Webspace issues?

gyruss · Jul 11, 2008, 18:01:36

Absolutely no idea whats causing this, but when i try to access my webspace which was setup ages ago.. http://gyruss.www.idnet.com i get 'Forbidden You don't have permission to access / on this server ?

Its worked up until today (i think, as i've not tried to access it in all honesty much), but as i host things like images there mostly for forum signatures, i am finding images suddenly missing from posts i make due to access issues?

Anyone else getting this? or are these outages a regular thing if its a server issue?

Rik · Jul 11, 2008, 18:05:29

It's working fine here on my space. The offices have just closed so I can't check with anyone. I'd suggest you drop support an email, or call the out of hours number, depending on how urgent you feel it is. 01462 476556

gyruss · Jul 11, 2008, 18:14:47

I have no web issues on any other webspace, my firefox 3 webbrowser fully trusts the idnet.com domain in 'noscript', and i keep getting this 403 forbidden. How odd.

Internet Explorer 7: displays ;'The website declined to show this webpage' Most likely causes: This website requires you to login.

Yet i'm browsing forums, with no issues.

I will indeed email idnet support i think

Sebby · Jul 11, 2008, 18:47:52

Is there no index document by any chance?

Rik · Jul 11, 2008, 18:48:37

Good point, can you FTP to the page, Gyruss?

Sebby · Jul 11, 2008, 18:51:56

Theoretically, the error should be "directory listing denied", but I just wonder if this is the same thing.

vitriol · Jul 11, 2008, 20:27:32

getting the same error here

Simon · Jul 11, 2008, 20:54:40

For what it's worth, mine is also fine. As has been suggested, can you guys access via FTP, and if so, check that an index.htm is present?

JB · Jul 11, 2008, 21:29:07

Quote from: vitriol on Jul 11, 2008, 20:27:32
getting the same error here

Getting a 403 error here as well. Although I thought it was working this morning.

In Spain at present so can't ftp into IDNet from Telefonica. Could log into my linux box in UK and do it that way but too many cerveza's to worry atm.

JB.

gyruss · Jul 12, 2008, 11:09:16

Sorry, will test ftp now. I'll create some sort of index page even if its a dummy page for now. Mostly use my webspace to host forum images, in-game screenshots and the like (MMO's), so will fire up a dummy index.htm and upload that if it lets me login to it.

Baz · Jul 12, 2008, 11:11:25

seems a strange address format to me with the WWW in the middle...........I dont know

Rik · Jul 12, 2008, 11:11:54

IDNet tossed a coin, Baz.

Baz · Jul 12, 2008, 11:14:02

ah right

gyruss · Jul 12, 2008, 11:47:47

ftp'd to my webspace a dummy index.htm file and yes can call up that page with the url.

What i was able to do before though without having the index.htm there was see the list of files on my webspace which was handy. If i can't have that any more due to some change or other. thats fine, but this now means i have to log my ftp client on just to see the files?

Rik · Jul 12, 2008, 11:51:49

Afaik, no index file has always meant no access to the URL, but if you knew the full name of a file, you could access that.

vitriol · Jul 12, 2008, 12:18:12

I too can access via ftp, I can see all of my uploaded files in the ftp browser.

I still get the permision error if I just put the url in the address bar.

psp83 · Jul 12, 2008, 12:22:35

FTP into your account again.. In your FTP options.. Choose to show hidden files..

Do you have a .htaccess file?

if you do, download it and open in notepad (make a backup first)..

Does it contain something like:-
IndexIgnore *
OR
IndexIgnore *.gif *.jpg

if it does, remove it and re upload.

If you dont have a .htaccess file, create one.

how?

Open notepad.
Copy and paste the following "Options +Indexes" without the quotes

Save the notepad file as htaccess.txt

Upload it to the folder you want to list all files in. Rename htaccess.txt on the server to .htaccess

Then try the folder you want to list things in.. You should now see a list of all the files (if IDnet supports .htaccess)

psp83 · Jul 12, 2008, 12:47:52

Just tried it myself and IDnet don't support .htaccess files.

Send them an email and see if they can enable it there end.

Rik · Jul 12, 2008, 12:49:01

I wonder if a setting got changed when the webspace was restored, Paul?

psp83 · Jul 12, 2008, 12:51:47

if its a new server and they only restored user files then that could be the case. the new server might not be setup in the same way..

Either get them to turn on .htaccess support in apache or enable folder indexes.

Even better, get them to get php on the server

vitriol · Jul 12, 2008, 12:52:19

it had been working since it came back up after the email dramas. It's only since yesterday that I haven't been able to access.

Sebby · Jul 12, 2008, 13:13:39

I think this might be one for IDNet support, guys.

Rik · Jul 12, 2008, 15:37:24

Quote from: psp83 on Jul 12, 2008, 12:51:47
Even better, get them to get php on the server

Ain't gonna happen.

gyruss · Jul 12, 2008, 16:32:27

Anyone know off the top of their head what the costs are for hosted ? I'm well out of practice with my website construction, in fact the last time I made one, i used frontpage 2000, but since then so many new technologies have come into play and it would be nice to have a pet project on the go

Rik · Jul 12, 2008, 16:35:19

Take a look at 1&1 packages from £2.43pm.

JB · Jul 12, 2008, 16:39:22

Quote from: vitriol on Jul 12, 2008, 12:52:19
it had been working since it came back up after the email dramas. It's only since yesterday that I haven't been able to access.

Yepp. That's what I am finding also. Until yesterday, surfing to my webspace showed a listing of a few gif and jpg files I have there. Since yesterday it produces the 403 error. I presently don't have an index.htm or index.html file there.

By including the jpg or gif filename appended to the URL they display normally. Just a server config change I'm sure.

JB.

Rik · Jul 12, 2008, 16:47:16

It certainly sounds that way to me, JB, and we do know it's a new server.

Sebby · Jul 12, 2008, 16:48:36

Yep, it definitely looks like a configuration issue. I know that some servers will show the directory listing whilst others won't, and it's just a setting (or is it directory permissions?).

vitriol · Jul 12, 2008, 20:23:10

This works : Clio

This doesn't : Forza index

Definately looks like there is something wrong with the directory structure on the server.

Simon · Jul 12, 2008, 20:50:19

Definitely looks like a job for IDNet, then.

psp83 · Jul 12, 2008, 21:06:00

doubt nothing is wrong its probly just Options -Indexes is set for all accounts.

Just ask them if they could enable folder indexes so you can see the list of files for that folder.

colirv · Jul 14, 2008, 21:02:24

FWIW I can ftp in, and have an index.htm file present, but get a 403 error message if I browse there. No problem ATM as it's only a holding page - my site is hosted elsewhere.

cs · Jul 14, 2008, 21:17:39

I am having the same issue. (apologies for starting another thread - I did look but somehow missed this one)

I mostly use my space as a file transfer dump so I need the server to show the directory listing.

Simon · Jul 14, 2008, 21:55:38

It obviously seems as though there are some issues. As it doesn't seem to be affecting everyone, the only thing I can suggest is for you guys to contact IDNet, so that they can look into this.

colirv · Jul 15, 2008, 07:36:23

I've emailed IDNet support about this.

vitriol · Jul 15, 2008, 09:31:25

emailed support too and pointed them to this thread.

Rik · Jul 15, 2008, 09:55:55

See this post:

http://www.idnetters.co.uk/forums/index.php?topic=9309.msg206821#msg206821

vitriol · Jul 15, 2008, 10:14:48

I've read the post, not sure I understand it though, do I need to have an index.html file in every folder that I upload to now?

care to elaborate a bit, feeling a bit slow this morning!

Rik · Jul 15, 2008, 10:20:03

Basically, as it's been relayed to me, if there's no index file, you will get the permission denied message. However, it did specifically say parental folder, so it may not be required for sub folders.

LATER:

I've been told it does apply to sub-folders.

cs · Jul 15, 2008, 10:20:20

Thanks for the update Rik.

Unfortunately, unless they can turn that off for selected users I think it renders the webspace pretty much useless for me

If they allowed external ftp access, that would be something but annoyingly, they don't.

vitriol · Jul 15, 2008, 10:29:04

how would you go about creating this index file?

Rik · Jul 15, 2008, 10:33:45

As a block to browsing:

Code Select


<html>
	<head>
		<title>No Browsing</title>
	</head>
	<body>
		<h1>No Browsing</h1>
	</body>
</html>

As a 'page shaper', it depends what you need to do.

vitriol · Jul 15, 2008, 10:38:12

I just want to show my .jpg pictures in an index, so I can click on them and see the pictures.

colirv · Jul 15, 2008, 12:12:46

vitriol, try using http://www.ph2web.com/. It takes but a moment to stick up a gallery in a directory of your choice.

vitriol · Jul 15, 2008, 12:32:36

I'd like to use the IDNet service if possible.

vitriol · Jul 15, 2008, 12:38:54

Just got an email through from support, looks like that a directory listing is now not possible due to security concerns that some users have.

Have just asked if the "tweak" can be enabled / disabled on a per user basis.

Lance · Jul 15, 2008, 12:42:15

Quote from: vitriol on Jul 15, 2008, 12:32:36
I'd like to use the IDNet service if possible.

I've never used it, but this looks to do what you want. Once you've created the gallery, you just FTP it to your webspace. I'm sure there will be other programs that do the same if you google for them.

On the off-chance you have Adobe Photoshop, you can use that by going File > Automate > Web photo gallery

Lance · Jul 15, 2008, 12:44:38

Quote from: vitriol on Jul 15, 2008, 12:38:54
Just got an email through from support, looks like that a directory listing is now not possible due to security concerns that some users have.

Have just asked if the "tweak" can be enabled / disabled on a per user basis.

I suppose that unless the per user basis can be brought in, then it is impossible to keep every user happy. IDNet have to choose between those who want it and those who don't, and in this day and age you can't blame them for going with the more secure option!!!

vitriol · Jul 15, 2008, 12:54:42

can't be enabled / disabled on a per user basis as everyone's webspace is on a shared server.

Guess I'll look at alternative's .......

cs · Jul 15, 2008, 13:04:25

That is terrible news and a big headache for me.

What are the chances of getting external ftp access instead?

vitriol · Jul 15, 2008, 13:05:48

Give support a mail and see what they say

support@idnet.com

Rik · Jul 15, 2008, 13:08:38

I'd suggest you ask IDNet. I suspect I know the answer, but could be wrong.

Ray · Jul 15, 2008, 13:49:33

Quote from: Lance on Jul 15, 2008, 12:42:15
I've never used it, but this looks to do what you want. Once you've created the gallery, you just FTP it to your webspace. I'm sure there will be other programs that do the same if you google for them.

On the off-chance you have Adobe Photoshop, you can use that by going File > Automate > Web photo gallery

You can also do it with Photoshop Elements as well, Lance, that's how I did the one that's on my idnet web space

psp83 · Jul 15, 2008, 14:09:06

Quote from: vitriol on Jul 15, 2008, 12:54:42
can't be enabled / disabled on a per user basis as everyone's webspace is on a shared server.

Guess I'll look at alternative's .......

It can be enabled per user if the server is setup correctly. All idnet have to do is tell apache to allow htaccess to override Options +/- Indexes

That way, all the user has to do is put a .htaccess file into there root with Options +Indexes or Options +Indexes +FollowSymLinks in the .htaccess file.

vitriol · Jul 15, 2008, 16:09:16

thanks for the advice there paul,

I wonder what security issues existed to prompt this change of configuration?

Rik · Jul 15, 2008, 16:13:12

Probably a response to concerns from some customers. There's always a problem in balancing the needs of everyone on a service like this.

Those that preferred the previous approach should let support know, so that they can balance the opposing views.

vitriol · Jul 15, 2008, 16:28:36

Good advice as always Rik,

I've let Andrew in support know how I feel about this.

cs · Jul 15, 2008, 16:52:01

I will let support know what I think as well.

To be honest, I think they should have told us in advance before making a change like this. Or at least after they had done it, so we were not fishing around for answers.
I often need access to files stored on my webspace when I'm working away and that is not possible now.

psp83 · Jul 15, 2008, 18:52:33

Quote from: vitriol on Jul 15, 2008, 16:09:16
thanks for the advice there paul

No problem..

Here's an example.. my domain http://www.psp83.com has the same as idnet. indexes are turnt off.

So if you go to http://www.psp83.com or http://www.psp83.com/youdontsee you will get the "Forbidden" message.
But if you go to http://www.psp83.com/yousee you will now get the files/subfolders shown.

This is done by .htaccess as i said in my last post. So it can be done per user if the server is setup correctly.

Sebby · Jul 15, 2008, 19:57:30

Certainly on sub directories, you should just be able to change the permissions using your FTP program.

Edit: Actually, that may not be the case. If "permission denied" is just the wrong way of saying "direction listing denied" then I don't think it'll work. If it is actually about permissions, you should be able to change it yourself.

colirv · Jul 15, 2008, 20:45:52

Quote from: vitriol on Jul 15, 2008, 12:32:36
I'd like to use the IDNet service if possible.

It would be on your IDNet webspace, if that's what you mean. It's simply a program that quickly and simply puts together a gallery from the files in a folder.

vitriol · Jul 15, 2008, 21:12:08

I just need the directory listing to be back, I'm in the same boat as cs, as I am required to travel and access to my webspace is important to me. Not only do I use if for photo's, there are some files that I may need when I am working.

As things stand at the moment, I can't access it remotely via ftp (as it can only be used via your IDNet broadband connection) and now that directory listings have been disabled the only way I can access my files is directly. So that will require me to memorise loads of file names.

Surely directory listings can be made optional. When I emailed support about this I was told that personal webspace could be set up for me but I would be charged extra for the service......that's not an option imo. I already pay for a premium service and I should be able to use all of the services provided to me.

I'll be taking this up further with support tomorrow.