    24.9 dB (Downstream) 12.5 dB (Upstream)
Current Output Power:    19.8 dBm (Downstream) 12.4 dBm (Upstream)
DSLAM Vendor Information:    Country: {0xB5} Vendor: {TSTC} Specific: {0x00}
PVC Info:    0/38

happy days

also found that where the fault is in my house its either the upstairs sky box or a dieing filter. so will just have to pot out to buy some new ones

[Rik]

Try unplugging the boxes for a day, Colin. Sky usually only do one callback a month, and will repeat it after 24 hours if it fails.

[Colin Burns]

i think the boxes are unplugged but will go double check

[Colin Burns]

turns out that i got the last high sync with the box in question pluged in

DSL Line (Wire Pair):     Line 1 (inner pair)
Protocol:    G.DMT Annex A
Downstream Rate:    6688 kbps
Upstream Rate:    832 kbps
Channel:    Interleaved
Current Noise Margin:    15.0 dB (Downstream) 12.0 dB (Upstream)
Current Attenuation:    24.6 dB (Downstream) 12.5 dB (Upstream)
Current Output Power:    19.8 dBm (Downstream) 12.4 dBm (Upstream)
DSLAM Vendor Information:    Country: {0xB5} Vendor: {TSTC} Specific: {0x00}
PVC Info:    0/38

[Rik]

All you have to do now is hold that for 14 days, get your target noise margin down and start gaining the remains of your sync speed back.

[Colin Burns]

yup may the good times roll

think the only remaining thing to do is to get load of nice new good quility filters.

[Rik]

I recommend the ADSL Nation xf-1e.

[Sebby]

I second that.

[Colin Burns]

will try and get them ordered this week

[Danni]

I win

[Colin Burns]

how kind and polite and on which ground do u win cause the fault turned out to be a dead filter onto my dads sky box

just now need to order so nice new ones when i have money

[Rik]

Meantime, Colin, leave the box unplugged - Sky will give you a couple of warnings before getting shirty.

[Gary]

Meantime, Colin, leave the box unplugged - Sky will give you a couple of warnings before getting shirty.

Once out of the first year you can leave it unplugged anyway can't you Rik?

[Rik]

No, Colin has multi-room, Gary, which Sky do police.

[Gary]

No, Colin has multi-room, Gary, which Sky do police.

the gits saying that our box is off an ADSL nation faceplate so its not an issue, the phone line runs though a surge protector and and then a splitter for phone then skybox (the ADLSL side does not go through a protector due to noise they create) and goes straight to router so it causes no issue thankfully

[Sebby]

My setup is identical to yours, Gary.

[Gary]

My setup is identical to yours, Gary.

Great minds, and all those clichés Sebby 

[Colin Burns]

yay

im just happy with my sync speed and though put im getting

DSL Line (Wire Pair):     Line 1 (inner pair)
Protocol:    G.DMT Annex A
Downstream Rate:    6688 kbps
Upstream Rate:    832 kbps
Channel:    Interleaved
Current Noise Margin:    15.0 dB (Downstream) 14.0 dB (Upstream)
Current Attenuation:    24.4 dB (Downstream) 12.5 dB (Upstream)
Current Output Power:    19.8 dBm (Downstream) 12.4 dBm (Upstream)
DSLAM Vendor Information:    Country: {0xB5} Vendor: {TSTC} Specific: {0x00}
PVC Info:    0/38

with a jolly 5mb though put

and i dont even have my new filters ordered yet

Thanks everyone for the help

[Rik]

That's not a bad result, Colin. You now need to maintain that sync for 14 days and hope the margin starts to reduce, you can probably get another 1000k from the line yet.

[Dangerjunkie]

Hi Colin,

i could resight my router next to the MS but it would result in having to wake my parents up every time i need to restart my modem at early hours in the morning will see if i have a ring wire and report back but sadly will have to be later today

You could put the modem in there and get something like one of these (Maplin N97CQ) so you could power-cycle the modem without having to go into the room: http://www.maplin.co.uk/search.aspx?MenuNo=12067&MenuName=Remote%20Control%20Sockets&worldid=-4&FromMenu=y&doy=12m3

Cheers,
Paul.

[Sebby]

Excellent, Colin. As Rik mentioned, if you can leave it sync'd for 14 or 15 days, your noise margin should drop by 3dB. Eventually you should get the maximum sync.