I am aware of an increase in small packet loss which is occurring regularly throughout 24hrs. Anyone else?
(http://www.thinkbroadband.com/ping/share-thumb/7fc18889d931f95df91f097850ced333-04-12-2013.png)
(http://www.thinkbroadband.com/speedtest/button/138616159515593114665.png)
I'm seeing a small amount from early afternoon until around midnight!
I get a small amount, mostly between about 2pm and 8pm, but it's very small and has pretty much always been there.
Nothing out of the ordinary showing here although it seems like interleaving has been taken off my line recently:
(http://www.thinkbroadband.com/ping/share-thumb/bf6b79774d62d35d93562656ae47e045-04-12-2013.png)
Speedtest results are pretty good:
(http://www.thinkbroadband.com/speedtest/button/138618409520038826755.png)
Not as fast as I'd expect without interleaving but unfortunately I've lost my ability to access modem stats :-/
Similar on my line to Andrue's (but on a different BT PoP - red6 @ Stepney Green). However on my line latency as reported by the modem does seem to have increased by 10ms or so beyond the Cab, I assume over the wholesale backhaul. Is that surprising given the growth of fibre-based connections, though; and I believe that part of the network is subject to on-going upgrades anyway? But frankly, 10ms is not something I notice.
Anyone else noticing packet loss during the evenings at the moment? I had a a big ish blip one around 10pm last night. It seems to start early evening and clear after midnight. Looking at craigs its only on IDnet again :(
Quote from: Steve on Dec 04, 2013, 13:58:52
I'm seeing a small amount from early afternoon until around midnight!
Not sure it's causing any issues though at present
Quote from: Steve on Dec 11, 2013, 07:56:55
Not sure it's causing any issues though at present
Its odd that its on IDNet circuits once again though, Steve ???
Thought it was just me ..................
(http://www.thinkbroadband.com/ping/share-thumb/1d90f1b9be0b0858e68013c674974b2f.png) (http://www.thinkbroadband.com/ping/share/1d90f1b9be0b0858e68013c674974b2f.html)
Quote from: sobranie on Dec 11, 2013, 11:57:50
Thought it was just me ..................
(http://www.thinkbroadband.com/ping/share-thumb/1d90f1b9be0b0858e68013c674974b2f.png) (http://www.thinkbroadband.com/ping/share/1d90f1b9be0b0858e68013c674974b2f.html)
The ones I can see on craigs all seem to look like this for idnet :sigh: Doing a speed test yesterday afternoon it was very odd, and I noticed Speedtest.net cant work out if im in Milton keynes or London, sometimes it cant tell at all and gives no place, and that coincided with the packet loss. Of course I'm not in either place ;D
Yup, I'm seeing the same thing too. Again.
Deja vu?
Quote from: davecollins on Dec 11, 2013, 14:35:09
Yup, I'm seeing the same thing too. Again.
Deja vu?
I really hope this does not get worse before Christmas, what gets me is BT graphs show virtually nothing in the way of packet loss >:(
For the last couple of weeks I've been getting random disconnections from various services. They don't generally amount to more than 2-3 a day and I doubt they are related to the new round of packet loss but they are irritating none the less.
(http://www.thinkbroadband.com/ping/share-thumb/926e674caa6181ed1638bf7c1cb21db1.png)
My net's been acting up for the past couple of days. My graph looks a fair bit worse than yours for latency though. I hhad an engineer come out a few weeks back to fix a line fault so I'm not sure if it's a recurring problem related to that or the same thing that you guys are experiencing.
I'm not seeing anything on that TBBQM that looks anything other than a line that's accessing the internet,as opposed to the one earlier which shows little usage at all, yes the max latency is peaking but that's pretty normal imo.
Quote from: Steve on Dec 12, 2013, 21:49:30
I'm not seeing anything on that TBBQM that looks anything other than a line that's accessing the internet,as opposed to the one earlier which shows little usage at all, yes the max latency is peaking but that's pretty normal imo.
There is a small amount of packet loss but thats it, much less tonight than the last few days/evenings. It does not seem to be causing issue though. I would prefer to see none at at all though.
I really must wear my reading glasses more often, I could have sworn this said increased condensation, when I read the title this morning.
Quote from: Gary on Dec 14, 2013, 09:33:17... increased condensation ...
There has to be a joke about drips in there somewhere, but I won't look for it ;D
:out:
Quote from: Bill on Dec 14, 2013, 09:46:05
There has to be a joke about drips in there somewhere, but I won't look for it ;D
:out:
:getout: ;D
Quote from: Gary on Dec 14, 2013, 09:33:17
I really must wear my reading glasses more often, I could have sworn this said increased condensation, when I read the title this morning.
I was doing some research on Windows Presentation Foundation yesterday and I thought one topic was talking about composting :red:
http://stackoverflow.com/questions/11679972/multiple-thread-image-compositing
Quote from: andrue on Dec 14, 2013, 10:45:22
I was doing some research on Windows Presentation Foundation yesterday and I thought one topic was talking about composting :red:
http://stackoverflow.com/questions/11679972/multiple-thread-image-compositing
;D
And it's back.
I would contact IDNet support, but they never seem to do anything.
Time for me to jump ship I think.
(http://www.thinkbroadband.com/ping/share-thumb/1d7a2674f5246ec8f991b7edd7f3903c-16-12-2013.png)
Snap!!! .... and d/l speeds have halved. Good 'ere innit!!
Its not effecting my speeds at all, I think something else is going on at your end, Rick it could be the BT Modem playing up. Its odd though that this packet loss continues and other providers don't have it. IDNet don't seem particularly worried, and that worries me more since I'm in a years contract with them for FTTC. They used to be so much more proactive than this a few years back. :sigh:
It's improved here - for now. There is still packet loss, but far less. Download speed appears to be good now.
I'm also in a year's contract but will be prepared to take it on the chin if I need to. It's bad for our business. We do a lot of video conferencing and webinars - so right now we're not getting what we paid for.
IDNet support used to be excellent. It's not any more.
Quote from: davecollins on Dec 16, 2013, 11:57:43
It's improved here - for now. There is still packet loss, but far less. Download speed appears to be good now.
I'm also in a year's contract but will be prepared to take it on the chin if I need to. It's bad for our business. We do a lot of video conferencing and webinars - so right now we're not getting what we paid for.
IDNet support used to be excellent. It's not any more.
Put in a complaint to IDNet maybe, and official one, they say that the network is monitored for issues etc etc etc but recently we have seen that this does not seem to be the case. I would like to see AAIPS's line quality monitoring (they have it built in to your package with a Firebrick) to see if they are getting any. It could be that the likes of BT are just so huge they can cope with demand better. For small Niche ISP's balancing finance, bandwidth and performance is not easy, and IDNet are not a ISP designed for the average user and less so now than say 4 years back. I wonder sometimes if we suffer at the expense of their business side which is really their bread and butter. :-\
Have rebooted router etc etc but speeds are still the pits, hit 30 a few mins ago.(down from normal 75). As usual, it does me good to have the odd moan.
jftr, did IDNet ever get the additional bandwidth as there's been no mention of it!!!!!
I've just check my throughput and for me it's completely normal, however my TBBQM is showing packet loss,below is from speedtest.net it's as near as damn it the same as my BT speediest.
(http://www.speedtest.net/result/3168704573.png) (http://www.speedtest.net/my-result/3168704573)
Been great for me for a couple of weeks now. It seems like BT's firmware update to cab and modem has improved my connection. I seem to have lost interleaving permanently which surprises me. I'm not running at full speed though so I think they must have tweaked things to allow for lower sync without interleaving.
Anyway, read it and weep :)
(http://www.thinkbroadband.com/speedtest/button/138722076929171971689.png)
Mine's been dreadful all afternoon:
(http://www.thinkbroadband.com/ping/share-thumb/1d7a2674f5246ec8f991b7edd7f3903c-16-12-2013.png)
My graph is very similar but throughput remains ok at present.
(http://www.speedtest.net/result/3169535841.png) (http://www.speedtest.net/my-result/3169535841)
Quote from: andrue on Dec 16, 2013, 19:09:09
(http://www.thinkbroadband.com/speedtest/button/138722076929171971689.png)
Anyway, read it and weep :)
Which has exactly what to do with IDNets packet loss?
Quote from: Gary on Dec 16, 2013, 22:11:02
Which has exactly what to do with IDNets packet loss?
It demonstrates that it's not affecting everyone unlike previous network related issues so is probably local to those suffering it.
And today it's even worse. Great.
I would agree currently my throughput on several tests is down to 15-17 Mbps from 38-42Mbps. :(
Noticing it today as well
Throughput isn't too bad here atm, but a lot more packet loss than there should be. (BQMs in sig for anyone interested)
There's still something amiss somewhere :(
:laugh: Same. Daren't do any speed test, but here in la la land BTOR have apparently announced the availability Q4 2013 of FTTPoD at the local exchange. (Though I'll warrant not a Node in this part of the area unless they've gone completely bonkers.)
My TBBQM shows packet loss earlier this afternoon but nothing now and I'm still getting full speed.
(http://www.thinkbroadband.com/ping/share-thumb/daa41da3fd568ffb57641ddc171fdf2f-17-12-2013.png)
Quote from: mervl on Dec 17, 2013, 17:36:16
:laugh: Same. Daren't do any speed test, but here in la la land BTOR have apparently announced the availability Q4 2013 of FTTPoD at the local exchange. (Though I'll warrant not a Node in this part of the area unless they've gone completely bonkers.)
Yup, same here. I'll have to skip it though. Really got no way to justify the speed or the cost.
I'm good now - was dreadful earlier:
(http://www.thinkbroadband.com/ping/share-thumb/ba8a57611aea1136987b9026e16b25b1-17-12-2013.png)
Quote from: andrue on Dec 17, 2013, 19:40:38
Yup, same here.
You got a major new residential development in the offing too, in the locality? ;D You'll have to move with that extra pay from the new job!
Mine continues to deteriorate. Doesn't now appear any different to before Simon told us extra bandwith had been ordered.
(http://www.thinkbroadband.com/ping/share-thumb/e8043ea385b4f28cf42e7077b777185a-18-12-2013.png)
I too query whether the promised improvement has been implemented.
Having said that speed is holding up, a whole lot better than most!
(http://www.thinkbroadband.com/speedtest/button/138735053314923350401.png)
I left a message for iDNet on facebook regarding this, I would suggest everyone email in, let them know. I know support seem to blame peering points etc but if they get a mass of emails or calls with data and the Thinkbroadband quality meter results they may get on top of this. I worry over Christmas the network could grind to a halt down under film downloads and new gadgets going on-line.
Hi All,
We are unable to see any obvious cause across our network, if you are seeing any issues, please send us some ping and traceroute results to support@idnet.com.
Regards
IDNet
Brian,
Are the various graphs that people are posting not enough to convince you that there's a problem?
This has literally been going on for more than two months for me, and I've given up contacting support as it goes nowhere. One of your support team's last piece of advice was that I post here.
After New Year I will be looking at who to go to once I leave, but I will be leaving. IDNet used to have excellent support, but you shouldn't be relying on your reputation of yesteryear.
A very disappointed customer.
Quote from: davecollins on Dec 18, 2013, 11:15:51
Brian,
Are the various graphs that people are posting not enough to convince you that there's a problem?
This has literally been going on for more than two months for me, and I've given up contacting support as it goes nowhere. One of your support team's last piece of advice was that I post here.
After New Year I will be looking at who to go to once I leave, but I will be leaving. IDNet used to have excellent support, but you shouldn't be relying on your reputation of yesteryear.
A very disappointed customer.
Send them the info if you can, the more they get the better it is. Individual pings and traceroutes give more direct info than the graphs , it cant hurt, even if you are leaving. :(
Quote from: brian_idnet on Dec 18, 2013, 11:08:35
Hi All,
We are unable to see any obvious cause across our network, if you are seeing any issues, please send us some ping and traceroute results to support@idnet.com.
Regards
IDNet
Brian, I know you need pings and traceroutes but the packetloss on the graphs are saying there is an issue, and it could be bandwidth, it could be a business user taking up bandwidth, or maybe you need bigger pipes, who knows, I dont. It does seem that as FTTC is growing the network seems to be groaning under its weight.
There is nothing on Thinkbroadband from any of the other small ISP's, so surely a diagnostic at your end would be proactive, you must be able to see the packetloss too? Did the second bandwidth order Simon asked for happen? If not that could be part of the issue, no one has confirmed or denied that question. Christmas is coming and with everyone off I really wonder what's going to happen. Even though I am in a years contract it is making me wonder if I should 'take it on the chin' as someone else said and move on and I would prefer not to have to take such a loss but this is going on to long, and really it should be sorted by now. :shake:
There's nothing showing yet for me today, and throughput is fine obviously I'll be looking later.
Hi Gary,
We are unable to locate any specific cause within our network so trace routes and ping tests may help to uncover the cause/location of any issues being seen. The additional bandwidth has been added and the network has plenty of headroom.
Regards,
Brian
IDNet
Quote from: brian_idnet on Dec 18, 2013, 12:25:53
Hi Gary,
We are unable to locate any specific cause within our network so trace routes and ping tests may help to uncover the cause/location of any issues being seen. The additional bandwidth has been added and the network has plenty of headroom.
Regards,
Brian
IDNet
Thanks Brian, its odd how this manifests, its not bad today so far as Steve said, but yesterday was awful. It seems to get worse from 12Pm onwards, hopefully its sorted but its come back before. Thanks for your input thats really helped answer a few questions :)
trace routes and pings to where.
Anywhere you perceive there is evidence of poor throughput would be a good place to start, sadly I can't recall which IDNet IP addresses have 'ping response' set to a high priority.
Hi all,
Any website should be fine (as long as they respond to pings) Google DNS is a good one (8.8.8.8) You can try our DNS as well 212.69.36.3
212.69.40.3. Those are just examples but anything like that should be fine.
Kind regards
Simon Mulliss
IDNet support
None of those are currently showing any packet loss for me!
The packet loss is kicking in - AGAIN.
I'm sorry but I'm fed up with sending technical details to Idnet. I've lost track of how many times I've done this. I no longer want to waste the time. They just fob you off, and I'm out of patience.
Nothing happens. Nothing is done.
Really, really terrible service.
Dave can you suggest an IP address which is showing packet loss . I've just checked the 3 listed above and packet loss is zero on my line, I've just done a BT Speedtest which is fine for me at 40Mbps. Whilst I can see packet loss appearing on my TBBQM I can't prove it's effect unlike last time when it was clearly paralleling a slowdown in my throughput.
I can see the loss kicking in on the graphs, looking at plusnet and BT but they don't have any but BT has different peering points I believe and huge amounts of bandwidth. My Speed is fine though at a steady 68.10Mbps down and 17.43Mps up
I just had to download a fairly hefty data file from a client in Germany. They're hosted on Rackspace. I usually download their files at a steady 70 Mb/s. I've just downloaded at 35 Mb/s.
I also ran a speedtest at thinkbroadband - I usually get around 72 Mbps - now getting 22 Mbps.
And my upload is now at 8.9 Mb/s instead of around 16-18.
My role isn't to understand what's happening here, or whether it's related to packet loss. But my speeds are dropping - not just in terms of arbitrary speed tests, but in terms of a noticeable drop in performance.
A video conference call yesterday was close to unusable.
Where about in the UK are you, Dave? Sobranie has similar massive slowdowns as well, when I still can download at full speed :dunno: Ping that German address and do a traceroute and send it to SimonM_IDNet
I'm down by the coast-end of the New Forest. Between Bournemouth & Southampton.
Quote from: davecollins on Dec 18, 2013, 17:47:10
I'm down by the coast-end of the New Forest. Between Bournemouth & Southampton.
Not hugely far from me I'm between Portsmouth and Chichester. I guess its dependant on how your traffic is routed, it seems the further west you go the worse it gets, but tbh that is a generalisation at this point.
I'm seeing some packet loss but even the command prompt doesn't see it as significant... or fails at maths ;D
Ping statistics for 212.69.36.207:
Packets: Sent = 999, Received = 995, Lost = 4 (0% loss),
Approximate round trip times in milli-seconds:
Minimum = 8ms, Maximum = 11ms, Average = 8ms
Quote from: mervl on Dec 18, 2013, 05:49:04
You got a major new residential development in the offing too, in the locality?
Actually yes. Sometime soon a couple of hundred houses in the fields near me.
QuoteYou'll have to move with that extra pay from the new job!
Sadly the job change was out of necessity and in order to accelerate the process I had to take a bit of a pay cut. I'm also commuting to Birmingham which costs the thick end of £400 a month.
I'm concentrating on topping off my pensions for the next 8 years so sacrifices have to made. For now :)
As for the connection I'm not seeing very much packet loss on my graphs today. Speed still seems fine.
Edit:Oooh, yes. Now I see a speed difference. Throughput isn't even hitting 50% of normal. Might be TBB though - it complained of being busy when I first tried it.
;) Hope you realised I was only joking Andrue. Pensions are a minefield.
For several months I've found it near impossible to get consistent speedtests, or sometimes to correlate them with packet loss shown by a TBBQM on my IDNet FTTC service. The only thing I can say with certainty is that the TBBQM (mine for some reason incorrectly appears under dedicated/server on Craig's site) correlates with the others for IDNet on that site and much of what is generally reported here, and if the modem can be believed (and I have no reason not to) the line is consistent in terms of DSLAM sync, SNRM, INR/interleaving and attenuation to the cab. Neither (except once which exactly correlated) can I find any evidence of a problem at the exchange. And a second service (not landline) but which I understand uses BTw backhaul, almost invariably shows no packet loss, and consistent speeds, even with the restricted wireless channels and potential for contention to kick in easily.
Three things seem to be consistent: on the landline throughput speeds vary regularly with a reduction of up to 50% (on download as the upload is much more consistent but I am restricted by a low DSLAM maximum attainable limit due to line conditions) connected by ethernet cable and measured downloads are consistent with the tests now as I've always had trouble with the tests apart from the BT Wholesale one which remains consistently good; maximum pings can go very high up to 200ms on the landline broadband (with IDNet) and the average is 26ms consistency (which eliminating the 8ms measured by the modem/router to the cab) are both double what the alternative fixed wireless service shows with no significant variation in throughput speed. As I'm not aware of exchange congestion from any other source and given IDNet's assurance, my assumption was that this is probably all down to BTWholesale congestion, given IDNet's lack of seeing any problem identified by their monitoring. Could I be wrong? Like others I can't get over this being "unique" to IdNet. At the moment pings are about as good as I've seen and better than the TBBQM average but speeds still suffer. I'll try to help with some stats when I can.
I'm paying IDNet's bills, but have reverted to using the fixed wireless service mostly as although it's slower, it's just better (more reliable) on quality of service. VOIP on the landline also seems to suffer, at times being almost unusable which could be down to the reported high latency and jitter although I've not ruled out the router as responsible. Sorry for the ramble, everyone; in case it helps. In terms of my use, apart from the VOIP irritation, none of this matters much to me, though. That's my problem.
How did I know the slowdown would kick in again this afternoon?
Getting half my usual speed as well.
Quote from: mervl on Dec 19, 2013, 11:30:45
;) Hope you realised I was only joking Andrue. Pensions are a minefield.
Yeah no worries :)
If I can stay in employment for another 8 years I should be in a position to retire at 55 if I want but anything can happen over that length of time. Unfortunately I'm definitely getting that 'are we there yet?' syndrome. Have to keep reminding myself that 8 years is still a long time and I can't live like a hermit :laugh:
Down from nearly 75 to around 18Mbs. Am now accepting this as the IDNet norm. Packet loss starting to kick in as well.
(http://www.speedtest.net/result/3177031756.png) (http://www.speedtest.net/my-result/3177031756)
yeah Ive noticed a small speed loss today and had 2 dropped connections this morning about 7:30 and 8:00.
main thing for me is high latency but its been that way for ages....I just forget about it unfortunately until I see things posted here then start checking again
Jumping in on this conversation, I am also experiencing poor connections with packet loss and time-outs on loading webpages, I am guessing my connection has reverted back to BT Wholesale from LLU, which was a much more stable connection for my line. Unfortunately I don't have the TBM running but i don't need it to know something is not working when it takes 5-6 attempts to load a webpage correctly for example the BBC webpage, might only load the text and no graphics until i have refreshed the page several times!
Going to set up the TBM to get some more info on this, but i hope a fix is found soon has its been like this for the last week or so.
Added my TBM, just waiting for the results for the next few hours now...
Hi MK1,
I checked your line out and it is still on LLU currently. I have seen a number of disconnects and a few errors on that circuit. I would advise (if not done so already) testing with the router on the test/master socket checking all the cabling swapping filters and if possible an alternate router. If all of that has been done please let us know as we can schedule a line test to see if there is any potential fault showing on this circuit.
Kind regards
Simon Mulliss
IDNet support
Simon,
Thanks for the quick response, mine line has always been a bit iffy, as the router logs disconnects all the time, but mostly when I'm not using it. The last week also it's been worse with web pages timing out etc. I did in the summer have my router directly connected to the test port as I don't use the landline but hadn't made a big difference previously. I will test it again now and see what happens (although I have an iplate thing installed).
I guess I should also check my router as I have had to reboot it occasionally as it would not connect of for out any internal IP address even when directly connected. I'll try a cheaper router I. The test port and see what happens, doing a test on the line would I guess result in calling an engineer out (this was the advise last time but I didn't want to risk the £100 charge).
Looking at the TBM so far it's all other the place!
Ok different router is plugged in (hence the red block on the TBM) Its an older Netgear DG834g. Interestingly this router picks up less noise than the other router (a netgear DGNG3300), but less throughput (although i guess that is down to the d/c):
DGNG3300 (original router) stats: Old Netgear DG834g:
ADSL Link Downstream Upstream Downsteam Upstream
Connection Speed 3656 kbps 1105 kbps 3059 kbps 1019 kbps
Line Attenuation 57.0 db 33.9 db 52.0 db 17.0 db
Noise Margin 9.2 db 6.4 db 7 db 5 db
I'll leave it for an hour or so to see that the TBM does.
My TBBQM still shows some packet loss but the speeds I'm getting are, frankly, glorious. I'm really not sure what to make of it other than accepting that packet loss apparently means nothing :eyebrow:
I'm getting almost no packet loss today - for a change!
In general, however, the correlation between packet loss and poor speed is clear and obvious.
That said, I have no idea what's happening on your end :-)
So far it's looking like my router is toast! Looking at getting a netgear d6200?
Certainly looks better at the moment.
Plugged the other router in again and similar results as before! I guess the modem is not working very well.
:) Something might have happened - I'm back to 36Mbps+ download speeds (on my line limited to 40Mbps) tonight for just about the first time since the spring. If only it carries on . . . more than double what they were earlier. Pings consistently at above 36ms (21ms from telhouse to me) not the best, but nowhere near the worst either.
Funny how's it's coincided with many businesses shutting down for Cristmas...just a thought.
So left the spare router plug in all night and hardly any packet loss, trying the first (normal) router again now to see if it returns. The loss between 9 and 10 was the normal router. Just want to double check before I get a new one.
Apart from a factory reset and possible firmware update it looks faulty to me!
New router in, no packet loss and my speed tests have upped form around 2.8-3.2 to just over 4! Im surprised a router can make much difference but i guess they go wrong from time to time
I sometimes think the proverbial visiting martian would think that we joined IDNet to give us something to complain about.
:santa: But, seriously, I think that overall the UK consumer and SME market gets an extraordinarily good deal on broadband for the price. So a Christmas thank you to both BT's staff, and those involved in the LLU side and IDNets own staff for the work they do on our behalf in keeping the various networks running. The glitches can be infuriating, so is the marketing, but they are one great batch of dedicated professionals and with what they have to work with the UK bears comparison with anything in the world. I don't think there are too many consumer industries we could say that of.
Quote from: mervl on Dec 22, 2013, 18:48:10
I sometimes think the proverbial visiting martian would think that we joined IDNet to give us something to complain about.
:santa: But, seriously, I think that overall the UK consumer and SME market gets an extraordinarily good deal on broadband for the price. So a Christmas thank you to both BT's staff, and those involved in the LLU side and IDNets own staff for the work they do on our behalf in keeping the various networks running. The glitches can be infuriating, so is the marketing, but they are one great batch of dedicated professionals and with what they have to work with the UK bears comparison with anything in the world. I don't think there are too many consumer industries we could say that of.
On a few glasses Christmas cheer by any chance? ;) Happy Holidays IDNet
Quote from: Gary on Dec 22, 2013, 23:36:08
On a few glasses Christmas cheer by any chance? ;)
If only . . . :fingers:
Now that the UK has gone back to work, the packet loss has returned. So it's clearly related to business usage.
My new year's resolution will be to leave idnet - forever.
Quote from: davecollins on Jan 02, 2014, 14:07:36
Now that the UK has gone back to work, the packet loss has returned. So it's clearly related to business usage.
My new year's resolution will be to leave idnet - forever.
Based on this morning's train commute I'd question if much of the UK has actually gone back to work. But yeah my line is showing packet loss and 'tain't me using it :eyebrow:
I'm jealous - I've been working since Tuesday. Yup, Tuesday. :(
Considering how the speeds and packet loss (lack of) were over the holidays, it looks as though the issue is more likely to be caused by businesses than home users. Right?
In which case perhaps Idnet don't value business accounts as much as they used to.
Either way, I need to get away from them.
in a way its good that you've noticed this new loss after the hols isnt it? might make IDnet look in the right place
I'm definitely seeing it again here. I hope IDNet get this fixed soon or it will be time to move on, sadly.
I can only confirm that the packet loss is back unfortunately.
Tuesday? I returned Monday.
:)
Yes, it's back here too on ADSL2+ (Cornwall, home user) after being totally absent over the holidays. I am not sure how much it is affecting my speed but I feel that in the past it was sending me up the wrong path when I was trying to resolve a problem and it may do the same in the future for someone else. It is annoying and something should really be done about it. >:(
Ah, home at last :)
It's slightly impacting my throughput at the moment but not by a huge amount. Just some variability +/-5% which isn't normally there.
Same here. >:( This is hopefully going to point IDnet in the right direction of I am going to have to think about how to proceed. I really had hoped we had seen the last of this debacle.
That's the trouble - broadband provision is such a mess that it's all swings and roundabouts. A bit of packet loss on the network, but BT's DSLAM firmware upgrade and a firmware upgrade on my router have more than compensated, so the connection is better than ever. I defy anyone to sort it out. What this should teach us is that NO isp is perfect, whatever you think or expect. EDIT: I think the result is that only thing you can be certain about, is your ability to be wrong. :evil:
Quote from: mervl on Jan 03, 2014, 11:31:14
That's the trouble - broadband provision is such a mess that it's all swings and roundabouts. A bit of packet loss on the network, but BT's DSLAM firmware upgrade and a firmware upgrade on my router have more than compensated, so the connection is better than ever. I defy anyone to sort it out. What this should teach us is that NO isp is perfect, whatever you think or expect. EDIT: I think the result is that only thing you can be certain about, is your ability to be wrong. :evil:
IDNet never used to have this issue and it didn't manifest over the holidays, but if it's acceptable to loose say 20Mbps off your speed for £35 a month when you normally get 68Mbs then we have very different views as to whats acceptable. I do expect more because this was not an issue till October. :eyebrow: saying that at this time it seems to be behaving which is good news.
Perhaps IDNet would care to explain why my speed is down from 74 to 16 today coupled with packet loss which started at 12.30am.
I share your frustration, but have given up trying to get Idnet to reply. Or apparently even take this seriously. Nothing is happening about this.
Hi All,
Just a quick update we checked the network again today and found no issues. As part of a test as well we have two FTTC lines setup on the TBB checker and both of those are showing no packet loss. As has been suggested earlier if are experiencing any issues please contact support directly so we can take a further look. including any speedtests/trace routes etc so we can get as much data as we can.
Kind regards
Simon Mulliss
IDNet support
Quote from: SimonM_IDNet on Jan 06, 2014, 13:28:34
including any speedtests/trace routes etc so we can get as much data as we can.
Just about to go on to IDNet connected pc so will try to do so. Other TBB monitors are showing packet loss from 12.30pm today (6 Jan) on IDNet, why aren't IDNets two set ups???
Traceroute has started...
traceroute: Warning: www.bbc.co.uk has multiple addresses; using 212.58.246.93
traceroute to www.bbc.net.uk (212.58.246.93), 64 hops max, 72 byte packets
1 192.168.1.1 (192.168.1.1) 0.409 ms 0.160 ms 0.145 ms
2 telehouse-gw4-lo1.idnet.net (212.69.63.98) 13.696 ms 10.715 ms 18.202 ms
3 212.69.63.78 (212.69.63.78) 7.762 ms 7.524 ms 7.991 ms
4 rt-lonap-b.thdo.bbc.co.uk (5.57.80.91) 7.666 ms 7.491 ms 8.186 ms
5 * * *
6 ae0.er01.cwwtf.bbc.co.uk (132.185.254.93) 8.811 ms 9.202 ms 9.069 ms
7 * 132.185.255.165 (132.185.255.165) 9.620 ms 9.219 ms
8 bbc-vip014.cwwtf.bbc.co.uk (212.58.246.93) 8.995 ms 9.242 ms 9.302 ms
(http://www.speedtest.net/result/3211702761.png) (http://www.speedtest.net/my-result/3211702761)
Hi Simon,
Please Note, since Christmas my speeds have been excellent ... even touched 75Mbps at one point. But, starting today things have all gone to pot again.
I shall post TBB monitor readings in a few hours time.
I haven't the time to commence an extended dialogue with IDNet at the mo.... sorry about that!
Traceroute has started...
traceroute to www.idnet.com (212.69.36.10), 64 hops max, 72 byte packets
1 192.168.1.1 (192.168.1.1) 0.440 ms 0.160 ms 0.143 ms
2 telehouse-gw4-lo1.idnet.net (212.69.63.98) 130.145 ms 223.093 ms 200.195 ms
3 212.69.63.84 (212.69.63.84) 7.897 ms 7.797 ms 7.554 ms
4 redbus-gw5-gi2-1276.idnet.net (212.69.63.9) 7.653 ms 7.722 ms 7.505 ms
5 redbus-gw1-gi5-0-301.idnet.net (212.69.63.209) 8.305 ms 7.796 ms 7.711 ms
6 bob.idnet.net (212.69.36.10) 7.909 ms 8.059 ms 7.645 ms
(http://www.thinkbroadband.com/ping/share-thumb/1d90f1b9be0b0858e68013c674974b2f.png) (http://www.thinkbroadband.com/ping/share/1d90f1b9be0b0858e68013c674974b2f.html)
Tracert to Google is meaningless, but this is what I get to CNN.com:
1 192.168.1.1 2ms 2ms 2ms TTL:255 (Vigor.router ok)
2 212.69.63.98 17ms 18ms 31ms TTL:254 (telehouse-gw4-lo1.idnet.net ok)
3 212.69.63.78 17ms 16ms 17ms TTL:253 (No rDNS)
4 212.113.9.65 17ms 16ms 16ms TTL:251 (ge-5-2-7.edge6.London1.Level3.net ok)
5 4.69.139.120 103ms 143ms 153ms TTL: 52 (ae-52-52.csw2.London1.Level3.net ok)
6 4.69.153.141 152ms 103ms 142ms TTL: 52 (ae-59-224.ebr2.London1.Level3.net ok)
7 4.69.137.78 103ms 142ms 162ms TTL: 52 (ae-44-44.ebr1.NewYork1.Level3.net ok)
8 4.69.201.66 143ms 122ms 122ms TTL: 52 (No rDNS)
9 4.69.143.213 143ms 103ms 143ms TTL: 52 (ae-1-100.ebr1.Washington12.Level3.net ok)
10 4.69.148.105 103ms 102ms 102ms TTL: 53 (ae-6-6.ebr1.Atlanta2.Level3.net ok)
11 4.69.150.13 113ms 142ms 142ms TTL:245 (ae-1-51.edge4.Atlanta2.Level3.net ok)
12 No Response * * *
13 No Response * * *
14 No Response * * *
15 No Response * * *
16 No Response * * *
17 No Response * * *
18 No Response * * *
19 No Response * * *
And my Broadband Quality Monitor:
(http://www.thinkbroadband.com/ping/share-thumb/e8e8e3ff4cb22ec7276c28222f9e6156-06-01-2014.png)
1 192.168.1.1 2ms 1ms 2ms TTL:255 (Vigor.router ok)
2 212.69.63.98 17ms 19ms 50ms TTL:254 (telehouse-gw4-lo1.idnet.net ok)
3 212.69.63.78 16ms 16ms 16ms TTL:253 (No rDNS)
4 80.249.97.109 16ms 16ms 16ms TTL:252 (gi4-42-75-idnet.bdr-rt3.thdo.ncuk.net bogus rDNS: host not found [authoritative])
5 80.249.97.9 17ms 22ms * TTL:251 (gi1-24-10-star1.core-rs2.thdo.ncuk.net bogus rDNS: host not found [authoritative])
6 80.249.99.130 17ms 16ms 17ms TTL: 59 (www.thinkbroadband.com ok)
More if it helps?
traceroute to www.thinkbroadband.co.uk (80.249.99.130), 64 hops max, 72 byte packets
1 192.168.1.1 (192.168.1.1) 0.424 ms 0.187 ms 0.150 ms
2 telehouse-gw4-lo1.idnet.net (212.69.63.98) 106.241 ms 133.778 ms 10.564 ms
3 212.69.63.78 (212.69.63.78) 7.745 ms 7.860 ms 7.730 ms
4 gi4-42-75-idnet.bdr-rt3.thdo.ncuk.net (80.249.97.109) 7.697 ms 7.870 ms 7.630 ms
5 gi1-24-10-star1.core-rs2.thdo.ncuk.net (80.249.97.9) 9.167 ms 8.836 ms 8.374 ms
6 www.thinkbroadband.com (80.249.99.130) 8.168 ms 7.842 ms 8.171 ms
Quote from: SimonM_IDNet on Jan 06, 2014, 13:28:34
Hi All,
Just a quick update we checked the network again today and found no issues. As part of a test as well we have two FTTC lines setup on the TBB checker and both of those are showing no packet loss. As has been suggested earlier if are experiencing any issues please contact support directly so we can take a further look. including any speedtests/trace routes etc so we can get as much data as we can.
Kind regards
Simon Mulliss
IDNet support
Whilst not denying the validity of that statement, I can assure you that TBBQMs of mine,Lance's and ZappaDPJ lines, all FTTC are showing signs of packet loss, however a BT Speedtest performed just now for my connection shows excellent throughput.
Ping has started...
PING www.thinkbroadband.co.uk (80.249.99.130): 56 data bytes
64 bytes from 80.249.99.130: icmp_seq=0 ttl=59 time=8.268 ms
64 bytes from 80.249.99.130: icmp_seq=1 ttl=59 time=7.856 ms
64 bytes from 80.249.99.130: icmp_seq=2 ttl=59 time=7.855 ms
64 bytes from 80.249.99.130: icmp_seq=3 ttl=59 time=7.994 ms
64 bytes from 80.249.99.130: icmp_seq=4 ttl=59 time=7.924 ms
64 bytes from 80.249.99.130: icmp_seq=5 ttl=59 time=7.801 ms
64 bytes from 80.249.99.130: icmp_seq=6 ttl=59 time=8.093 ms
64 bytes from 80.249.99.130: icmp_seq=7 ttl=59 time=8.095 ms
64 bytes from 80.249.99.130: icmp_seq=8 ttl=59 time=8.368 ms
64 bytes from 80.249.99.130: icmp_seq=9 ttl=59 time=8.160 ms
--- www.thinkbroadband.co.uk ping statistics ---
10 packets transmitted, 10 packets received, 0.0% packet loss
round-trip min/avg/max/stddev = 7.801/8.041/8.368/0.179 ms
And suddenly its all ok again.
Just a thought, but could this be a TBBQM issue? :dunno:
Quote from: Steve on Jan 06, 2014, 14:07:27
Whilst not denying the validity of that statement, I can assure you that TBBQMs of mine,Lance's and ZappaDPJ lines, all FTTC are showing signs of packet loss, however a BT Speedtest performed just now for my connection shows excellent throughput.
Hi Steve,
That does seem odd. Again this is why we would require more information to find out whats happening with your connections and why.
I have done a 5min test on both yours and Davecollins IP addresses and so far no packet loss. About the CNN trace route that clearly left our network but the default is 30 hops maximum and there is only 19 there did it state trace complete at the end? (those no replys but passed on to another hop would mean traffic was passed on the but the ping request was either not responded to or took to long to respond to that ping request but the traffic was still passed on)
Quote from: Simon on Jan 06, 2014, 14:23:54
Just a thought, but could this be a TBBQM issue? :dunno:
Thing is when it happens Simon instead of hitting 65-68Mbps it goes from 26Mbps to 44Mbps to 30Mbps its all over the place. :dunno: Right now its ok again my end and pings are fine.
Thanks Simon, one does wonder what's going on, normally with that degree of packet loss showing I would expect a reduction in throughput, however 42Mbps down is good for my FTTC although if I examine them closely the packet loss disappeared again at 14:00
My live TBBQM
(http://www.thinkbroadband.com/ping/share-thumb/0429b3376de91675c94ba090cb920923.png) (http://www.thinkbroadband.com/ping/share/0429b3376de91675c94ba090cb920923.html)
Quote from: Steve on Jan 06, 2014, 14:07:27I can assure you that TBBQMs of mine,Lance's and ZappaDPJ lines, all FTTC are showing signs of packet loss
And mine:
(http://www.thinkbroadband.com/ping/share-thumb/5337e4cab4e6647f96b72990aa80046b-06-01-2014.png) (http://www.thinkbroadband.com/ping/share/5337e4cab4e6647f96b72990aa80046b-06-01-2014.html)
Happens about the same time every day (tho' perhaps a bit earlier today), ditto the yellow in the evening (though I suspect that's my exchange rather than IDNet)
Speedtests are inconclusive, sometimes bad during packet loss periods, sometimes OK.
My thoughput just hit the floor, sites were having issues loading.
Traceroute has started...
traceroute to www.idnet.com (212.69.36.10), 64 hops max, 72 byte packets
1 192.168.1.1 (192.168.1.1) 0.472 ms 0.245 ms 0.163 ms
2 telehouse-gw4-lo1.idnet.net (212.69.63.98) 21.024 ms 20.679 ms 20.877 ms
3 212.69.63.84 (212.69.63.84) 19.849 ms 19.471 ms 19.313 ms
4 redbus-gw5-gi2-1276.idnet.net (212.69.63.9) 19.346 ms 19.420 ms 19.503 ms
5 redbus-gw1-gi5-0-301.idnet.net (212.69.63.209) 20.510 ms 19.609 ms 19.803 ms
6 bob.idnet.net (212.69.36.10) 20.180 ms 7.886 ms 7.922 ms
While gw4 may not treat traces with high priority the difference between then when my speeds were wonky and now they are fine is huge. from 223.093 ms to 21.024ms
It looks to me as though you have to get the data at the EXACT time the packet loss is occurring: my speedtest/ping was 7Mbps down/49ms pings, and a couple of minutes later were at a normal 37Mbps down/24ms pings. Uploads don't seem to be affected though.
EDIT I monitored the router/modem - cab connection via the router GUI and that was consistent throughout.
Mines at the bottom of all my posts if its needed to be checked.
I also get slower down speeds when the packet loss is around, getting into the single digits sometimes.
Quote from: mervl on Jan 06, 2014, 14:42:34
It looks to me as though you have to get the data at the EXACT time the packet loss is occurring: my speedtest/ping was 7Mbps down/49ms pings, and a couple of minutes later were at a normal 37Mbps down/24ms pings. Uploads don't seem to be affected though.
That does seem to be the case my lowest was 22Mbps and now its back up in the higher 60's again. My upload speeds remain the same.
Quote from: psp83 on Jan 06, 2014, 14:42:49
Mines at the bottom of all my posts if its needed to be checked.
Ditto for mine, I meant to mention that.
FWIW from the sunny north my speed is its usual 20-40Mbs (65Mbs at night). TBBQM shows packet loss.
(http://www.thinkbroadband.com/ping/share-thumb/7e3bc64dcab6f93f4ce5e5c0920323ad-06-01-2014.png) (http://www.thinkbroadband.com/ping/share/7e3bc64dcab6f93f4ce5e5c0920323ad-06-01-2014.html)
Just to confirm what Steve has said, I can see that every IDNet TBBQM we monitor which includes both FTTC and ADSL connections, all showing packet loss between midday and 2.00pm. Although I wouldn't describe the degree of packet loss as substantial, typically four in every hundred packets, it usually coincides with a major drop in throughput.
Quote from: zappaDPJ on Jan 06, 2014, 14:53:34
Just to confirm what Steve has said, I can see that every IDNet TBBQM we monitor which includes both FTTC and ADSL connections, all showing packet loss between midday and 2.00pm. Although I wouldn't describe the degree of packet loss as substantial, typically four in every hundred packets, it usually coincides with a major drop in throughput.
It seems to happen again early evening to, Zap, and then after 8:30pm ish all is fine again till the next day when it starts again, maybe finding a pattern with timing would be useful?
It probably would Gary. Posting a snap-shot BQM sometime before the end of each day might help with that.
Quote from: zappaDPJ on Jan 06, 2014, 14:59:52
It probably would Gary. Posting a snap-shot BQM sometime before the end of each day might help with that.
What I don't understand is why we can see it and would have to do this, and support sees nothing when we get wonky speeds, and its not always the same people that get wonky speeds either ??? Time for a cup of tea I think.
Yes, I also see the speed drops, and then correlate this with what I see in TBBQM.
I run JD's Auto Speed Tester - http://www.gmwsoftware.co.uk/ - , and you can see what happens to the download speeds. This is sampled every hours. Can you spot where today's packet loss began? And today was mild. So far...
(http://content.screencast.com/users/Davecol/folders/Snagit/media/e5d6b643-d473-46a6-a5ae-c6eeb0380a59/01.06.2014-15.04.png)
I've just been looking at a Plusnet TBBQM and there a trace of packet loss on there, same timing but not to the same degree!
Im down to 38Mbps but pings are fine at 8ms :dunno: Edit 20Mbps now :(
Packet loss is back, speeds are slow..
(http://www.speedtest.net/result/3211902584.png) (http://www.speedtest.net/my-result/3211902584)
Pinging bbc.co.uk [212.58.251.195] with 32 bytes of data:
Reply from 212.58.251.195: bytes=32 time=39ms TTL=120
Reply from 212.58.251.195: bytes=32 time=31ms TTL=120
Reply from 212.58.251.195: bytes=32 time=40ms TTL=120
Reply from 212.58.251.195: bytes=32 time=37ms TTL=120
Reply from 212.58.251.195: bytes=32 time=41ms TTL=120
Reply from 212.58.251.195: bytes=32 time=42ms TTL=120
Reply from 212.58.251.195: bytes=32 time=46ms TTL=120
Reply from 212.58.251.195: bytes=32 time=38ms TTL=120
Reply from 212.58.251.195: bytes=32 time=49ms TTL=120
Reply from 212.58.251.195: bytes=32 time=47ms TTL=120
Reply from 212.58.251.195: bytes=32 time=40ms TTL=120
Reply from 212.58.251.195: bytes=32 time=29ms TTL=120
Reply from 212.58.251.195: bytes=32 time=30ms TTL=120
Reply from 212.58.251.195: bytes=32 time=41ms TTL=120
Reply from 212.58.251.195: bytes=32 time=22ms TTL=120
Reply from 212.58.251.195: bytes=32 time=22ms TTL=120
Reply from 212.58.251.195: bytes=32 time=22ms TTL=120
Reply from 212.58.251.195: bytes=32 time=22ms TTL=120
Reply from 212.58.251.195: bytes=32 time=22ms TTL=120
Reply from 212.58.251.195: bytes=32 time=22ms TTL=120
Reply from 212.58.251.195: bytes=32 time=22ms TTL=120
Reply from 212.58.251.195: bytes=32 time=22ms TTL=120
Reply from 212.58.251.195: bytes=32 time=22ms TTL=120
Reply from 212.58.251.195: bytes=32 time=22ms TTL=120
Reply from 212.58.251.195: bytes=32 time=22ms TTL=120
Reply from 212.58.251.195: bytes=32 time=23ms TTL=120
Reply from 212.58.251.195: bytes=32 time=22ms TTL=120
Reply from 212.58.251.195: bytes=32 time=23ms TTL=120
Reply from 212.58.251.195: bytes=32 time=22ms TTL=120
Reply from 212.58.251.195: bytes=32 time=22ms TTL=120
Reply from 212.58.251.195: bytes=32 time=22ms TTL=120
Reply from 212.58.251.195: bytes=32 time=23ms TTL=120
Request timed out.
Reply from 212.58.251.195: bytes=32 time=23ms TTL=120
Reply from 212.58.251.195: bytes=32 time=22ms TTL=120
Reply from 212.58.251.195: bytes=32 time=23ms TTL=120
Reply from 212.58.251.195: bytes=32 time=22ms TTL=120
Reply from 212.58.251.195: bytes=32 time=22ms TTL=120
Reply from 212.58.251.195: bytes=32 time=23ms TTL=120
Reply from 212.58.251.195: bytes=32 time=23ms TTL=120
Reply from 212.58.251.195: bytes=32 time=22ms TTL=120
Reply from 212.58.251.195: bytes=32 time=23ms TTL=120
Reply from 212.58.251.195: bytes=32 time=22ms TTL=120
Reply from 212.58.251.195: bytes=32 time=23ms TTL=120
Reply from 212.58.251.195: bytes=32 time=22ms TTL=120
Reply from 212.58.251.195: bytes=32 time=23ms TTL=120
Reply from 212.58.251.195: bytes=32 time=22ms TTL=120
Reply from 212.58.251.195: bytes=32 time=23ms TTL=120
Reply from 212.58.251.195: bytes=32 time=22ms TTL=120
Reply from 212.58.251.195: bytes=32 time=22ms TTL=120
Reply from 212.58.251.195: bytes=32 time=22ms TTL=120
Reply from 212.58.251.195: bytes=32 time=23ms TTL=120
Reply from 212.58.251.195: bytes=32 time=22ms TTL=120
Reply from 212.58.251.195: bytes=32 time=27ms TTL=120
Reply from 212.58.251.195: bytes=32 time=22ms TTL=120
Reply from 212.58.251.195: bytes=32 time=22ms TTL=120
Reply from 212.58.251.195: bytes=32 time=22ms TTL=120
Reply from 212.58.251.195: bytes=32 time=22ms TTL=120
Reply from 212.58.251.195: bytes=32 time=22ms TTL=120
Reply from 212.58.251.195: bytes=32 time=22ms TTL=120
Reply from 212.58.251.195: bytes=32 time=23ms TTL=120
Reply from 212.58.251.195: bytes=32 time=22ms TTL=120
Reply from 212.58.251.195: bytes=32 time=22ms TTL=120
Request timed out.
Reply from 212.58.251.195: bytes=32 time=22ms TTL=120
Reply from 212.58.251.195: bytes=32 time=22ms TTL=120
Reply from 212.58.251.195: bytes=32 time=22ms TTL=120
Reply from 212.58.251.195: bytes=32 time=22ms TTL=120
Reply from 212.58.251.195: bytes=32 time=22ms TTL=120
Reply from 212.58.251.195: bytes=32 time=23ms TTL=120
Reply from 212.58.251.195: bytes=32 time=22ms TTL=120
Reply from 212.58.251.195: bytes=32 time=22ms TTL=120
Reply from 212.58.251.195: bytes=32 time=23ms TTL=120
Reply from 212.58.251.195: bytes=32 time=22ms TTL=120
Reply from 212.58.251.195: bytes=32 time=22ms TTL=120
Reply from 212.58.251.195: bytes=32 time=23ms TTL=120
Reply from 212.58.251.195: bytes=32 time=22ms TTL=120
Reply from 212.58.251.195: bytes=32 time=23ms TTL=120
Reply from 212.58.251.195: bytes=32 time=23ms TTL=120
Reply from 212.58.251.195: bytes=32 time=23ms TTL=120
Reply from 212.58.251.195: bytes=32 time=22ms TTL=120
Reply from 212.58.251.195: bytes=32 time=22ms TTL=120
Reply from 212.58.251.195: bytes=32 time=22ms TTL=120
Reply from 212.58.251.195: bytes=32 time=22ms TTL=120
Reply from 212.58.251.195: bytes=32 time=22ms TTL=120
Reply from 212.58.251.195: bytes=32 time=22ms TTL=120
Reply from 212.58.251.195: bytes=32 time=22ms TTL=120
Reply from 212.58.251.195: bytes=32 time=23ms TTL=120
Reply from 212.58.251.195: bytes=32 time=22ms TTL=120
Reply from 212.58.251.195: bytes=32 time=23ms TTL=120
Reply from 212.58.251.195: bytes=32 time=23ms TTL=120
Reply from 212.58.251.195: bytes=32 time=22ms TTL=120
Reply from 212.58.251.195: bytes=32 time=22ms TTL=120
Reply from 212.58.251.195: bytes=32 time=22ms TTL=120
Request timed out.
Reply from 212.58.251.195: bytes=32 time=22ms TTL=120
Request timed out.
Reply from 212.58.251.195: bytes=32 time=22ms TTL=120
Reply from 212.58.251.195: bytes=32 time=22ms TTL=120
Reply from 212.58.251.195: bytes=32 time=22ms TTL=120
Ping statistics for 212.58.251.195:
Packets: Sent = 100, Received = 96, Lost = 4 (4% loss),
Approximate round trip times in milli-seconds:
Minimum = 22ms, Maximum = 49ms, Average = 24ms
Tracing route to bbc.co.uk [212.58.253.67]
over a maximum of 100 hops:
1 <1 ms <1 ms <1 ms home.gateway [192.168.1.254]
2 43 ms 22 ms 22 ms telehouse-gw4-lo1.idnet.net [212.69.63.98]
3 22 ms 22 ms 21 ms 212.69.63.78
4 22 ms 21 ms 22 ms rt-lonap-b.thdo.bbc.co.uk [5.57.80.91]
5 * * * Request timed out.
6 23 ms 23 ms 23 ms ae0.er01.cwwtf.bbc.co.uk [132.185.254.93]
7 23 ms 23 ms 23 ms 132.185.255.156
8 24 ms 23 ms 23 ms www-vip.cwwtf.bbc.co.uk [212.58.253.67]
Trace complete.
Quote from: psp83 on Jan 06, 2014, 15:18:05
Packet loss is back, speeds are slow..
(http://www.speedtest.net/result/3211902584.png) (http://www.speedtest.net/my-result/3211902584)
My speeds are very low now but pings are fine
Ping has started...
PING www.idnet.com (212.69.36.10): 56 data bytes
64 bytes from 212.69.36.10: icmp_seq=0 ttl=59 time=8.651 ms
64 bytes from 212.69.36.10: icmp_seq=1 ttl=59 time=8.631 ms
64 bytes from 212.69.36.10: icmp_seq=2 ttl=59 time=7.995 ms
64 bytes from 212.69.36.10: icmp_seq=3 ttl=59 time=8.036 ms
64 bytes from 212.69.36.10: icmp_seq=4 ttl=59 time=8.092 ms
64 bytes from 212.69.36.10: icmp_seq=5 ttl=59 time=8.151 ms
64 bytes from 212.69.36.10: icmp_seq=6 ttl=59 time=8.787 ms
64 bytes from 212.69.36.10: icmp_seq=7 ttl=59 time=8.192 ms
64 bytes from 212.69.36.10: icmp_seq=8 ttl=59 time=8.151 ms
64 bytes from 212.69.36.10: icmp_seq=9 ttl=59 time=8.172 ms
--- www.idnet.com ping statistics ---
10 packets transmitted, 10 packets received, 0.0% packet loss
round-trip min/avg/max/stddev = 7.995/8.286/8.787/0.273 ms
I have to agree with the general consensus of opinion here, my throughput at this time is also highly variable (although my upstream is normal). It's also very noticeable while browsing that pages are taking a long time to resolve.
Just updated mine with trace route and ping.
My traceroute and pings are fine, my speed is now 39.40 Mbps so half my usual, and pages are loading like treacle. :bawl:
Dont know if this helps in any way but heres mine sorry if its too much.
Tracing route to www.bbc.net.uk [212.58.246.92]
over a maximum of 30 hops:
1 <1 ms <1 ms <1 ms 192.168.0.1
2 30 ms 30 ms 30 ms redbus-gw3.idnet.net [212.69.63.42]
3 29 ms 29 ms 29 ms redbus-gw2-gi5-301.idnet.net [212.69.63.210]
4 30 ms 30 ms 29 ms rt-lonap-b.thdo.bbc.co.uk [5.57.80.91]
5 * * * Request timed out.
6 31 ms 30 ms 31 ms ae0.er01.cwwtf.bbc.co.uk [132.185.254.93]
7 32 ms 33 ms 32 ms 132.185.255.165
8 32 ms 31 ms 31 ms bbc-vip013.cwwtf.bbc.co.uk [212.58.246.92]
Trace complete.
Tracing route to www.idnet.com [212.69.36.10]
over a maximum of 30 hops:
1 <1 ms <1 ms <1 ms 192.168.0.1
2 30 ms 30 ms 30 ms redbus-gw3.idnet.net [212.69.63.42]
3 30 ms 30 ms 30 ms redbus-gw1-gi5-0-301.idnet.net [212.69.63.209]
4 29 ms 29 ms 29 ms bob.idnet.net [212.69.36.10]
Trace complete.
Tracing route to cnn.com [157.166.226.25]
over a maximum of 30 hops:
1 <1 ms <1 ms <1 ms 192.168.0.1
2 30 ms 29 ms 30 ms redbus-gw3.idnet.net [212.69.63.42]
3 29 ms 29 ms 29 ms redbus-gw2-gi5-301.idnet.net [212.69.63.210]
4 30 ms 30 ms 30 ms telehouse-gw5-gi5-331.idnet.net [212.69.63.6]
5 30 ms 29 ms 29 ms ge-5-2-7.edge6.London1.Level3.net [212.113.9.65]
6 118 ms 116 ms 116 ms ae-52-52.csw2.London1.Level3.net [4.69.139.120]
7 117 ms 117 ms 116 ms ae-57-222.ebr2.London1.Level3.net [4.69.153.133]
8 117 ms 132 ms 116 ms ae-43-43.ebr1.NewYork1.Level3.net [4.69.137.74]
9 115 ms 123 ms 115 ms 4.69.201.70
10 115 ms 115 ms 116 ms ae-1-100.ebr1.Washington12.Level3.net [4.69.143.
213]
11 116 ms 116 ms 117 ms ae-6-6.ebr1.Atlanta2.Level3.net [4.69.148.105]
12 116 ms 115 ms 116 ms ae-1-51.edge4.Atlanta2.Level3.net [4.69.150.13]
13 * * * Request timed out.
14 * * * Request timed out.
15 * * * Request timed out.
16 * * * Request timed out.
17 * * * Request timed out.
18 * * * Request timed out.
19 * * * Request timed out.
20 * * * Request timed out.
21 * * * Request timed out.
22 * * * Request timed out.
23 * * * Request timed out.
24 * * * Request timed out.
25 * * * Request timed out.
26 * * * Request timed out.
27 * * * Request timed out.
28 * * * Request timed out.
29 * * * Request timed out.
30 * * * Request timed out.
Trace complete.
Tracing route to www.thinkbroadband.co.uk [80.249.99.130]
over a maximum of 30 hops:
1 <1 ms <1 ms <1 ms 192.168.0.1
2 30 ms 30 ms 29 ms redbus-gw3.idnet.net [212.69.63.42]
3 30 ms 30 ms 30 ms redbus-gw2-gi2-300.idnet.net [212.69.63.226]
4 30 ms 30 ms 29 ms telehouse-gw5-gi5-331.idnet.net [212.69.63.6]
5 31 ms 31 ms 31 ms gi4-42-75-idnet.bdr-rt3.thdo.ncuk.net [80.249.97
.109]
6 30 ms 31 ms 30 ms gi1-24-10-star1.core-rs2.thdo.ncuk.net [80.249.9
7.9]
7 31 ms 31 ms 31 ms www.thinkbroadband.com [80.249.99.130]
Trace complete.
Pinging www.thinkbroadband.co.uk [80.249.99.130] with 32 bytes of data:
Reply from 80.249.99.130: bytes=32 time=30ms TTL=58
Reply from 80.249.99.130: bytes=32 time=31ms TTL=58
Reply from 80.249.99.130: bytes=32 time=30ms TTL=58
Reply from 80.249.99.130: bytes=32 time=30ms TTL=58
Ping statistics for 80.249.99.130:
Packets: Sent = 4, Received = 4, Lost = 0 (0% loss),
Approximate round trip times in milli-seconds:
Minimum = 30ms, Maximum = 31ms, Average = 30ms
Packet loss here, too:
(http://www.thinkbroadband.com/ping/share-thumb/2120a90c9f0839e9d1efcee1bf4197a8-06-01-2014.png)
It definitely appears as if it could be business-related. Rough times of my packet loss so far this year:
Jan 1st (bank holiday): none
Jan 2nd (Thur): between 13:45 and 17:00
Jan 3rd (Fri): intermittently from 11:00 to 11:30, 13:30 to 14:00 and 15:30 to 17:30
Jan 4th (Sat): Small amount, but that coincided with other issues I was having
Jan 5th (Sun): none at all
Jan 6th (Mon): see above
As this thread seems to be collecting data, here's what I have just going back through December last year:
Sun 1st: 20:00 to 23:00
Mon 2nd: Intermittently all day, but mainly between 17:00 and 23:00
Tue 3rd: 12:30 to 16:00
Wed 4th: horrendous day! 04:00 to 11:00 (huge spike at 07:00), 16:30 to 18:00 and 21:00 to 23:00
Thur 5th: 18:30 to 21:00
Mon 9th: 16:00 to 17:00
Tue 10th: Intermittently between 16:30 and 22:00
Wed 11th: 11:00 to 12:00, then intermittently from 14:00 to 22:00
Thur 12th: 15:30 to 16:00
Mon 16th: Intermittently all day between 09:00 and 22:00
Tue 17th: 11:00 to 17:00
Wed 18th: 16:00 to 17:30
Fri 20th: 11:30 to 15:00
Mon 23rd: 10:00 to 13:00
Sat 28th: 13:00 to 15:30
All other days packet loss was either non-existent, negligible, or coincided with other issues I was having. HTH :)
My ADSL2+ connection follows everyone else's patterns. Here's todays
(http://www.thinkbroadband.com/ping/share-thumb/458dfd2049f5936ffd794f084044a65b-06-01-2014.png) (http://www.thinkbroadband.com/ping/share/458dfd2049f5936ffd794f084044a65b-06-01-2014.html)
I've also just noticed that since the early hours of the 3rd I've had continuous jitter:
(http://www.thinkbroadband.com/ping/share-thumb/73e49770e220499009d90373ba065286-03-01-2014.png)
I do have a new router now but that was installed two days before and wasn't showing any jitter back then:
(http://www.thinkbroadband.com/ping/share-thumb/18cb9aa2e519cdaeb32c3cffbcf0f939-01-01-2014.png)
Actually my usage is a little concerning as well :(
Here we go again, 3/4 speed vanished. Packet loss has started too!
(http://www.speedtest.net/result/3214107207.png) (http://www.speedtest.net/my-result/3214107207)
Yup - same here. It's always early afternoon.
The question is: if there are so many idnet customers experiencing this and proving it, why are idnet still apparently waiting for the problem to resolve itself?
Simon: seriously, what do we need to do to convince you there's a problem here?
Some packet loss here too (BQMs in sig), and this time speed has taken a hit too:
(http://www.thinkbroadband.com/speedtest/button/138910318932742494599.png) (http://www.thinkbroadband.com/speedtest/results.html?id=138910318932742494599)
Even the single-thread download, which never usually budges from ~12Mbps :bawl:
(http://www.speedtest.net/result/3214156810.png) (http://www.speedtest.net/my-result/3214156810)
Started here again, worse than before if anything. Ignore spike around 11:00am, I and to reboot the router.
(http://www.thinkbroadband.com/ping/share-thumb/452e80ee3021cd46d2cb43e27d8925b1-07-01-2014.png)
24Mbps...this is ridiculous what the hell is going on IDnet!!?
Same here. Not expecting any meaningful reply from them though. Would love to be proved wrong.
I've just done 3 BT Speedtests and they confirm I've lost 3/4 of my download speed with the associated packet loss.
1. 192.168.1.254 0.0% 28 0.5 0.5 0.4 0.7 0.0
2. telehouse-gw4-lo1.idnet.net 0.0% 28 23.7 36.0 23.2 131.6 30.2
3. redbus-gw2-gi3-331.idnet.net 46.4% 28 23.4 23.6 22.6 30.6 1.9
4. redbus-gw2-gi3-331.idnet.net 37.0% 28 23.1 23.6 22.7 27.0 1.0
5. redbus-gw1-gi5-0-301.idnet.net 0.0% 28 23.8 25.1 22.9 65.1 7.9
6. www.idnet.net 0.0% 27 23.2 23.3 22.6 23.8 0.3
Even worse now
1. 192.168.1.254 0.0% 128 0.4 0.4 0.4 1.1 0.1
2. telehouse-gw4-lo1.idnet.net 0.8% 128 25.1 39.5 23.1 277.2 36.6
3. redbus-gw2-gi3-331.idnet.net 1.6% 128 23.9 23.4 22.4 28.3 0.7
4. redbus-gw2-gi3-331.idnet.net 96.8% 128 23.8 23.5 23.0 24.1 0.5
5. redbus-gw1-gi5-0-301.idnet.net 2.3% 128 23.6 24.0 22.6 48.3 2.9
6. www.idnet.net 0.0% 128 23.3 24.3 22.7 87.3 6.1
Damn you IDnet, I'm trying to look online for new carpets and you are stopping me from spending money because sites are slow at loading, DAMN YOU! ;) ;D :P
On a serious note... Anyone at IDnet want to update ?
MAC requested, I can't put up with this any longer. It's been cr*p today.
Roll on July when I can ditch this ISP..
(http://www.thinkbroadband.com/ping/share-thumb/1d90f1b9be0b0858e68013c674974b2f.png) (http://www.thinkbroadband.com/ping/share/1d90f1b9be0b0858e68013c674974b2f.html)
(http://www.speedtest.net/result/3214258649.png) (http://www.speedtest.net/my-result/3214258649)
Oh joy! Compare to the graph in my signature which is very typical of what I can get.
(http://www.thinkbroadband.com/speedtest/button/138910767081852093027.png)
I tried posting to get their attention on their Facebook page but my post was apparently deleted.
Quite incredible. We've used Idnet for years, but this is simply awful.
Time for me to find a new provider.
Hi All,
Following further investigations, we have submitted a new upgrade order with BT which is due to complete on 14th and we will also be carrying out network maintenance work this coming Sunday morning which should resolve the issue.
Regards,
Brian
IDNet
Quote from: brian_idnet on Jan 07, 2014, 15:40:21
Hi All,
Following further investigations, we have submitted a new upgrade order with BT which is due to complete on 14th and we will also be carrying out network maintenance work this coming Sunday morning which should resolve the issue.
Regards,
Brian
IDNet
Thanks Brian, glad to here you have found the issue hopefully :thumb:
Wierd thing is, I have not noticed any impact on my download speed at all - I have only seen that there is an 'issue' after coming here. My TBB graph does show the packet loss though.
edit removed graphs as they showed names on them??
However, a client's IDNET line shows pretty much nothing... so it's not across the board.
Quote from: SimonM_IDNet on Jan 06, 2014, 13:28:34
Hi All,
Just a quick update we checked the network again today and found no issues. As part of a test as well we have two FTTC lines setup on the TBB checker and both of those are showing no packet loss. As has been suggested earlier if are experiencing any issues please contact support directly so we can take a further look. including any speedtests/trace routes etc so we can get as much data as we can.
Kind regards
Simon Mulliss
IDNet support
Thanks for the update. Interesting. Not read the whole thread, so wondering if there is a local choke point somewhere?
What is the issue....not that i'll understand but some people will and it might help a bit as to why its happening.
Ping and packets seem fine here. Did notice a slow site yesterday but wondered if that was the site.
Quote from: davecollins on Jan 07, 2014, 15:27:13
I tried posting to get their attention on their Facebook page but my post was apparently deleted.
Quite incredible. We've used Idnet for years, but this is simply awful.
Time for me to find a new provider.
Well I can see your FB post!
Quote from: jameshurrell on Jan 07, 2014, 16:35:55
Wierd thing is, I have not noticed any impact on my download speed at all - I have only seen that there is an 'issue' after coming here. My TBB graph does show the packet loss though.
edit removed graphs as they showed names on them??
However, a client's IDNET line shows pretty much nothing... so it's not across the board.
I don't always see any effect on speed either. I'm not convinced that the speed drops and packet loss are related, but we'll see what happens in a week or so's time. Hopefully I'm wrong ;D
(Assuming BT don't lose the order again :mad:)
Quote from: davecollins on Jan 07, 2014, 15:27:13
I tried posting to get their attention on their Facebook page but my post was apparently deleted.
Quite incredible. We've used Idnet for years, but this is simply awful.
Time for me to find a new provider.
I can see your post too on FB
I can see my posts too. Conspiracy theory shattered then!
Fingers crossed that this actually resolves the situation.
At least the packet loss caused me to spot a runaway mail server. It prompted me to check my TBBQM and saw the jitter. Turned out my server was correctly detecting spam to invalid accounts but was redirecting the mails to a no-one account instead of rejecting them outright. That was tolerable until the new year then some script kiddy started sending mails that were 100kB in size. Doesn't sound too bad..except the git was sending three or four a second.
Since the 1st I've burnt through around 70GB of data :eek4:
Hopefully I've corrected it now and my line seems a lot quieter. With a bit of care I should be able to get to the end of the month without having to buy any bandwidth :fingers:
I think things like that have always put me off running my own mail server, I'm happy to pay someone else, as that sort of bandwidth usage could get very expensive if left unnoticed.
Maybe a system similar to the alarm when IDnet phone tariff calls go over a certain amount in a short time could be implemented for Broadband? On a different subject I would like to know what this maintenance occurring in Sunday is.
Quote from: Gary on Jan 08, 2014, 09:25:11
Maybe a system similar to the alarm when IDnet phone tariff calls go over a certain amount in a short time could be implemented for Broadband? On a different subject I would like to know what this maintenance occurring in Sunday is.
It would be very, very nice if IDNet did something like that. Personally I'd be prepared to pay a little extra just for the peace of mind. I'm still trying to remember why I changed those filters to redirect in the first place. It was about a year ago and presumably I felt there was a good reason. I wonder if my new router supports SNMP?
Oooh, according to Billion it does. In that case all I need is a monitoring utility on my server and I should be able to post warnings to myself.
http://www.dart.com/snmp-free-manager.aspx
There are also RSS feeds for your bandwidth usage - if that helps?
Quote from: davecollins on Jan 08, 2014, 10:04:27
There are also RSS feeds for your bandwidth usage - if that helps?
If you were away or at work an email saying something is going on would be useful, then you could contact someone who maybe would be able to pull the plug till you can deal with it.
Quote from: davecollins on Jan 08, 2014, 10:04:27
There are also RSS feeds for your bandwidth usage - if that helps?
A passable alternative, perhaps. At least they seem to show your usage so far today (give or take an hour). Shame that doesn't appear on the portal.
Do you mean on the forum?
Quote from: Simon on Jan 08, 2014, 11:03:59
Do you mean on the forum?
No, I meant on the IDNet portal, https://www.idnet.net/secure/
Quote from: andrue on Jan 08, 2014, 11:38:12
No, I meant on the IDNet portal, https://www.idnet.net/secure/
It does - under bandwidth usage.
Quote from: davecollins on Jan 08, 2014, 11:47:29
It does - under bandwidth usage.
Mine doesn't. It only shows usage up to the day before. To find out today's running total I need to get the RSS.
'During the time period 1 January 2014 to 7 January 2014 your bandwidth use was:'
Note: Today is the 8th.
Quote from: andrue on Jan 08, 2014, 12:17:20
Mine doesn't. It only shows usage up to the day before. To find out today's running total I need to get the RSS.
'During the time period 1 January 2014 to 7 January 2014 your bandwidth use was:'
Note: Today is the 8th.
Doesn't the Android/(not sure about) ios app show running usage hourly in arrear (using the RSS feed). Useful when out and about, if you've access to the right mobile phone, but not sure what you can do about it.
Ring IDNet and ask them to drop your connection? :dunno:
Quote from: mervl on Jan 08, 2014, 13:07:32
Doesn't the Android/(not sure about) ios app show running usage hourly in arrear (using the RSS feed). Useful when out and about, if you've access to the right mobile phone, but not sure what you can do about it.
Didn't know there was such a thing. If so that could be very nice.
http://www.idnetters.co.uk/forums/index.php/topic,21518.0.html
The one I was thinking of for Android is this: https://play.google.com/store/apps/details?id=uk.co.karn.idnet. There's an old one too, but this is the "new" one - need to follow instructions to set it up*. (There also the PC version which the post above mentions). Have to search on Apple Store for iPhones though, I don't know. But as it's no longer maintained - the developer having left IDNet, we'll be stuck if IDNet ever change their RSS feed, perhaps on a website upgrade [Hint, don't].
*Remember it's a widget (need two spaces on a homescreen) so don't try to find it in apps is usually the secret. The do it with your username and password (for IDNet's portal) is the easiest to set up - screen appears when you try to place the widget, have to specify your allowance(s) and whether single (default) or dual rate, though.
I found the 'droid widget but it wouldn't run on my S3. I got it to log on to the portal and get the details. Then it rendered a small window with a 'please wait' icon. Then it crashed with a message about 'Met Office app'. An odd message that - I do have the Met Office weather app installed but it seemed fine ???
Quote from: andrue on Jan 09, 2014, 08:30:28
I found the 'droid widget but it wouldn't run on my S3. I got it to log on to the portal and get the details. Then it rendered a small window with a 'please wait' icon. Then it crashed with a message about 'Met Office app'. An odd message that - I do have the Met Office weather app installed but it seemed fine ???
Oops, shouldn't do that. I've both running together on my Xperia Z. I know weather apps can be prone to crash messages (whilst they still appear to be running) but they shouldn't affect anything else. I get the please wait icon (and it does take a bit of time, a couple of minutes or so to configure). Can you configure manually with the details (after presumably an uninstall/reboot/reinstall) and perhaps temporarily disable the met office app during install - force close on the apps list if all else fails during the install then reboot afterwards if necessary. But first how did you try to set up the widget on the home screen - did you clear an icon space (2 of them required) and place it specifically (drag and drop on my 'droids) or was the IDNet widget trying (perhaps by default) to replace the weather widget - which won't work? Most apps you set up then place the widget, the IDNet app does it the other way around, place the widget first and set up appears. Otherwise I'm as stumped as you, [EDIT] unless Android 4.3 or 4.4 (kitkat) has changed something as the widget isn't updated any more - I'm still running 4.2.2, and the more I hear about Google's tampering the less inclined I am to upgrade.
Quote from: Gary on Jan 08, 2014, 09:25:11
Maybe a system similar to the alarm when IDnet phone tariff calls go over a certain amount in a short time could be implemented for Broadband? On a different subject I would like to know what this maintenance occurring in Sunday is.
I may be bold here, but that kind of system needs flagging user side. I'd love such up to date and real time tracking, but specialist use requires special requests does it not? I'd not expect IDNet to call me to tell me my (hypothetical) remote server is down for example. But at the same time if they wish to offer/sell such service that would be great. :P
Quote from: Technical Ben on Jan 09, 2014, 21:32:17
I may be bold here, but that kind of system needs flagging user side. I'd love such up to date and real time tracking, but specialist use requires special requests does it not? I'd not expect IDNet to call me to tell me my (hypothetical) remote server is down for example. But at the same time if they wish to offer/sell such service that would be great. :P
Okay, not sure where you got the telephone idea from, I never mentioned that, but feel to free-wheel with your imagination where ISP's actually call you :eyebrow: What I was talking about however was as within the post you highlighted. I had typed using letters of the alphabet but maybe they are hieroglyphics and its only myself that can read them, in which case I apologise.
The plot was mainly about a system similar to the one IDNet uses for your phone line, if you have a phone line with IDNet of course. If you do you are sent an email if you have unusually high call charges on your account. So I was thinking a similar system could be used if an unusual burst of activity appeared on your broadband account within a short space of time, which could possibly indicate a problem. With FTTC download speeds being usually quite high that could get very costly very quickly as it ate into your monthly allowance. I really thought all this was quite self explanatory, but obviously I had just boiled my head thinking it was a egg, and none of it made any sense at all. ;)
The only individual automatic line monitoring I'm aware of is from AAISP but I've not found any evidence that this system does anything other than monitor.
I can look at live traffic in and out globally and individually in real time and historically with my Asus router, I could monitor this remotely by logging in but I haven't yet. What I can't do other than set individual port and device throughput limits is for the router to warn me when throughput to any device exceeds a pre defined limit.
Obviously there are third party solutions for those running a server that will alert you in real time!
I'll be looking into solutions more at the weekend. In the process I've found something rather scary. Although my mail server was the major problem it wasn't all of it. Even when I'd fixed my server the usage was still 2.5GB a day. I've now determined that to be the Samknows Whitebox. With that disconnected my usage is down to 0.3GB a day. That's the email server spending all night and day telling people to bog off and me browsing a bit in the evening. Clear it's a good thing I have FTTC :)x
Oh and sadly Samknows has just lot a participant. They claimed (and it originally was) 3GB a month. Possibly I could get them to put it back to a lower figure but I've lost all trust in an organisation that can suddenly saddle you with 60GB a month of additional downloads.
What the heck is the Whitebox doing, I thought it was supposed to monitor performance not watch movies! :shake:
Edit: seems like they're only sensible on a fast FTTC line with an unlimited product. It must be performing a lot of throughput tests can you see in their logs what it's doing?
Quote from: Gary on Jan 09, 2014, 23:00:02
Okay, not sure where you got the telephone idea from, I never mentioned that, but feel to free-wheel with your imagination where ISP's actually call you :eyebrow: What I was talking about however was as within the post you highlighted. I had typed using letters of the alphabet but maybe they are hieroglyphics and its only myself that can read them, in which case I apologise.
The plot was mainly about a system similar to the one IDNet uses for your phone line, if you have a phone line with IDNet of course. If you do you are sent an email if you have unusually high call charges on your account. So I was thinking a similar system could be used if an unusual burst of activity appeared on your broadband account within a short space of time, which could possibly indicate a problem. With FTTC download speeds being usually quite high that could get very costly very quickly as it ate into your monthly allowance. I really thought all this was quite self explanatory, but obviously I had just boiled my head thinking it was a egg, and none of it made any sense at all. ;)
Them calling was a bit of hyperbole to show we all have different needs. Some more than others. I understand some products offer the top of the range service level. I'm not sure if that is true here to such an extent that IDNet will give up to the hour warnings (other than email) that a network is really hugging the bandwidth. Theoretically a stray server could eat a monthly bandwidth amount in 1 day. That tends to be the responsibility of the owner and not the supplier though. That's all.
I don't disagree with you. I'm just wondering if it's asking too much for such an update service to be provider side at this time. I have no way to track phone call charges (only how much time I use) on my side of the line. So a phone use update service is really helpful. But with a router/PC I can track download/upload use much quicker than even IDNet can (depending on the systems given to them from BT or their own servers). Me checking 1 router/PC line might be less resource hungry than IDNet setting up a system that ends up tracking all customers when it's only needed/used infrequently.
Quote from: Steve on Jan 10, 2014, 08:36:16
What the heck is the Whitebox doing, I thought it was supposed to monitor performance not watch movies! :shake:
http://forums.thinkbroadband.com/fibre/t/4294652-re-samknows-whitebox-usage.html
Definitely time to make like Cartman me thinks :)
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zyltK6pmJGg
Sounds like one hell of a cracking business model that doesn't it.
We'll sell you a device that connects to your network to measure performance (data that we can sell) but we reserve the right to adjust how much bandwidth it uses as and when we see fit but we'll make no financial contribution to your bandwidth bill if your ISP charges you for your bandwidth or decides to levy a fine due to excessive use.
But hey cheer up, you are contributing to quality monitoring and the owner of the business is laughing all the way to the bank.
its quite bad today, lets hope tomorrow upgrade fixes the issues.
Same here - fingers crossed!
I didn't think it was any worse than usual, but I'll join in with the crossed fingers!
Quote from: Bill on Jan 13, 2014, 16:19:45
I didn't think it was any worse than usual, but I'll join in with the crossed fingers!
It's really bad for me today, probably the worst it's been in a while but highly variable.
Same - I'm down to 23 down; usually 75.
Quote from: zappaDPJ on Jan 13, 2014, 16:41:34
It's really bad for me today, probably the worst it's been in a while but highly variable.
Yes, mine has worsened in the last half hour or so. I hadn't refreshed the tab for a while :red:
Very odd - I'm back up to near-normal speeds. Hopefully this thread will die tomorrow when our BT overlords flick their magic switch, tighten their screws or throw out the dead animals... whatever they do.
So much for the tweaks then ???
I don't think your going to see anything until the host link upgrade has gone through,which I assume is again at peak capacity this evening.
Quote from: Steve on Jan 13, 2014, 22:46:01
I don't think your going to see anything until the host link upgrade has gone through,which I assume is again at peak capacity this evening.
The issue I have is IDNet say and I quote "By refusing to oversubscribe our broadband services, we always ensure that
bandwidth investment exceeds demand guaranteeing you the highest possible performance and reliability from your connection" Frankly that really isnt the case, and if this was something I had bought from a shop I would have taken it back as its not fit for purpose or of satisfactory quality, as implied by the label! If tomorrows upgrade does not sort the issue out I will have to take this as time to make an official complaint, and if IDNet and I cant come to a reasonable solution take it further. :shake: I really hope this gets fixed once and for all as I have really had more than enough now.
Well I just had a call from IDnet Simon (director) saying the new bandwidth is in place, he explained they have had a lot of new unlimited business accounts and I guess things slipped but they hope this will sort the issue out, if not they will keep on top of things till it does. :fingers: I have to say I really appreciated the call. Thanks Simon. :)
I also had a call from Simon - very reassuring that they're taking this seriously. So far so good - no packet loss and good speeds. We'll know this afternoon.
Quote from: davecollins on Jan 14, 2014, 10:53:56
We'll know this afternoon.
That we will. Hopefully it will be fine now.
Quote from: Gary on Jan 13, 2014, 23:24:27
The issue I have is IDNet say and I quote "By refusing to oversubscribe our broadband services, we always ensure that bandwidth investment exceeds demand guaranteeing you the highest possible performance and reliability from your connection"
Can IDNet, or anyone else, actually do literally what that says? I'd love to see the outcome of a formal arbitration on that point. Actually, it wouldn't come to that; if they have any commercial sense (which they do) IDNet would let you leave and good luck with finding your "perfect" ISP. Create your own, perhaps?. Every contract has to be interpreted with a degree of common sense, I can say with some confidence having spent my working life dealing with contract law in a professional capacity. There might be better luck with the ASA, who seem ready to jump on just about anybody if they can't justify their marketing claims. The result is to get the marketing claim removed, if that makes you feel better.
Quote from: mervl on Jan 14, 2014, 11:28:38
Can IDNet, or anyone else, actually do literally what that says? I'd love to see the outcome of a formal arbitration on that point. Actually, it wouldn't come to that; if they have any commercial sense (which they do) IDNet would let you leave and good luck with finding your "perfect" ISP. Create your own, perhaps?. Every contract has to be interpreted with a degree of common sense, I can say with some confidence having spent my working life dealing with contract law in a professional capacity. There might be better luck with the ASA, who seem ready to jump on just about anybody if they can't justify their marketing claims. The result is to get the marketing claim removed, if that makes you feel better.
Really? So If for instance you say go to a bar and get half a pint from the barmen in a pint glass, and are told its because the floor was slippery or someone nudged him and its busy and you accept that pint, thats up to you. However most people would not put up with that, and for good reason. That analogy applies here, mervl.
IDNet pride themselves on performance and oddly enough people do tend to read the label on what they buy and expect the product to resemble that description, weird isn't it, but they do... Now I know nothing is perfect but also I do have something to base this ISP's current performance on and that is their track record, so using that as a yardstick when things go wrong is perfectly acceptable, as is quoting this company's aims on performance, especially when they have worked for a good many years.
It is one of their core statements, it is something that they have defended on this forum when comparing with other ISP products.
Quote from: Steve on Jan 14, 2014, 12:27:59
It is one of their core statements, it is something that they have defended on this forum when comparing with other ISP products.
Exactly Steve, and that's the reason many of us joined.
1. 192.168.1.254 0.0% 26 0.5 0.5 0.4 0.7 0.1
2. telehouse-gw4-lo1.idnet.net 0.0% 26 23.9 28.4 22.8 88.0 13.6
3. redbus-gw2-gi3-331.idnet.net 0.0% 26 23.7 23.3 22.9 24.4 0.3
4. redbus-gw2-gi3-331.idnet.net 83.3% 25 23.8 23.3 22.8 23.8 0.4
5. redbus-gw1-gi5-0-301.idnet.net 0.0% 25 23.6 23.6 22.4 24.3 0.4
6. www.idnet.net 0.0% 25 23.6 23.4 22.8 24.3 0.4
:(
Definitely a marked improvement on yesterday :thumb:
(http://www.thinkbroadband.com/ping/share-thumb/2df9b0a9f5e04d6c3b0cea581487812c-14-01-2014.png) (http://www.thinkbroadband.com/ping/share/2df9b0a9f5e04d6c3b0cea581487812c-14-01-2014.html)
Slight trace od red but that's always been there in the afternoon, and back up to full speed. Thank you IDNet :)
Yup - I also saw slight hints of red, but speeds were consistently good all day. Hooray!
13th:
(http://www.thinkbroadband.com/ping/share-thumb/ec4a3b081dfa5d99b67dfe4a32f368c3-13-01-2014.png)
14th:
(http://www.thinkbroadband.com/ping/share-thumb/0a58db3a780ed79d721336c0c01c31f9-14-01-2014.png)
An improvement , but apparently only back to where this thread started. My speeds have never been compromised however.
Quote from: Gary on Jan 14, 2014, 10:47:04
Well I just had a call from IDnet Simon (director) saying the new bandwidth is in place, he explained they have had a lot of new unlimited business accounts and I guess things slipped but they hope this will sort the issue out, if not they will keep on top of things till it does. :fingers: I have to say I really appreciated the call. Thanks Simon. :)
Sounds like a potentially difficult balancing act with some unlimited business users. I was looking at the timing do they only work in the afternoons, watch sport all afternoon because they've done their daily work in the morning or wait for the east coast of the US to wake up.
Quote from: Steve on Jan 15, 2014, 08:33:14
Sounds like a potentially difficult balancing act with some unlimited business users. I was looking at the timing do they only work in the afternoons, watch sport all afternoon because they've done their daily work in the morning or wait for the east coast of the US to wake up.
Probably a mass playing of Candy Crush mid afternoon, Steve. ;) It is odd timing though, you would expect spikes in the morning when people get to work...
Quote from: joe on Jan 15, 2014, 08:24:10
An improvement , but apparently only back to where this thread started. My speeds have never been compromised however.
Looking at a few IDNet on craigs, some graphs some show hardly any some show a bit more like yours, this could be down to the local exchanges too, as its not completely across the board but its worth keeping an eye on. I found though that the TBBQM showed packet loss but actual pings didn't :dunno:
Ray's line has almost been totally unaffected throughout the whole affair.
Quote from: Glenn on Jan 15, 2014, 08:53:38
Ray's line has almost been totally unaffected throughout the whole affair.
Is he on adsl, adsl2+, LLU or FTTC, Glenn?
8mb ADSL I believe
Quote from: Gary on Jan 15, 2014, 09:07:09
Is he on adsl, adsl2+, LLU or FTTC, Glenn?
Yes I'm on 8Mb ADSL Gary, this is my line over the last couple of days: -
Still all goes from BT into IDNet towers over the same link though, regardless of package.
Quote from: Lance on Jan 15, 2014, 09:33:53
Still all goes from BT into IDNet towers over the same link though, regardless of package.
True but it seems FTTC got hammered more often than adsl and adsl2+ Lance. Which makes me wonder about how the bandwidth was balanced.
Could it be that the higher frequencies used for FTTC are effected more than the ADSL frequencies?
Quote from: Glenn on Jan 15, 2014, 13:04:07
Could it be that the higher frequencies used for FTTC are effected more than the ADSL frequencies?
Probably, Glenn.
Break in connection this morning. Anyone else? any connection to new upgrade?
(http://www.thinkbroadband.com/ping/share-thumb/82d10ecd7df4a6dca55bbc63e5aa23a3-15-01-2014.png)
Nothing here, either in BQMs or router log.
Great here. No packet loss at all and good speed.
(http://www.thinkbroadband.com/speedtest/button/13897980631485962462-mini.png) (http://http:http://www.thinkbroadband.com/speedtest/results.html?id=13897980631485962462)
hasnt made any difference to mine but saying that I didnt really have the bother others have.My main concern is the high min latency, why is it that way, has been for a while. Also heres a graph from yesterday with nothing used between 1pm and 8pm as we were out
Anyone else getting that familiar sinking feeling?
(http://www.thinkbroadband.com/ping/share-thumb/bce4dae021ca3c46792ef7a7a2a6585f-15-01-2014.png)
Here is mine - definitely packet loss still showing from 4:30pm onwards as indeed it is on most other ones I can see too.
(http://www.thinkbroadband.com/ping/share-thumb/189570ac33dd62e2a60bc22526130117-15-01-2014.png) (http://www.thinkbroadband.com/ping/share/189570ac33dd62e2a60bc22526130117-15-01-2014.html)
(http://www.thinkbroadband.com/ping/share-thumb/d4225a368311078bb6bb27dfba4e1bfc-15-01-2014.png) (http://www.thinkbroadband.com/ping/share/d4225a368311078bb6bb27dfba4e1bfc-15-01-2014.html)
Getting it as well
Ditto, speed is fine though.
(http://www.thinkbroadband.com/ping/share-thumb/7e01ce1af98f51d31d4ea358c50e3a75-15-01-2014.png) (http://www.thinkbroadband.com/ping/share/7e01ce1af98f51d31d4ea358c50e3a75-15-01-2014.html)
Snap!!!!!
(http://www.thinkbroadband.com/ping/share-thumb/d9df43442fe0d1c57eb3bfeda42c37b0-15-01-2014.png) (http://www.thinkbroadband.com/ping/share/d9df43442fe0d1c57eb3bfeda42c37b0-15-01-2014.html)
Time of day makes me think of a company doing a large off-site backup... interesting to see if it's a regular occurrence.
It's not enough to bother me.
Quote from: Glenn on Jan 15, 2014, 13:04:07
Could it be that the higher frequencies used for FTTC are effected more than the ADSL frequencies?
But that's a local issue. For FTTC it's only between your house and cabinet. For ADSL between house and exchange. After that your data has been encoded as optical pulses and is on its way across BT's network. There's no difference there between ADSL, FTTC or even voice for that matter. Just a collection of 0s and 1s pulsing their way across the country like millions of fireflies trapped inside glass tubing :)
Such an effect can't be network-wide. Unless there happens to be a significant increase in EM noise across the entire country in the afternoon. That would effect every ISP's customer, medium wave or maybe even VHF radio and would probably have made the news headlines ;)
ditto, upgrade appears to have had little impact
(http://www.thinkbroadband.com/ping/share-thumb/82d10ecd7df4a6dca55bbc63e5aa23a3-15-01-2014.png)
Let's see how today pans out. Tuesday was great, so I don't know what happened yesterday. I wish Idnet kept us informed.
Quote from: davecollins on Jan 16, 2014, 08:12:25
Let's see how today pans out. Tuesday was great, so I don't know what happened yesterday. I wish Idnet kept us informed.
<sigh> I guess the more bandwidth they purchase the more the big business users will suck up and in the end its vicious circle, they cant keep buying more and more it makes no sense financially. I am wondering with FTTC and unlimited business user packages if the days of the niche provider are numbered :-\
on the few occasions I get any packet loss it usually seems to occur in the evening.
(http://www.thinkbroadband.com/ping/share-thumb/1d3a1472889a5ac81f18e2920900c7b9-16-01-2014.png) (http://www.thinkbroadband.com/ping/share/1d3a1472889a5ac81f18e2920900c7b9-16-01-2014.html)
I wonder if that"s the local exchange then Ray?
Quote from: Ray on Jan 16, 2014, 09:36:32
on the few occasions I get any packet loss it usually seems to occur in the evening.
I sometimes get a little packet loss in the evening, but routinely get increased latency (yellow on the BQM, sometimes enough to show a bit of blue) from about 6pm to 11pm, which I've put down to a
lot of online viewing through my exchange, which is probably also the cause of my packet loss. In other words- BT's fault, not IDNet's.
I've also heard that FTTP is available around here in some areas (Didcot exchange), if it's true then it's unlikely to be helping :(
Quote from: Gary on Jan 16, 2014, 08:50:12
<sigh> I guess the more bandwidth they purchase the more the big business users will suck up and in the end its vicious circle, they cant keep buying more and more it makes no sense financially. I am wondering with FTTC and unlimited business user packages if the days of the niche provider are numbered :-\
Wouldn't that follow for all providers though? Surely the bigger the provider, the more customers they have, and the more bandwidth those customers will use. It's just a question of proportion.
Quote from: Simon on Jan 16, 2014, 10:39:19
Wouldn't that follow for all providers though? Surely the bigger the provider, the more customers they have, and the more bandwidth those customers will use. It's just a question of proportion.
True though maybe bigger providers have bigger pipes for the business side who knows :dunno:
Quote from: Steve on Jan 16, 2014, 10:00:47
I wonder if that"s the local exchange then Ray?
I suspect it is, Glenn, there are a lot of complaints from BT customers in the area about poor speeds and hopefully our exchange is in line to be upgraded to fibre under the BDUK scheme in the next 12 months.
Quote from: Simon on Jan 16, 2014, 10:39:19
Wouldn't that follow for all providers though? Surely the bigger the provider, the more customers they have, and the more bandwidth those customers will use. It's just a question of proportion.
The bigger providers can just 1) Not provide the service, who's going to do anything about it? 2) Kick the users off, who's going to do anything about it? 3) Change the terms, it's not like they stick to them anyway 4) Add small print.
I know people paying BT or Vodaphone/Virgin or TalkTalk etc who don't actually get a service (constant drops, 215k etc), but for some unknown reason, they have still been paying them £15-£20 or more a month for years now. :dunno:
I think the bigger mainstream providers may have a greater mix of customers. Some may be high bandwidth users streaming films etc, whilst some may just use their broadband for a few emails and a little web browsing. This means there may not need to be a proportionate increase in network capacity to users.
Coming late to the party, but just wanted to add that this has also been affecting me (and most other IDNet customers by the looks of it). My graph from Monday is attached. Small packet loss, only on week days, always in the afternoon. Still had it yesterday, though not quite as bad as in recent weeks, so it's possible the upgrade did something but not enough, or it may just be a blip and nothing has changed; only time will tell. I'm on FTTC, getting (when it's at working properly) around 65-70Mbps.
Monday's Graph:
(http://www.thinkbroadband.com/ping/share-thumb/9ce367fc6222feb7560002c5635b5050-13-01-2014.png)
P.S. If anyone can think of a plausible likely cause for the regular latency spikes I see (from the graph appear to be every 30mins), then do let me know. I've had them ever since FTTC was installed a couple of years, and they appears regardless of whether or not any devices are attached to the router (i.e. even with all connected devices powered off and the router log confirming no activity, I still see them). The router is a Netgear WNDR3400 if that's any help. They're not causing an obvious problem; I'm just curious as to why they're present. 8-)
Quote from: karvala on Jan 16, 2014, 16:31:44P.S. If anyone can think of a plausible likely cause for the regular latency spikes I see (from the graph appear to be every 30mins), then do let me know.
One of the technicolor ADSL modem/routers used to do that and it was thought to be because the CPU was underpowered and running some regular housekeeping task.
http://www.thinkbroadband.com/faq/sections/bqm.html#310
A couple of days ago I upgraded my service from 40/10 to 80/20. Naturally I've been conducting speed tests to see how much of a speed increase there's been.
This was typical of my 40/10 connection before the upgrade...
(http://www.speedtest.net/result/3177776863.png) (http://www.speedtest.net/my-result/3177776863)
This was what I was getting after the 80/20 upgrade was applied, yesterday afternoon during a period of mild packet loss...
(http://www.speedtest.net/result/3233480692.png) (http://www.speedtest.net/my-result/3233480692)
(http://www.speedtest.net/result/3233608275.png) (http://www.speedtest.net/my-result/3233608275)
This is typical of what I was getting last night...
(http://www.speedtest.net/result/3234089093.png) (http://www.speedtest.net/my-result/3234089093)
I've not been able to do any testing today except for one test just now which matched the test from last night. I will however try and test again tomorrow mid afternoon.
Quote from: karvala on Jan 16, 2014, 16:31:44
P.S. If anyone can think of a plausible likely cause for the regular latency spikes I see (from the graph appear to be every 30mins), then do let me know.
Quote from: andrue on Jan 16, 2014, 16:49:03
One of the technicolor ADSL modem/routers used to do that and it was thought to be because the CPU was underpowered and running some regular housekeeping task.
I get that (tho' not as obviously) on my Asus RT-N66, and I don't think that's short of CPU power :P
It happens with several routers, and Andrue isn't far out- the usual thought is that it's doing some housekeeping with a lower priority than normal traffic but higher than responding to a ping.
Quote from: andrue on Jan 16, 2014, 16:49:03
One of the technicolor ADSL modem/routers used to do that and it was thought to be because the CPU was underpowered and running some regular housekeeping task.
http://www.thinkbroadband.com/faq/sections/bqm.html#310
Quote from: Bill on Jan 16, 2014, 17:52:39
I get that (tho' not as obviously) on my Asus RT-N66, and I don't think that's short of CPU power :P
It happens with several routers, and Andrue isn't far out- the usual thought is that it's doing some housekeeping with a lower priority than normal traffic but higher than responding to a ping.
Thanks guys. I've got QoS enabled at the moment, and so I will increase the priority of ICMP packets just out of curiosity, to see if that has any effect.
Barely discernable packet loss at the same time as others this week. I'm coming to the view that it's the "cost" of having no traffic management. Coincidentally at the same time as my IDNet connection has improved, my second fixed wireless connection is suffering from continuous higher average latency - I assume that a new heavy user has joined in my sector: same sort of problem on an unmanaged service.
Other "reliable" major ISPs either don't "allow" business use (Sky) or traffic manage (Plusnet), or perhaps with BT and TalkTalk have specific business services. And Zen have ratcheted up investment by multiples, A&A manage by having very specific and tightly drawn allowances. IDNet are in the uncomfortable middle, squeezed between the demand for bigger allowances and their commitment to no other restrictions. With IDNet do we all go into the same "pot"? Benefit: home users get a business class service; Disbenefit: home users can get affected by heavy business users. You pays your money and takes your pick. Whilst IDNet seem to do doing all they REASONABLY can with capacity and balancing traffic to accommodate everybody, whilst avoiding traffic management, and for me the benefits still outweigh the disadvantage, I'll hang on whilst I can, financially. Everyone has to reach their own conclusion for their own use, though. It seems to me that with the advent of higher speed services and some pretty hefty investment by the mass-market ISPs the correlation between the higher price specialists and quality of service is by no means as strong as it once was. Same as the groceries, loyalties count for less as markets mature. By accident or design though, I seem to contrive to be off-line when the problems occur.
Not keeping up with this thread, but myself and my girlfriend had problems playing games over the net due to packet loss problems. It only seemed to start about 2 weeks ago though. Before that our old netgear routers was causing problems, so once we kicked them out for the Asus ones, it had been fine for a few weeks.
What we did is put the MTU speed down to 1462, as I think it was on 1500, theres a small prog tcp optimiser which can test for fragmented packets. Though once we changed that setting to 1462 all the connection problems went away. Games connect first time everytime, on 1500 it "used" to work. Solved no end of odd connection problems with general stuff like file transfers and all sorts.
Anyone noticing packetloss again tonight, I'm down to 44Mbps from 67Mbps tonight.
Me too! Speeds halved at times since around 4pm and still up the creek. Pkt loss evident too! However, still a little faster than carrier pigeon at the mo. Anyone care to advise me why I pay £45 per month for this service??
Here we go again, what the devil is causing it.
(http://www.thinkbroadband.com/ping/share-thumb/5c621148f919b040715f913d5afe82c4-28-01-2014.png) (http://www.thinkbroadband.com/ping/share/5c621148f919b040715f913d5afe82c4-28-01-2014.html)
No idea, it seems bad tonight, I didnt really notice anything last night as I was not online that much. :( I hope its just glitch. Maybe ongoing issues at Telecity?
Hmmmm. BT are apparently installing Fiber right now. I'd really like the extra upload speed (download is of no concern) for the occasional Youtube Video upload. But is it worth it if Openreach/BT can't get their act together on the infrastructure/hardware/backbone?
PS, is optical susceptible to supernova or normal neutrinos? :whistle:
Quote from: Technical Ben on Jan 28, 2014, 22:14:39
Hmmmm. BT are apparently installing Fiber right now. I'd really like the extra upload speed (download is of no concern) for the occasional Youtube Video upload. But is it worth it if Openreach/BT can't get their act together on the infrastructure/hardware/backbone?
PS, is optical susceptible to supernova or normal neutrinos? :whistle:
I just asked my next door neighbour to try his, he is on BT infinety 2 and he is having no such issues or packetloss :( So the backbone is working fine with some it seems. As to download, its of concern to me as I like to download films via Sky on demand and a HD film is sometimes as much as 4.5GB so this kind of issue ruins that. Its not like the loss of speed mean everything works well pages just dont load and thats at 44Mbps so in theory this weird loss of speed should not be an issue, yet when I do a ping it shows no packetloss. In the day it flies along at 67Mbps. This seems for me to have started tonight although looking at the TBB graphs it happened last night too.
Edit: 22:30 back to full speed again. Hopefully that's the last of it and tomorrow night will be back to normal. :)
[
PS, is optical susceptible to supernova or normal neutrinos? :whistle:
[/quote]
Well, I've been watching Star Trek for quite a few hours so maybe it's that which is causing the prob.
:dunno:
Quote from: sobranie on Jan 28, 2014, 23:30:24
[
PS, is optical susceptible to supernova or normal neutrinos? :whistle:
Well, I've been watching Star Trek for quite a few hours so maybe it's that which is causing the prob.
:dunno:
probably just needs some dilithium crystals
Quote from: sobranie on Jan 28, 2014, 23:30:24
Well, I've been watching Star Trek for quite a few hours so maybe it's that which is causing the prob.
:dunno:
You and a lot of others maybe... I think you've given yourself the answer- this is typical of mine every evening, but I'm reasonably sure it's my exchange rather than anything IDNet can do much about:
(http://www.thinkbroadband.com/ping/share-thumb/3ca89c9d219a79cb51595dbe766b4cf5-28-01-2014.png) (http://www.thinkbroadband.com/ping/share/3ca89c9d219a79cb51595dbe766b4cf5-28-01-2014.html)
Whilst I agree it's a possible answer Bill, and I can only see a small sample of TBBQMs. However all IDNet ones looked the same last night and with the recent history it's not surprising people are keeping an eye on throughput. I note Gary's comment regarding his neighbour where I presume both FTTCs users are on the same exchange but with a different ISP.
Quote from: Steve on Jan 29, 2014, 07:32:12
Whilst I agree it's a possible answer Bill, and I can only see a small sample of TBBQMs. However all IDNet ones looked the same last night and with the recent history it's not surprising people are keeping an eye on throughput. I note Gary's comment regarding his neighbour where I presume both FTTCs users are on the same exchange but with a different ISP.
Same cab, same exchange different ISP's, Steve. Looking at other TBBQM 's this particular pattern seems to be idnets own. Until last night I had no issues at night.Speeds remained constant. I'm partial to some OCD speed tests you see. I'm hoping it was a one off, as I have never gone below 67Mbps at night beforel, and at one point last night I was down to 22Mbps. :eyebrow:
Quote from: Bill on Jan 29, 2014, 07:01:52
You and a lot of others maybe... I think you've given yourself the answer- this is typical of mine every evening, but I'm reasonably sure it's my exchange rather than anything IDNet can do much about:
(http://www.thinkbroadband.com/ping/share-thumb/3ca89c9d219a79cb51595dbe766b4cf5-28-01-2014.png) (http://www.thinkbroadband.com/ping/share/3ca89c9d219a79cb51595dbe766b4cf5-28-01-2014.html)
Here's mine taken from yesterday for comparison.
(http://www.thinkbroadband.com/ping/share-thumb/66bff0cbf3d5e4d763978cf6180a20de-29-01-2014.png) (http://www.thinkbroadband.com/ping/share/66bff0cbf3d5e4d763978cf6180a20de-29-01-2014.html)
Twins!
And here's a speed test taken when the packet loss was first reported.
(http://www.speedtest.net/result/3265512330.png) (http://www.speedtest.net/my-result/3265512330)
Here's another one taken later when I started to notice slow response times from various websites.
(http://www.speedtest.net/result/3265938386.png) (http://www.speedtest.net/my-result/3265938386)
The TBBMQ looks very much like the pattern that occurred during the earlier part of the day to early evening when we had this issue before things were fixed, now it seems to have just moved on a few hours. Well it does to me on one coffee, more may be needed. ;)
To be honest, I've started looking around and asking questions with other ISP's.. these problems lately and the small bandwidth caps & high prices for FTTC product is the reasons.
Something quite nasty seems to have happened to my connection yesterday although I didn't notice.
(http://www.thinkbroadband.com/ping/share-thumb/21a8cbfa931c48bdb1754c63c72060b5-29-01-2014.png)
Just about to look and see if I'm unique. Ah, yeah just me. The 3pm/4pm drop looks like a re-sync to a lower latency (maybe the new DSL cable has had an effect although it's odd to have a resync at that time). The fact it lasted an hour is interesting but I've noticed that whatever router I use it now seems to take a long time and sometimes multiple attempts before I get a PPPoE login. Normally I just keep trying but perhaps this shows that the router will eventually sort it out anyway.
The later spike is me running a speed test although at the time it didn't show any significant improvement but perhaps that was due to the prevailing packet loss.
....... and here we go again!!!!!
(http://www.thinkbroadband.com/ping/share-thumb/728227d0962e156b8990b8b71b6fc6d8-29-01-2014.png) (http://www.thinkbroadband.com/ping/share/728227d0962e156b8990b8b71b6fc6d8-29-01-2014.html)
(http://www.speedtest.net/result/3267819806.png) (http://www.speedtest.net/my-result/3267819806)
My speeds have slipped by over 10Mbps already, I'm to frustrated to even begin to think about this anymore this right now. :shake:
Could any of these be related? (Will be outdated later as it's a live feed, but currently showing Fiber problems on BTs network around the UK.)
https://www.bt.com/consumerFaultTracking/public/faults/tracking.do?pageId=31
Quote from: Technical Ben on Jan 29, 2014, 17:18:38
Could any of these be related? (Will be outdated later as it's a live feed, but currently showing Fiber problems on BTs network around the UK.)
https://www.bt.com/consumerFaultTracking/public/faults/tracking.do?pageId=31
Looking on the craigswebsite its only the idnet TBBQM graphs that are having regular packetloss issues, Plusnet and BT show pretty much nothing at this time. Make of that what you will.
Well. While it can be the IDNet backbone, I kind of understand it. I don't see how they can either compete in investment (load balancing across a larger company is easier than a smaller one I would assume), or in "influence" of the key operators. Not that I expect BT to cause any problems, but they have little to no incentive to not cause problems or to sort out problems they cause for others (such as the BT server deleting IDNet login fiasco they caused a few years back).
We will all have our conspiracy theories. That is inevitable. I suspect things are rather more prosaic. The people who post here are, I suspect, a small minority of IDNet's users: many of the rest don't see a problem and a few of them may be causing the problem. Companies and individuals whose use causes problems for, or whose needs are not met by, other mass-market ISPs will tend to gravitate towards the IDNet's of this world and their business model is designed to attract them. Quite rightly. IDnet don't have, as far as I know, the scale and resources of Zen nor the exhaustive monitoring resources of AAISP, so they don't have the flexibility nor the ability to respond as quickly as their competitors. Nobody's fault. It's frustrating. So is much of life. We've three realistic options: work around it, leave, or wait for IDNet to sort it out. Sorry. I'm sure they'd welcome any practical suggestions, but so far as I can see none of us have any to offer beyond what they're doing (which is an incremental increase in capacity)? And there simply is no contractually guaranteed speed or quality of service on residential broadband, whatever you expect. Ask questions, of course, but often there won't be an obvious or clear answer. (And actually I've never found one to any decent IT/comms question, anywhere, from anybody).
I think that just about sums it up, Merv.
Edit: Post removed. I cant be bothered.
Quote from: mervl on Jan 29, 2014, 18:45:23
We will all have our conspiracy theories. That is inevitable. I suspect things are rather more prosaic. The people who post here are, I suspect, a small minority of IDNet's users: many of the rest don't see a problem and a few of them may be causing the problem. Companies and individuals whose use causes problems for, or whose needs are not met by, other mass-market ISPs will tend to gravitate towards the IDNet's of this world and their business model is designed to attract them. Quite rightly. IDnet don't have, as far as I know, the scale and resources of Zen nor the exhaustive monitoring resources of AAISP, so they don't have the flexibility nor the ability to respond as quickly as their competitors. Nobody's fault. It's frustrating. So is much of life. We've three realistic options: work around it, leave, or wait for IDNet to sort it out. Sorry. I'm sure they'd welcome any practical suggestions, but so far as I can see none of us have any to offer beyond what they're doing (which is an incremental increase in capacity)? And there simply is no contractually guaranteed speed or quality of service on residential broadband, whatever you expect. Ask questions, of course, but often there won't be an obvious or clear answer. (And actually I've never found one to any decent IT/comms question, anywhere, from anybody).
Oh I don't mean it like it's a conspiracy. Mainly it's down to business A wanting to make money, business B also wanting to. Like the post office and one of our own companies. We want the Post office to send a parcel, we pay for it, but don't of cause pay £100s each parcel as we could not sell at those prices. But the post office want to make more profit so sits on the parcel for as long as possible. Who gets the irate customer, hint, not the post office.
Likewise, I see less and less ability for IDNet to do much with the infrastructure, if it moves around them etc. If it's not a problem directly with the connection from Openworld, then I'd assume it's either in IDNets own hardware or that which they rent. I can trust IDNet to do their best, but even then, I wonder how they are coping in the current climate.
I understand the problem might be right at the heart of IDNets own service. It might be their fault. I'm sure though if it is, they are not avoiding "fixing it" if there is a fix available. If they are quiet about it, well, I consider that a bad sign. Either there is nothing they can do, or if they do act, it will have a big effect on their service (prices/competitiveness?).
Its back again for me :(
Me too - again. On Friday too.
Ditto.
It has appeared on mine today, (since lunch time) as my line was disconnected for some reason over the weekend:
(http://www.thinkbroadband.com/ping/share-thumb/d1f57c67a265129052cb331cced8c19f-03-02-2014.png) (http://www.thinkbroadband.com/ping/share/d1f57c67a265129052cb331cced8c19f-03-02-2014.html)
My speeds a bit all over the place again tonight too - with some downloads stopping at 0bps for a while?
TBB speed test looks odd too..
(http://www.thinkbroadband.com/speedtest/button/139146389896709790648.png) (http://www.thinkbroadband.com/speedtest/results.html?id=139146389896709790648)
Was actually thinking of upping my account to a higher usage limit but having doubts, considering this has happened a few times now.
Yes, we are about where we were when I started this thread
(http://www.thinkbroadband.com/ping/share-thumb/c77c9d8504739569a54ae9e1c3b88467-03-02-2014.png)
Quote from: joe on Feb 04, 2014, 08:20:19
Yes, we are about where we were when I started this thread
(http://www.thinkbroadband.com/ping/share-thumb/c77c9d8504739569a54ae9e1c3b88467-03-02-2014.png)
Your one is slightly different from the others, yes there is packetloss showing once again on them all, including idnets dedicated server, but yours is constant, as to whats causing that I'm not sure, it could be your exchange, possibly your router but its definitely different. http://craigswebsites.co.uk/ping/
Hi all,
If anyone is experiencing any major issue as always we would request you send us any data you can to support@idnet.com - This would include trace routes ping tests and speedtests so we can take a further look.
Kind regards
Simon M
IDNet support
Simon,
Can you not consider the various BQM graphs posted here as sufficient evidence of an issue specific to IDNet? If all, or at least most, IDNet users can demonstrate low level packet loss all to the same degree and at the same time, whilst also demonstrating that the issue doesn't exist for other ISPs, surely that is evidence of an IDNet issue?
A lot of users are becoming frustrated at the reoccurring packet loss which to most users would appear to either be congestion (either over the BT pipe, within IDNet's network, or on the peering arrangements) or could point towards hardware issues in core routers/servers/switches.
If you would like more specific tests to be completed by users then please advise of this and the specifics for each test. I'm sure many users here will gladly assist IDNet with trouble shooting.
I would assume as it does not show where/how etc for the packet loss, more info is needed?
Quote from: SimonM_IDNet on Feb 05, 2014, 10:56:50
Hi all,
If anyone is experiencing any major issue as always we would request you send us any data you can to support@idnet.com - This would include trace routes ping tests and speedtests so we can take a further look.
Kind regards
Simon M
IDNet support
Considering the IDNet dedicated server shows the same packetloss, surely thats enough for you? Many people have posted, and we are willing to help, but its the same issue as before, and for a few days things worked smoothly, but its back again, pages are loading slowly, and its very frustrating, as Lance has pointed out. You must have enough information and self diagnostic abilities to work out the when why and how buy now hopefully?
Quote from: Technical Ben on Feb 05, 2014, 12:05:21
I would assume as it does not show where/how etc for the packet loss, more info is needed?
There are only so many times you can tell a plumber that water does not always come out of the tap before they have to start looking further at their own pipework...
Just wondering: Do IDNet's major business users' connections go through the same core hardware? And are they suffering/complaining of the same issues? Because if they are, I'm sure they'd be screaming blue murder. And presumably, their connections are monitored more closely. As reported previously for my connection (otherwise as good as it gets) the deterioration is highly variable: it can be OK and then deteriorate substantially a few minutes later. But the hours of disturbance it can be timed almost exactly 1400-1800 and/or 2000-2200 with lower level daytime packet loss from 1000. :eyebrow:
Quote from: SimonM_IDNet on Feb 05, 2014, 10:56:50
Hi all,
If anyone is experiencing any major issue as always we would request you send us any data you can to support@idnet.com - This would include trace routes ping tests and speedtests so we can take a further look.
Kind regards
Simon M
IDNet support
While I'm quite happy to do this I'd also argue quite strongly that it shouldn't be necessary. There's a clear and obvious problem that's been occurring for months. Everyone posting TBBQMs is displaying the same degree of packet loss at exactly the same time. When this occurs throughput becomes highly erratic for everyone and as another user has touched on, it can actually stop for short periods.
At the moment there's packet loss showing on vitally all the the IDNet live TBBQMs I can see and I can see a lot of them. As usual my throughput has been cut in half. This is in itself is not a major issue but the continual buffering and the fact that I'm constantly losing connection to all manner of servers renders my connection next to useless.
(http://www.thinkbroadband.com/ping/share-thumb/717175835eb8ac23344811649461e275-05-02-2014.png) (http://www.thinkbroadband.com/ping/share/717175835eb8ac23344811649461e275-05-02-2014.html)
(http://www.speedtest.net/result/3284321232.png) (http://www.speedtest.net/my-result/3284321232)
Quote from: SimonM_IDNet on Feb 05, 2014, 10:56:50
If anyone is experiencing any major issue
Like others I'm suffering some small packet loss much of the time. I don't think it's interfering with what I do, so I'm reluctant to call it "major", yet my limited knowledge suggests it shouldn't be happening at all. I'm happy to do other tests if told exactly what's needed.
When the packet loss happens for me, my FTP, SSH and connection sensitive stuff keeps disconnecting, so I'm in the process of looking at a new ISP.
I've been with IDnet now for 7 years and its the first time I've actually been talking to other ISP's customer services trying to get to know what they are like and how they handle things and to see if they are worth my money.
Quote from: psp83 on Feb 05, 2014, 16:03:26I've been with IDnet now for 7 years and its the first time I've actually been talking to other ISP's customer services trying to get to know what they are like and how they handle things and to see if they are worth my money.
I've been a customer for many years as well. I had Simon on the phone recently apologising and saying that this would be fixed, but it didn't last long. It's going to cost me to leave Idnet but I no longer have a choice. I'm already reaching out to a few companies. I don't want to bother going through Idnet's channels again - I always get nowhere.
Quote from: psp83 on Feb 05, 2014, 16:03:26
When the packet loss happens for me, my FTP, SSH and connection sensitive stuff keeps disconnecting, so I'm in the process of looking at a new ISP.
I'm having the same problem Paul.
Quote from: zappaDPJ on Feb 05, 2014, 17:32:59
I'm having the same problem Paul.
Its nightmare for online gaming in a co op, I just bought myself a new PS4 hoping to have many hours of online fun with it. I'm hoping things will improve as my contract is not up till September, I cant really afford to buy myself out that's like throwing money away, and tbh it would be nice not to have to even be thinking of that possibility as IDNet have always been great.
Still dropping here:
(http://www.thinkbroadband.com/ping/share-thumb/068f71f1d237c626d70d7598f6d1760f-05-02-2014.png) (http://www.thinkbroadband.com/ping/share/068f71f1d237c626d70d7598f6d1760f-05-02-2014.html)
??? Both of these TBQM look very simular through today!
Quote from: zappaDPJ on Feb 05, 2014, 13:48:18
While I'm quite happy to do this I'd also argue quite strongly that it shouldn't be necessary. There's a clear and obvious problem that's been occurring for months. Everyone posting TBBQMs is displaying the same degree of packet loss at exactly the same time. When this occurs throughput becomes highly erratic for everyone and as another user has touched on, it can actually stop for short periods.
At the moment there's packet loss showing on vitally all the the IDNet live TBBQMs I can see and I can see a lot of them. As usual my throughput has been cut in half. This is in itself is not a major issue but the continual buffering and the fact that I'm constantly losing connection to all manner of servers renders my connection next to useless.
(http://www.thinkbroadband.com/ping/share-thumb/717175835eb8ac23344811649461e275-05-02-2014.png) (http://www.thinkbroadband.com/ping/share/717175835eb8ac23344811649461e275-05-02-2014.html)
(http://www.speedtest.net/result/3284321232.png) (http://www.speedtest.net/my-result/3284321232)
All good right now - but it won't last. It'll go down this afternoon at some point, and will then continue until it picks up in the evening.
Is anyone else as fed up as I am about this? People using non-Idnet providers aren't seeing this at all. We're getting cr*p performance at a premium price - and nothing is being done about it.
I'm considering taking some more extreme measures over this, but am waiting to speak with Idnet first. I've asked them to call me and will keep people posted.
(http://www.thinkbroadband.com/ping/share-thumb/af42a4faa4d3e42bd83dbf018af326c7-06-02-2014.png)
We're still working on this issue. After we had the extra bandwidth delivered by BT we then doubled the number of LNS servers at the edge of our network in order to distribute the load more evenly. The maintenance work in mid-Jan allowed us to re-route the fibre bearers from BT to terminate on more powerful equipment in our core network. We are also working on moving more of our heaviest bandwidth users onto our LLU network. This is all designed to better balance the traffic flows through our network so that we can ensure the level of performance that we aim to provide.
On the leased-line side of the business we can now provide circuits using either BT Openreach, BT Wholesale, TalkTalk Business, Virgin Media Business, Cable & Wireless and Level3. So we have lots of work going on creating many improvements all designed to make the service as good as you expect from us.
Those of you complaining about small packet losses might want to read this by Adrian Kennard:
http://revk.www.me.uk/2014/02/bt-official-3-packet-loss-is-not-fault.html (http://revk.www.me.uk/2014/02/bt-official-3-packet-loss-is-not-fault.html)
Interesting. Would explain the current "stale mate" that appears in this thread. Also, such contracts on FTTC resellers would presumably be private/NDA? IE, if BT say, "it's 3% or the highway", and hide the details in T&C, who can argue? :(
Or alternatively, if they insist 3% is not a fault, they will not even admit to IDNet there are any packet losses. :slap:
The problem being that it only seems to occur on IDNet BQMs...
I think the issue highlighted by Tacitus is an individual isolated problem rather than the one experienced by many IDNet FTTC users . It does highlight the difficulty in providing a solution and also shows what a damaging effect a small loss can have.
I suppose. But as said, if BT fail to acknowledge it and the problem is on their side, it's not going to get sorted. If it's due to their own opinion or due to the technical limits (teething problems :P ), they just fail to accept any reports? If it is on IDNets side of the line, then I guess FTTC demands a rather large infrastructure, and I wonder if the smaller firms can keep up.
The packet loss seen on IDNet's TBBQMs is just a symptom of a bigger problem i.e. there's currently very little packet loss to be seen but my throughput is so erratic tonight BBC iPlayer keeps reporting that there is insufficient bandwidth to view the content. As far as I recall this is the first time I've seem this happen during the weekend which suggests to me that the problems within IDNet's network are getting worse not better.
Perhaps I'm wrong but you'd expect network usage to be relatively low on a Saturday night, I wonder what BTs upto although I can't see any issues declared anywhere!
Quote from: zappaDPJ on Feb 08, 2014, 22:20:54
The packet loss seen on IDNet's TBBQMs is just a symptom of a bigger problem i.e. there's currently very little packet loss to be seen but my throughput is so erratic tonight BBC iPlayer keeps reporting that there is insufficient bandwidth to view the content. As far as I recall this is the first time I've seem this happen during the weekend which suggests to me that the problems within IDNet's network are getting worse not better.
Speeds have been fine this end tonight, no loss at all, so not sure whats going on Zap :dunno: I have found pages are loading faster too, which is a change as things have been slow for well for ages. Downloading an HD movie or playing online has been no issue, thats not to say it wont be though at a later point, and that's another issue, waiting for it to fail again, as it always seems to at some point. Thats not what I am paying a premium for.
I really think a kind of critical mass of FTTC customers and business customers is occurring and juggling bandwidth is getting to be difficult, and who knows but I'm sure you cant keep buying more if the income is not giving enough profit and cash to expand the network at the same time and pay for what you have running. That's just a guess and I could be way offline, but really I'm lost long term with this thread, this issue and customers going in circles when we can't see inside IDNet to know what's happening with them, or openreach...
If this was something local to me surely it would be affecting other users in my area? My neighbour is on a 40/10Mbp/s BT Infinity infinity connection and while I was having problems he was getting 37.5/9.5Mbp/s. I know this for sure because he allowed me to check his connection.
This was typical of what I was getting at around 10:30pm this evening...
(http://www.speedtest.net/result/3292742035.png) (http://www.speedtest.net/my-result/3292742035)
This is what my TBBQM was showing at that time...
(http://www.thinkbroadband.com/ping/share-thumb/60996afa434c0d7def1d23d35b41ec9e-09-02-2014.png) (http://www.thinkbroadband.com/ping/share/60996afa434c0d7def1d23d35b41ec9e-09-02-2014.html)
This is what I am getting now...
(http://www.speedtest.net/result/3292970732.png) (http://www.speedtest.net/my-result/3292970732)
The packet loss visible on my TBBQM is always directly proportional to a drop in throughput. It is 100% predictable.
Looking at the timing of the two speedtest and relating them to the graph, apart from the packet loss previously mentioned the first to me looks like to have been taken when the connection is under heavy use ie streaming the latter when quiet . Perhaps you and Bill have been using your lines continuously for most of the day but the similarity of you both for the changes in average and maximum latency surprises me.
Ironically the opposite applies Steve. The first speed test was conducted at a time when iPlayer was continually bailing out and the second when it was running smoothly.
The odd thing is nobody used the Internet here between 8.00am and 3.30pm but blue and yellow rug thing would suggest otherwise. Normally my BQM goes all spiky when I use the Internet. I don't think the 'rug' for want of a better term is anything to do with me.
Quote from: Steve on Feb 09, 2014, 03:46:08Perhaps you and Bill have been using your lines continuously for most of the day
Nope.
I d/led a couple of GB around 10am (with a good speed) then, apart from normal email, browsing etc that was it. That blue and yellow on the BQM is nothing to do with me.
Saturday's BQM (the speed in the evening was awful, down around 10-20Mbps from its usual 60+):
(http://www.thinkbroadband.com/ping/share-thumb/c68893193d9fa7d29c431f021ee47f08-08-02-2014.png) (http://www.thinkbroadband.com/ping/share/c68893193d9fa7d29c431f021ee47f08-08-02-2014.html)
There are days when I'm streaming almost continuously... but if Radio 3's 320Kbps is causing latency increase then IDNet really are in trouble!
Correct me if I'm wrong Bill but hasn't the pattern of the variation in maximum latency been there on and off since the power out at Telehouse a couple of weeks ago. Or was it in existence before.
I can't remember when the outage occurred, but it started to become visible around the middle of November and has steadily been getting more pronounced ever since.
It starts at around 4-5pm (often ~1pm at weekends) and has gone by 11-12pm, so heavy video streaming (BT Sport?) would seem to be the prime suspect, and probably local to my exchange. But I can't be sure of that.
It doesn't correlate too well with the periods of packet loss.
All I can say I I experienced no slowdowns last night, my line was running at full speed, all day and evening., craigs seemed to show nothing major with other idnet BQM's apart from a packet loss spike at 2pm ish on IDNets dedicated server.
Edit: is it possible that because we have experience on going issues that other issues, possibly down to local problems hardware etc are being blamed on IDNets problem with packetloss? Just a thought, its easy to get to look at the most obvious especially when it has been the culprit for a while. Weekends for me were always when my line was stable during these episodes, no real issues with 'packetloss' which when you do traceroutes and pings shows nothing oddly enough, when that red curtain does descend. It seems yesterdays graphs look pretty clean for the most part.
I can't be sure whether my speed drops (which normally aren't severe, last night was an exception) are associated with the increased latency or the packet loss... my gut feeling is that it's the latter, but it's hard to tell reliably.
My position is that the increased latency is (probably) something in the hands of BT and my exchange and I just have to put up with it, but the fairly reliable packet loss period shouldn't be there!
Quotebut that fairly reliable packet loss period shouldn't be there!
I completely agree, but why does the packetloss BQM show it but pings show none? Thats something I have noticed whenever the speedloss has occurred. Which seems to have been much better since Simon's announcement last week oddly enough.
Quote from: Gary on Feb 09, 2014, 08:19:36
I completely agree, but why does the packetloss BQM show it but pings show none?
Good question :dunno:
The obvious difference is that the pings from tbb and the user are going in opposite directions, but whether that's relevant I have no idea.
QuoteWhich seems to have been much better since Simon's announcement last week oddly enough.
Not sure about that- it had good and bad periods before.
Quote from: Bill on Feb 09, 2014, 08:27:28
Good question :dunno:
A purely speculative thought... lost packets quite possibly aren't really "lost", all it means is that after (I think) 500mSec tbb's pingbox got fed up waiting for a reply. If something
en route to the target IP were set to drop a ping "in transit" after, say, 250mSec...?
I don't know if ping packets in transit are also low priority to a (non-targeted) router?
Quote from: Bill on Feb 09, 2014, 08:37:54
I don't know if ping packets in transit are also low priority to a (non-targeted) router?
I'm not sure on that, some ping to IDNet were in the region on 130ms when the slowdowns were occurring, at that point I was down to 20MBps from 67Mbps. I was informed pings to IDNet were low priority and when the server was busy will show ping's in the region of 130ms upwards, a few seconds later though they could be down to 8ms depending on your line and the load at the time.
I have not really had that much trouble since Simon's message. A loss of maybe 2Mbps here and there but nothing like I was having, also pages that were taking an age to load, like TBB now open instantly. The Apple home page had been loading like a 56k modem at times, its nigh on instant now. I guess next week and beyond will be a good test of what's being done to sort the issues, and how effective they are.
I have noticed the "rug of yellow" on my BQM the same as Zappa has. This has only being the last few days and so I guess is due to the Winter Olympics?
So presumably that's three different exchanges with the same yellow rug.
My exchange is Erdington Birmingham, when I saw the rug I thought one of my kids had done some major downloading, when I checked they had being out of the house and the idnet portal confirmed my daily download was normal.
Quote from: lozcart on Feb 09, 2014, 09:52:55
I have noticed the "rug of yellow" on my BQM the same as Zappa has. This has only being the last few days and so I guess is due to the Winter Olympics?
I guess no one like sports, or they are all dead or don't use computers on my exchange... :-\
Ping packet do not have priority IIRC, but I don't know if it applies in this instance (as it's between Thinkbroadband, so their stuff should not be setup to drop them). But it is probably best to check the packet loss is actually happening in use, not just from traces. Say, with games (I could bring up packet info in most of my games to test), or with skype/clients etc (no idea how to get skype to report packet loss).
Well there's 3.4Mb/s of unwanted traffic being aimed at my IP address at the moment. I don't know at what point that stops when my line is disconnected but sometime next week I'll be gone so maybe that will lighten the load. I wonder if it's an isolated issue - if not perhaps IDNet should implement some level of traffic monitoring to stop this stuff at the border.
Seems like a lot of people are leaving IDNet at the moment...
Quote from: Gary on Feb 09, 2014, 12:04:05
Seems like a lot of people are leaving IDNet at the moment...
Yep, I'll be getting my mac code next week.
It's a shame to leave after 7 yrs but it has to be done.
Quote from: psp83 on Feb 09, 2014, 12:32:02
Yep, I'll be getting my mac code next week.
It's a shame to leave after 7 yrs but it has to be done.
I could not leave until my contract is up, as I only had FTTC activated in September. Paying up the remainder would be a bad move financially and one that I think would be premature. I'm sure IDNet will get a grip of the situation, but peoples patience is wearing thin and that's not great for any company. :( Saying that my connection has been flying along these last few days so at the moment I'm happy, time will tell in the long run though. :fingers:
Quote from: psp83
It's a shame to leave after 7 yrs but it has to be done.
I moved to A&A couple of weeks ago and while I am not on fibre I am seeing none of this packet loss nonsense, which I did see on IDNet. Adrian Kennard has posted a very good explanation of packet loss and its consequences at http://revk.www.me.uk (http://revk.www.me.uk). Also a few days ago he wrote that BT do not seem to consider 3% packet loss a fault despite its dramatic impact on fibre connections.
Quote from: Adrian on Feb 09, 2014, 12:59:33
I moved to A&A couple of weeks ago and while I am not on fibre I am seeing none of this packet loss nonsense, which I did see on IDNet. Adrian Kennard has posted a very good explanation of packet loss and its consequences at http://revk.www.me.uk (http://revk.www.me.uk). Also a few days ago he wrote that BT do not seem to consider 3% packet loss a fault despite its dramatic impact on fibre connections.
As mentioned earlier though that's a different kind of case and one customer, Although the 3% is an eye opener. The issue at IDNet is odd, I'm not even sure its really packetloss in fact I have no idea tbh anymore, as I said mines fine at the moment, but tomorrow will be interesting as it was always fine over weekends. A&A are way to expensive on FTTC for me but they are a very good ISP, but once again not worth for fibre, which is like an immovable rock, all ISP's pretty much offer the same service on FTTC, its down to do you like outsourced calls or not basically, they cannot reset a profile by calling openreach like with ADSL, they are pretty much hands off as BTOR designed it to be. Interesting article though. :)
Quote from: Gary on Feb 09, 2014, 12:57:33
I could not leave until my contract is up, as I only had FTTC activated in September. Paying up the remainder would be a bad move financially and one that I think would be premature. I'm sure IDNet will get a grip of the situation, but peoples patience is wearing thin and that's not great for any company. :( Saying that my connection has been flying along these last few days so at the moment I'm happy, time will tell in the long run though. :fingers:
Its just not these issues, its other things as well, like the quota for the price when other ISPs like IDnet are offering higher for the same amount per month.
I feel so sad that so many people are having problems with Idnet. It is and has been the best company for broadband supplies and I would still be with them if it was not for the cost if fibre and that was the only reason I left and went to BT Infinity. It's strange that so many people are having these problems as I would have expected it to be across the board regardless of who you are with after all in the end we are all with BT. :eyebrow:
Quote from: psp83 on Feb 09, 2014, 15:24:54
Its just not these issues, its other things as well, like the quota for the price when other ISPs like IDnet are offering higher for the same amount per month.
AAISP are I think more expensive, IDNet offer and I admit I could use alot more, what they can for the size of the ISP they are. On ADSL it was fine, its just on FTTC we can use so much more which is why the quota is to little. IDNet can't keep up with Zen, Plusnet or BT and I don't expect them too, because those are massive companies, even Zen is by scale much bigger than IDNet and have their own equipment in some exchanges, so they can afford much more bandwidth, bigger servers etc. IDNet are a niche provider and that's that. AAISP I think charge £40 for 100GB on FTTC but I could be wrong. I think many of us only discovered we wanted more when we got FTTC and saw words like unlimited when we saw our useage go up and realised that's what we need/want. In essence many but not all FTTC users usage pattern has outgrown iDNets demographic.
Quote from: Gary on Feb 09, 2014, 16:20:36
AAISP are I think more expensive, IDNet offer and I admit I could use alot more, what they can for the size of the ISP they are. On ADSL it was fine, its just on FTTC we can use so much more which is why the quota is to little. IDNet can't keep up with Zen, Plusnet or BT and I don't expect them too, because those are massive companies, even Zen is by scale much bigger than IDNet and have their own equipment in some exchanges, so they can afford much more bandwidth, bigger servers etc. IDNet are a niche provider and that's that. AAISP I think charge £40 for 100GB on FTTC but I could be wrong. I think many of us only discovered we wanted more when we got FTTC and saw words like unlimited when we saw our useage go up and realised that's what we need/want. In essence many but not all FTTC users usage pattern has outgrown iDNets demographic.
Exactly and that's why I'm moving to another ISP, not one like BT though, I still want to keep the IDnet like quality and get a bit more for what I pay so I don't have to watch my usage everyday, plus there is now 2 NowTV boxes in this house with a movie subscription and 100GB just won't be enough anymore.
If it wasn't for the packet loss issue causing problems with my day time work and the use of NowTV/streaming then I would stay with IDnet.
Yes, A&A charge £40 for 80/20 FTTC with 100GB cap which is about £5 more than IDNet, similarly for a 200GB cap, so not a vast difference though I can appreciate that for many people, every penny counts these days. I suppose for FTTC, ultimately both ISPs are offering identical packages constrained by the dead hand that is BT. So you could argue that A&A isn't worth even the extra fiver.
I won't have FTTC here until 2015, assuming it actually reaches me so I don't yet have to make any decisions, but as with all financial matters every alternative will be given due consideration, but I doubt I could ever go to a "stack 'em high" ISP.
After I moved to BT I ran into a problem and had to contact their help desk. They arranged a visit from Openreach and he found a problem at the exchange. He also felt that my Homehub 4 was nor performing the way it should so promptly changed it and all was well. The other week I contacted them and lifted my service on Infinity One to unlimited (after purchase of smart tv) and purchased a Homehub Five for £45. I plugged the Homehub 5 in and it worked without any intervention from me.
If the service and performance continues like this I will have nothing to moan about. I am now in the awkward position that I recommended Idnet to a large number of friends and customers and I am the one that left the ship. I repeat I would not have left Idnet only for the cost of Fibre being so high and truly never thought I would. I hope they manage to sort out their problems as I would come back to them like a shot if it was cost effective to do so.
Quote from: Adrian on Feb 09, 2014, 17:18:50
Yes, A&A charge £40 for 80/20 FTTC with 100GB cap which is about £5 more than IDNet.
A&A charge a further £1.20 for email and another £1.20 for web space, both of which are included in IDNet's price.
(http://www.speedtest.net/result/3294558275.png) (http://www.speedtest.net/my-result/3294558275)
>:(
To be clear I'm not leaving IDNet out of spite or anger. It's just that this is the second time I've come under attack. Initially it was my server but I'm wondering if the two are related (this time it's DNS queries). So I've just taken the opportunity to review how I use the internet and decided I really don't need a quality service. If I stop running a mail server all I need is a service capable of browsing so why pay more than I have to.
@ Zappa:
(http://www.speedtest.net/result/3294571425.png) (http://www.speedtest.net/my-result/3294571425)
:dunno:
(http://www.speedtest.net/result/3294581397.png) (http://www.speedtest.net/my-result/3294581397)
My speeds are fine but I have still got the "yellow rug" on BQM
I don't normally post my speed tests but I wondered if this would help to show my service figures.
http://www.thinkbroadband.com/speedtest/results.html?id=139197461711854597411
This test is typical of the results I have every time and wondered if other folks results are the same.
TBB speedtest is fine too:
(http://www.thinkbroadband.com/speedtest/button/139197503031803687581.png) (http://www.thinkbroadband.com/speedtest/results.html?id=139197503031803687581)
(Ignore the very slow single-thread download, it's a bug in the version of Flash that Safari uses)
I've also got the yellow rug (BQMs in sig), but it's a shorter pile than last night :P
All fine here too. (http://www.speedtest.net/result/3294595706.png)
No problems here, but on ADSL.
Quote from: colirv on Feb 09, 2014, 18:54:17
A&A charge a further £1.20 for email and another £1.20 for web space, both of which are included in IDNet's price.
You are of course correct. I forgot about these as I don't use either.
Just wonder whether we could keep this thread on track please with posts relating to the subject heading.
Well everything ran smooth as butter my end tonight. Maybe Zap could use the Zen status checked and put his postcode in to see if there are any issues, might be worth using plusnet tools to see if the exchange is showing red. Seems most of us faired well so far. Lets hope the rest of the week runs well too. I do sometimes wonder if the BQM is a red hearing, or people are just looking at it to much for every slight little glitch, its easy to focus on that after the problems of the last few months, maybe we should watch them less and think around the issue with other tools like pings and traceroutes when needed. Maybe something in the configuration of IDNet does not mesh well with the BQM, if flash can cause issues on OS X TBB speed tests I guess anything is possible.
I'm fed up of looking and thinking about all this now tbh, after the pain of the last few weeks in our household I started looking at this as just a first world problem. Many things happen to women and children and adults in this world that are unspeakably evil and sad, and all we have to worry about is our broadband speeds. I think they would give anything to swap their lives for something so trivial when starvation or water shortages are killing their families, or their children are stolen and sold into the sex trade. WE really are very lucky to have what we have. sorry for wandering off post, all this just seems so very very small and inconsequential right now...
Packet-losswise, today has been fine for me. Today's TBBM. (http://www.thinkbroadband.com/ping/share/b25f82283980b2501be12fa9f9242677-09-02-2014.html)
I've checked my exchange status a couple of times recently and it's still listing as green. I've also checked a number of sites to see if there are any engineering works that might affect me but there appears to be nothing going on that would explain things. I'll see what support have to say about it this week, I think I've got enough data to show there's clearly a problem. You can see from the attached speed test results graph how volatile my throughput is.
Quote from: zappaDPJ on Feb 10, 2014, 00:41:38
You can see from the attached speed test results graph how volatile my throughput is.
What's the scale of the x axis?
Quote from: colirv on Feb 10, 2014, 01:04:37
What's the scale of the x axis?
The x axis represents every speed test I've conducted since the beginning of the year.
psp83/andrue, may one ask which ISP you will be joining?
Quote from: joe on Feb 10, 2014, 08:08:38
psp83/andrue, may one ask which ISP you will be joining?
I will PM you.
Kind of on topic. A recent Youtuber, who uses the internet as their income, has moved to another country because UK internet is that rubbish. They cannot get the upload speed they need. That might be a bit drastic a kind of solution though. :P
Quote from: Technical Ben on Feb 10, 2014, 09:15:03
Kind of on topic. A recent Youtuber, who uses the internet as their income, has moved to another country because UK internet is that rubbish. They cannot get the upload speed they need. That might be a bit drastic a kind of solution though. :P
You think? ;)
For vanilla residential broadband (unless you are driven to alternative non-DSL technologies) your ISP is a matter of taste, and price. Anything else is mostly window-dressing. But emotions run high. The marketeers win!
And, as in the rest of life, there is no golden rule than small is beautiful.
Quote from: mervl on Feb 10, 2014, 10:12:39
For vanilla residential broadband (unless you are driven to alternative non-DSL technologies) your ISP is a matter of taste, and price. Anything else is mostly window-dressing. But emotions run high. The marketeers win!
So this helps how exactly?
Quote from: Gary on Feb 10, 2014, 10:15:08
So this helps how exactly?
As much as you like, or not.
Right everyone... this thread needs to stay absolutely on topic. If your post is not specifically in relation to the ongoing issue of packet loss and associated throughput difficulties please post in a separate thread (in help or natter as appropriate). This includes posts talking around the issue but not specifically about the issue itself.
We need to to stay on topic to give IDNet and other readers clarity on the issue.
OK, back to topic, speeds down from 75 over weekend to this:
(http://www.speedtest.net/result/3296084179.png) (http://www.speedtest.net/my-result/3296084179)
........ and so it continues!!!!!!!!!
(http://www.thinkbroadband.com/ping/share-thumb/88e766e626464b1ad62dda7e4a63e7f2-10-02-2014.png) (http://www.thinkbroadband.com/ping/share/88e766e626464b1ad62dda7e4a63e7f2-10-02-2014.html)
(http://www.speedtest.net/result/3296106680.png) (http://www.speedtest.net/my-result/3296106680)
::)
Speeds down to 20Mbs from 67Mbps ish over the weekend...
................. and the 1st one to get NIL download receives a prize!! A free MAC perhaps!! :slap: :slap:
And...its back to normal (http://www.speedtest.net/result/3296157008.png)
My speed is consistently fine during the day, a bit slower in the evening, and seemingly unaffected by the packet loss, which continues (http://www.thinkbroadband.com/ping/share/5eca052bf6bc9cee6e7d8baf8a2d2149-10-02-2014.html).
I just emailed support, I was informed that they are still balancing the network, hence maybe the sudden drop and rise back to normal speeds so quickly earlier on. This balancing will continue all week from what I can make out. I was wondering if maybe this thread has become a bit long and frustrating now? It would seem appropriate to just post speed tests over the week if we notice a drop or packetloss so IDNet can see how things are going from our side maybe... but keep it maybe more to just those posts only and see Thursday/Friday how things are going then? Its up to the mods but maybe a suggestion to maybe start a new thread linked from this for speedtests and pings and traceroutes as needed marked with a title relating to the ongoing issues but with a strict info only policy so this 15 page monster does not grow anymore. Just an idea. :)
I suggest anyone able to demonstrate low throughput via speedtest.net also conducts a BT Speedtest http://speedtest.btwholesale.com/ I'd also point out if it's not already crystal clear, the low throughput results being posted by customers always correlate exactly with some degree of packet loss which can be seen on the majority IDNet BQMs.
Time to dig out my usb dial up modem methinks.
(http://www.speedtest.net/result/3296453797.png) (http://www.speedtest.net/my-result/3296453797)
(http://www.thinkbroadband.com/ping/share-thumb/88e766e626464b1ad62dda7e4a63e7f2-10-02-2014.png) (http://www.thinkbroadband.com/ping/share/88e766e626464b1ad62dda7e4a63e7f2-10-02-2014.html)
(http://www.speedtest.net/result/3296490036.png) (http://www.speedtest.net/my-result/3296490036)
So whose turn was it to use the Internet today?
Never known it so low, usually 60+
(http://www.thinkbroadband.com/speedtest/button/139205066419780574832.png)
Download speed achieved during the test was - 29.87 Mbps
For your connection, the acceptable range of speed is 55.6 Mbps-69.5 Mbps .
Additional Information:
IP Profile for your line is - 69.5 Mbps
Upload speed achieved during the test was - 16.88Mbps
Additional Information:
Upstream Rate IP profile on your line is - 20 Mbps
(http://www.speedtest.net/result/3296521273.png)
Appalling speeds
This is about as slow as I get. Mid afternoon I was getting 60Mb/s. Perhaps the lines are quicker up north!
(http://www.speedtest.net/result/3296616863.png) (http://www.speedtest.net/my-result/3296616863)
Very poor speedtest result here also, seems the problem we were seeing last week is now aggravated by the Olympics.
Quote from: lozcart on Feb 10, 2014, 17:44:09
Very poor speedtest result here also, seems the problem we were seeing last week is now aggravated by the Olympics.
What are your speedtest results? If you could post them that would be really helpful. As to the Olympics we cant be sure what effect that's having if any so its best not to get side tracked really. :)
Managed to get my graph stuff sorted out...
(http://www.thinkbroadband.com/ping/share-thumb/db643738b9c8cc931e06e2c86afeb115-10-02-2014.png) (http://www.thinkbroadband.com/ping/share/db643738b9c8cc931e06e2c86afeb115-10-02-2014.html)
...ahhh.
edit: Ignore that first red bar, forgot to set my router up to allow pings. :)
Well this is even more interesting the packet lose today is identical on the everyones recently posted, esp around 2pm and 4pm! (btw this isn't a fibre connection):
(http://www.thinkbroadband.com/ping/share-thumb/d0e8606957debde59cc3ef179c249f45-10-02-2014.png) (http://www.thinkbroadband.com/ping/share/d0e8606957debde59cc3ef179c249f45-10-02-2014.html)
EDIT: I've also just noticed my latency has dropped a lot, from above 20 to well below it: older TBQM below
(http://www.thinkbroadband.com/ping/share-thumb/03304176210d3194e699b5f8992b07fe-08-02-2014.png) (http://www.thinkbroadband.com/ping/share/03304176210d3194e699b5f8992b07fe-08-02-2014.html)
Any clues why the latency has dropped?
It's getting worse!
(http://www.thinkbroadband.com/ping/share-thumb/f06a9be34555a278ee7603196db71d80-10-02-2014.png)
Perhaps I shouldn't have binned my move to BT last month. I trusted that the additional bandwidth promised would cure this.
this is the first time ive had a noticeable loss and its no where near what others have had.My latency also dropped a few days ago but thats good isnt it? :dunno: was for me as speed went up.
Im on LLU if that makes any difference
here are my tests today.
http://www.speedtest.net/result/3298196190.png
and then the BT tester
Download speedachieved during the test was - 23.07 Mbps
For your connection, the acceptable range of speedsis 23.14 Mbps-28.93 Mbps .
Additional Information:
IP Profile for your line is - 28.93 Mbps
Upload speed achieved during the test was - 6.47Mbps
Additional Information:
Upstream Rate IP profile on your line is - 20 Mbps
And now 10:15am its back to normal. also I was logged in another customers, I was downloading a printer driver first time I was getting about 300k cancelled it and tried again 5 min later and we were up to 4mb sec
The popularity of the Winter Olympics has been surprising. Especially, how many employers seem willing to allow their staff to watch it during the daytime. We already have a program in place to mitigate the effects and we are working hard at this. Please be assured that we do not regard the recent speed fluctuations as 'normal' and we fully expect to return to normal operations as soon as possible.
Yesterday. Ignore the spike at 17:45-ish; that was a powercut caused by one solitary and whopping lightning strike about 9 miles away (it scared the bejaysus out of me!)
(http://www.thinkbroadband.com/ping/share-thumb/e05abb715eb12ccc0f7aa89dc9e72082-10-02-2014.png)
On the far-right, today (again, the spike was down to a power blip. No idea what's going on with the local power supply, but there's packet loss from 10am today)
(http://www.thinkbroadband.com/ping/share-thumb/8d1ebb49e445041277279e81c8d953f4-11-02-2014.png)
I can't remember, but did we suffer this sort of issue during the London Olympics? I'd have thought that placed a far greater burden on internet connections than the current Winter Olympics.
mine was the same loss again today.
the olympics only started this week didnt they? not early december :dunno:
If it helps for comparisons, here is my ASDL2 graph. I've never really noticed any packet loss myself. So strange the monitor is showing some. I've no PCs connected between 2 and 7pm, so it's not down to any usage my end. :/
http://www.thinkbroadband.com/ping/share/e3d760d11092202197453a155ca14380-11-02-2014.html
(http://www.thinkbroadband.com/ping/share-thumb/e3d760d11092202197453a155ca14380-11-02-2014.png) (http://www.thinkbroadband.com/ping/share/e3d760d11092202197453a155ca14380-11-02-2014.html)
That big spike at 4ish looks similar to the one that appears on the FTTC graphs. Or am I just reading too much into it?
PS, The Voice started in December? I can say o LOT more people I know are streaming now (PC or Skybox).
same again today, still wondering why my latency randomly dropped by half the other day!
(http://www.thinkbroadband.com/ping/share-thumb/198f9eb0c740472a5dd3b522c626daeb-11-02-2014.png) (http://www.thinkbroadband.com/ping/share/198f9eb0c740472a5dd3b522c626daeb-11-02-2014.html)
Quote from: Technical Ben on Feb 11, 2014, 20:00:21
If it helps for comparisons, here is my ASDL2 graph. I've never really noticed any packet loss myself. So strange the monitor is showing some. I've no PCs connected between 2 and 7pm, so it's not down to any usage my end. :/
http://www.thinkbroadband.com/ping/share/e3d760d11092202197453a155ca14380-11-02-2014.html
(http://www.thinkbroadband.com/ping/share-thumb/e3d760d11092202197453a155ca14380-11-02-2014.png) (http://www.thinkbroadband.com/ping/share/e3d760d11092202197453a155ca14380-11-02-2014.html)
That big spike at 4ish looks similar to the one that appears on the FTTC graphs. Or am I just reading too much into it?
PS, The Voice started in December? I can say o LOT more people I know are streaming now (PC or Skybox).
This is getting to be a bore. Is this all really caused by people streaming the Olympics, doesn't anyone watch a TV now.
(http://www.thinkbroadband.com/ping/share-thumb/311dcb6343f236edd2085de5f84891c3-11-02-2014.png)
This afternoon :-
(http://www.thinkbroadband.com/speedtest/button/139213721234390883513.png)
This evening:-
(http://www.thinkbroadband.com/speedtest/button/139215197227834610508.png)
Still having some issues here. Noticed playing youtube videos and the like is a bit jumpy - thought it might be video quality but they play fine when downloaded. :)
Speed test a bit off again tonight - why is it TBB that's mostly affected? Didn't think IDNet had any form of packet shaping or traffic prioritisation, so why would the two tests be different speeds? ???
(http://www.thinkbroadband.com/speedtest/button/139215281797343085707.png) (http://www.thinkbroadband.com/speedtest/results.html?id=139215281797343085707)
(http://www.thinkbroadband.com/ping/share-thumb/3cf88dbf0011d4d9b2d1189db9b349bb-11-02-2014.png) (http://www.thinkbroadband.com/ping/share/3cf88dbf0011d4d9b2d1189db9b349bb-11-02-2014.html)
Packet loss on a mostly otherwise quiet line?
JFTR and the rubbish continues. I never realised how hooked the british public were on the winter olympics :whistle: :whistle: Still, another pretty good excuse I suppose!!
Have rang around a few friends on other ISP's and they are NOT experiencing speed drops. Therefore, I must presume IDNet must be utilising the same routing as Russia!
Ah, forget it, 4 months and I'm out of this outfit........ :conf:
(http://www.speedtest.net/result/3299747006.png) (http://www.speedtest.net/my-result/3299747006)
(http://www.thinkbroadband.com/ping/share-thumb/6d3b20d09e32e2641b4acc96bbe934f4-11-02-2014.png) (http://www.thinkbroadband.com/ping/share/6d3b20d09e32e2641b4acc96bbe934f4-11-02-2014.html)
Yesterdays results:-
(http://www.thinkbroadband.com/ping/share-thumb/311dcb6343f236edd2085de5f84891c3-11-02-2014.png)
(http://www.thinkbroadband.com/speedtest/button/139213721234390883513.png)
BT test (attached): d'ld 9.78 Mbps, acceptable 40 - 67.73 Mbps!
Simon, neither your extra bandwidth nor your software appear to be addressing the problem. Unless there is a quick answer and resolution, I like so many other 'rats' will be forced to go elsewhere.
In addition to the other measures mentioined earlier we have now placed yet another order with BT for even more bandwidth, just in case our exisiting plans are not sufficient. The extra bandwidth will come online next Tuesday.
Quote from: Simon_idnet on Feb 12, 2014, 09:03:46another order with BT for even more bandwidth, just in case our exisiting plans are not sufficient.
I'm glad to hear that, but I can't say that I'm reassured by it.
Surely you can monitor how much bandwidth is being used and compare that with how much you've got available?
I'm prepared to be educated on the matter, but I can't immediately see why there should be any "just in case" involved?
Quote from: Simon_idnet on Feb 12, 2014, 09:03:46
In addition to the other measures mentioined earlier we have now placed yet another order with BT for even more bandwidth, just in case our exisiting plans are not sufficient. The extra bandwidth will come online next Tuesday.
Sadly I have reached a point where I dont expect this to make the situation better in either the short or long term. I complained to support on Monday and was told it would be sorted by the end of the week. Now its Tuesday... The goal posts keep being moved. You must be aware as Bill has mentioned of how much bandwidth you have and need. Support said you had "plenty of head room" a week or so ago. Why so many conflicting reports? It seems no matter how much bandwidth you order it either gets used up, or its not the actual problem. I don't pretend to know how your network runs, but I do know I have simply had enough now.
Just to muddy the waters, I have TBB monitors on three IDNET lines - but none are on the same exchange. Two show the identical packet loss, the other shows packet loss, but not at the same time.
Bedfordshire exchange (ADSL)
(http://www.thinkbroadband.com/ping/share-thumb/ae6579b5f3d0c8799073636374ecbca2-12-02-2014.png) (http://www.thinkbroadband.com/ping/share/ae6579b5f3d0c8799073636374ecbca2-12-02-2014.html)
Shropshire exchange (ADSL2+)
(http://www.thinkbroadband.com/ping/share-thumb/f8602e111fc5f80c7c837f86774e5736-12-02-2014.png) (http://www.thinkbroadband.com/ping/share/f8602e111fc5f80c7c837f86774e5736-12-02-2014.html)
Shropshire exchange without the same packet loss (ignore the disconnect this is a very long and unstable line) - ADSL2+:
(http://www.thinkbroadband.com/ping/share-thumb/3144bc6e71b692680cc4aebedd8a91a7-12-02-2014.png) (http://www.thinkbroadband.com/ping/share/3144bc6e71b692680cc4aebedd8a91a7-12-02-2014.html)
But, even more telling is that the line in Bedfordshire is going into an office where they have a second line fed by BT. The TBB graph for this line shows no packet loss at all:
(http://www.thinkbroadband.com/ping/share-thumb/516d4d8a7a6d5ad5da4b6ab859d4d829-12-02-2014.png) (http://www.thinkbroadband.com/ping/share/516d4d8a7a6d5ad5da4b6ab859d4d829-12-02-2014.html)
Download speed achieved during the test was - 41.35 Mbps
For your connection, the acceptable range of speed is 55.6 Mbps-69.5 Mbps .
Additional Information:
IP Profile for your line is - 69.5 Mbps
Upload speed achieved during the test was - 16.55Mbps
Additional Information:
Upstream Rate IP profile on your line is - 20 Mbps
So thats 21Mbps lost again.
I'm not certain that you can predict accurately what extra bandwidth you need, you can tell when the links are saturated but how do you estimate what extra data additional requests are generating.
A definite spike at 4-5pm yesterday then, as I have it too and am on ASDL. At least from here, it correlates with the Olympics. I guess if a business is watching it, and not multicasting, that's a lot of office PCs saturating a line. :(
This is not good, as if I do consider going over to Fibre, it would be for upstream streaming only, as the download is of no concern to me. So dropped packets would be a real problem.
The Bedfordshire graph above shows very tiny packet loss at similar times. So BTs network is balancing much better. But then again, If the congestion is only on the supply side, BT tend to have no worries getting the supply of use of their own gear. :P
Quote from: Bill on Feb 12, 2014, 09:16:45
I'm prepared to be educated on the matter, but I can't immediately see why there should be any "just in case" involved?
In case Mo Farrah starts winning medals in Sochi!
We fully expect that the work that we've doing to balance the traffic across our network to start having a significant impact by the end of the week. But we were surprised that the Olympics are so popular so we decided that we better take extra measures on top of everything else.
Hopefully that will do the trick, once and for all! :)
Quote from: Simon_idnet on Feb 12, 2014, 14:25:26
In case Mo Farrah starts winning medals in Sochi!
OK, point taken :D :thumb:
Can't even watch a 720p video on YouTube at the moment :(
Mine was down to about 30% (~20Mbps) this morning but it's OK now, even with the usual packet loss showing:
(http://www.speedtest.net/result/3301326559.png) (http://www.speedtest.net/my-result/3301326559)
:dunno:
right now, mine seems ok too. Still showing the packet loss on the BQM. BT speedtest only shows 54mb download though. both tests completed whilst i also have my work laptop going (constant connection to network).
(http://www.speedtest.net/result/3301378409.png) (http://www.speedtest.net/my-result/3301378409)
Well I currently can't watch anything on iPlayer due to 'insufficient bandwidth' and I can't work because I can't reliably stay connected to my servers. Even the BT speedtest site implies that I have a possible fault.
Download speed achieved during the test was - 20.61 Mbps
For your connection, the acceptable range of speed is 55.6 Mbps-69.5 Mbps .
Additional Information:
IP Profile for your line is - 69.5 Mbps
Upload speed achieved during the test was - 15.79Mbps
Additional Information:
Upstream Rate IP profile on your line is - 20 Mbps
This is just getting worse as I see it. I don't see how the winter Olympics are having such a huge effect when the summer Olympics from memory had less of an impact. But Maybe anything is possible. :dunno:
Websites so slow to load that I could make a cup of tea between pages :-\
(http://www.thinkbroadband.com/ping/share-thumb/0f67267cda087b5f88a726b443f829a1-12-02-2014.png)
(http://www.speedtest.net/result/3301580869.png)
Bloody hell, even this preview just took about 25 seconds to show up :bawl:
Me, trying to stream a Bowie playlist right now:
*piano plonk* [30sec silence] "It's a godawful small affair, to [30 sec silence] the girl with the mousy [30sec silence] hair...".
I give up :'(
not good :( I am getting complaints from my customers now.
(http://www.speedtest.net/result/3301625142.png) (http://www.speedtest.net/my-result/3301625142)
I'm sync'ed at 71Mb, getting between 10 and 20 - which is unusual.
Speeds seem to have recovered which fits the usual cycle pretty much, pages still seem slow to load though oddly enough.
(http://www.speedtest.net/result/3301754304.png)
I think the initial problem has never really gone away and has being aggravated by the Olympics. It really seems to bite between 1600-1700hrs when maybe a business carries out some large data uploads, Simon seemed to mention this was one of the likely causes a few weeks ago.
When I got back home at 1730hrs my speeds were fine but looking at the BQM had I tested an hour earlier this would not have been the case.
http://www.speedtest.net/my-result/i/765222160
the olympics are on all day aren't they :dunno: and extra bandwidth sorted by next tuesday...if BT get it right this time...if not the olympics finish on saturday ..........so we'll all be fine by then ::)
then its the world cup in June and July....now that WILL draw a big audience
Not from this household, it won't.
But, as was said before, let's stick to the matter in hand.
Quote from: Baz on Feb 12, 2014, 19:18:56
the olympics are on all day aren't they :dunno: and extra bandwidth sorted by next tuesday...if BT get it right this time...if not the olympics finish on saturday ..........so we'll all be fine by then ::)
the thing is it dedicated bandwidth or rented. Are IDNet having new pipes put in or if it's basically rented air time is it shared? To many questions and since we don't know the answers it hard to know if more bandwidth will help long term. We can but hope. :fingers:
yesterday's TTBM:-
(http://www.thinkbroadband.com/ping/share-thumb/5f49fcc68cdc30a6a6a7257966c9f4b1-12-02-2014.png)
yesterday early morning 07:57:-
(http://www.thinkbroadband.com/speedtest/button/139219175307192295588.png)
and later morning 11.40:-
(http://www.thinkbroadband.com/speedtest/button/139220512822890150755.png)
and afternoon 16:56:-
(http://www.thinkbroadband.com/speedtest/button/139222415312019929848.png)
Surely as others have said this cannot be the Winter Olympics in which there is IMHO only minor peripheral interest - nothing like the Summer Olympics during which we didn't have these problems. I have never experienced this level of reduction in service before.
None of Simons 'alleged' fixes have so far worked or made any discernible difference, in fact it has steadily got worse and I hold out little hope for the end of this week (why does load balancing take so long?). Must we conclude that he is happy for us small players to leave?
Quote from: joe on Feb 13, 2014, 08:27:23Must we conclude that he is happy for us small players to leave?
You could take the conspiracy theorist approach and say that it's a cunning plan to drive away the small users so that IDNet can withdraw from a (possibly) unprofitable domestic market and concentrate on the corporate world.
It's possible... but I wouldn't put money on it :P
Live BQMs in sig if anyone wishes to keep an eye on mine, speed is fine atm:
(http://www.speedtest.net/result/3303154593.png) (http://www.speedtest.net/my-result/3303154593)
I'm noticing that connection to US sites (specifically Stanford university) is highly variable, unpredictably swinging from pretty much as above down to not far off dial-up, but it seems more likely that that's nothing to do with IDNet.
All fine here for now. Some sites in the US are slow I think as Bill said that's not IDNet's issue. Considering the weather I'm amazed that how well the infrastructure is holding up.
(http://www.speedtest.net/result/3303197349.png)
Quote from: Gary on Feb 13, 2014, 09:09:47Considering the weather I'm amazed that how well the infrastructure is holding up.
Good point... I tend to forget that
their weather may play a part in it too :red:
It seems to be a lot better today much less packet loss and no 1600hrs drop off, speedtest still a bit erratic starts at 70mb/s then hangs giving the result below.
(http://www.speedtest.net/result/3304140524.png) (http://www.speedtest.net/my-result/3304140524)
Quote from: lozcart on Feb 13, 2014, 17:14:48
It seems to be a lot better today much less packet loss and no 1600hrs drop off, speedtest still a bit erratic starts at 70mb/s then hangs giving the result below.
(http://www.speedtest.net/result/3304140524.png) (http://www.speedtest.net/my-result/3304140524)
That aspect of the problem, the momentary loss of throughput is actually far more problematical than stable but low throughput. It causes streaming services to buffer, sensitive connections to drop and lag spikes when connected to gaming servers. My connection on a good day maximises at about 73Mb/s. Right now I'd happily trade that for smooth, uninterrupted 3Mb/s.
I hear what you are saying Zappa, but the drop in packet loss must be a move in the right direction, maybe a bit more tweaking required.
Well I'm still getting the cr*p speeds, upload is a bit slower tonight as well.
(http://www.speedtest.net/result/3304205148.png) (http://www.speedtest.net/my-result/3304205148)
Oh well, I'll be with a different ISP on Tuesday.
Its been a bit erratic here, upload speeds went down for a while, a loss of about 10Mbps but pages still were having issues loading late this afternoon. I just turned the TV on. I'll wait till Tuesday to see what happens before I make any further moves as that's fair, well more than fair after months of issues, but I'm still not holding my breath...but today was a move in the right direction.
Quote from: Simon_idnet on Feb 12, 2014, 14:25:26
In case Mo Farrah starts winning medals in Sochi!
We fully expect that the work that we've doing to balance the traffic across our network to start having a significant impact by the end of the week. But we were surprised that the Olympics are so popular so we decided that we better take extra measures on top of everything else.
Doesn't seem to be working:-
(http://www.thinkbroadband.com/speedtest/button/139239425309836467934.png)
Im on about 60Mbps down from 67Mbps, which is better, still not as it should be though. :shake:
Download speed achieved during the test was - 46.47 Mbps
For your connection, the acceptable range of speed is 55.6 Mbps-69.5 Mbps .
Additional Information:
IP Profile for your line is - 69.5 Mbps
Things have not improved then, but were fine over the weekend oddly enough. I really hope tomorrow makes everything as it should be. :sigh:
I'm not happy in that I have to agree with you completely Gary. W/E no problem, perfect througout - today back to usual - afternoon bad.
(http://www.thinkbroadband.com/speedtest/button/139265656687937718213-mini.png).
Can anyone confirm that this problem is an iDNet problem only - would a different ISP necessarily be better?
Quote from: joe on Feb 17, 2014, 20:01:36
I'm not happy in that I have to agree with you completely Gary. W/E no problem, perfect througout - today back to usual - afternoon bad.
(http://www.thinkbroadband.com/speedtest/button/139265656687937718213-mini.png).
Can anyone confirm that this problem is an iDNet problem only - would a different ISP necessarily be better?
I'm not on IDnet antmore and I've had no issues today, no packet loss or slow downs.
I think we were told that the additional bandwidth won't be 'live' until Tuesday.
Quote from: Simon on Feb 17, 2014, 20:58:09
I think we were told that the additional bandwidth won't be 'live' until Tuesday.
There were no slowdowns over the weekend Simon, and we have been here before. I don't know if IDnet is getting dedicated bandwidth put in or just extra airtime. I feel that its going to be maybe fine for a few days then back to the same routine. I hope to be proved wrong, but we have been here so many times before and the pattern just repeats itself. I don't have any faith at this time that this will sort the issue. The next few days are make or break for me I'm afraid.
'Tis not good :(
(http://www.thinkbroadband.com/speedtest/button/139267415419695697304.png) (http://www.thinkbroadband.com/speedtest/results.html?id=139267415419695697304)
I have a second connection that uses BTW backhaul, like IDNet, but does not suffer any regular packet loss or noticeable slowdowns at all. It also does not have any traffic management or restriction - like IdNet. It therefore gets the odd occasional bit of packet loss when the network is under heavy use, perhaps once or twice a month for the odd hour or so. IDNet don't traffic manage or restrict (other than the aggregate data packages), whereas others do manage in various ways (and may have default filtering too), but most of their customers don't notice. So you take your pick: principles vs practicalities. As with everything in life. If it was easy to sort I'm sure they would have done so; I don't know of any alternative they have but to keep plugging away. I just work around the "problem"; at least it's predictable. It hasn't killed me yet!
Quote from: mervl on Feb 17, 2014, 22:04:39
I have a second connection that uses BTW backhaul, like IDNet, but does not suffer any regular packet loss or noticeable slowdowns at all. It also does not have any traffic management or restriction - like IdNet. It therefore gets the odd occasional bit of packet loss when the network is under heavy use, perhaps once or twice a month for the odd hour or so. IDNet don't traffic manage or restrict (other than the aggregate data packages), whereas others do manage in various ways (and may have default filtering too), but most of their customers don't notice. So you take your pick: principles vs practicalities. As with everything in life. If it was easy to sort I'm sure they would have done so; I don't know of any alternative they have but to keep plugging away. I just work around the "problem"; at least it's predictable. It hasn't killed me yet!
Neither Zen nor AAISP traffic manage in any way, one is larger one is smaller but both work.
Just a FYI..
If anyone wants to compare packet loss with a person that used to be on IDnet but is now on a different ISP, then I've updated my think broadband monitor in my sig at the bottom of all my posts.
Do the yellow spikes correspond with high traffic on that specific line?
*Users of Firefox and Safari in OS X may see slow speeds on the 'TBB' download figures. This is due to an issue with Flash in these browsers* I refuse to download Chrome for a speedtest though. So far so good this morning. It will be interesting to see how things are later in the day.
(http://www.thinkbroadband.com/speedtest/button/139271902254202568363-mini.png)
Quote from: Bill on Feb 18, 2014, 10:21:56
Do the yellow spikes correspond with high traffic on that specific line?
Yes Bill. YouTube videos and large downloads..
The little yellow block before midnight was me streaming on NowTV.
OK, ta.
Simon (IDNet) spotted my horrible speedtest from last night and gave me a call... various things discussed, but it seems pretty certain that the increased latency I see during late afternoon/evening is down to my exchange, as I've suspected for a while.
It also looks possible that my cabinet is full and they're adding another (barriers and a big hole), but yet to confirm. If it's a 288-line job it doesn't bode too well for the future :bawl:
Paul.....have you got an old graph from before you switched.Also if yellow spikes are bad i'm in trouble i have lots on my graph even when its not used a lot :(
Quote from: Baz on Feb 18, 2014, 11:10:32
Paul.....have you got an old graph from before you switched.Also if yellow spikes are bad i'm in trouble i have lots on my graph even when its not used a lot :(
Afraid not, my IDnet one has been removed, it was basically the same as now, Just had a slightly higher ping (mine changes all the time) and the packet loss like everyone else.
Quote from: Bill on Feb 18, 2014, 10:58:10
OK, ta.
Simon (IDNet) spotted my horrible speedtest from last night and gave me a call... various things discussed, but it seems pretty certain that the increased latency I see during late afternoon/evening is down to my exchange, as I've suspected for a while.
It also looks possible that my cabinet is full and they're adding another (barriers and a big hole), but yet to confirm. If it's a 288-line job it doesn't bode too well for the future :bawl:
Uh oh, major slow downs for you then :( you would think BT would increase the bandwidth at the exchange first before installing new cabs.
Quote from: Gary on Feb 18, 2014, 05:25:50
Neither Zen nor AAISP traffic manage in any way, one is larger one is smaller but both work.
Agreed, but I used "manage" in its widest sense, not just conventional "traffic" management. I think AAISP have a quite complex data use/cap structure which is designed to avoid capacity problems, and Zen have invested hugely in capacity and I think even brought their own PoPs close to the exchanges to reduce backhaul constraints (perhaps rather like a smaller version of what Sky have been doing)?
Quote from: mervl on Feb 18, 2014, 11:29:08
Agreed, but I used "manage" in its widest sense, not just conventional "traffic" management. I think AAISP have a quite complex data use/cap structure which is designed to avoid capacity problems, and Zen have invested hugely in capacity and I think even brought their own PoPs close to the exchanges to reduce backhaul constraints (perhaps rather like a smaller version of what Sky have been doing)?
AAISP have a straight 100GB service like IDNet which has no peak off peak mumbo jumbo, although its £45 a month for 80/20 :eyebrow: Maybe they keep capacity down by scaring off new users ;)
Quote from: Baz on Feb 18, 2014, 11:10:32
Paul.....have you got an old graph from before you switched.Also if yellow spikes are bad i'm in trouble i have lots on my graph even when its not used a lot :(
You can't really compare adsl with FTTC as even low to moderate usage on adsl can give broad yellow spikes on the TBBQM, whereas on FTTC it indicates heavy usage.
Quote from: psp83 on Feb 18, 2014, 11:23:43you would think BT would increase the bandwidth at the exchange first before installing new cabs.
No I wouldn't ;)
(http://www.speedtest.net/result/3314762448.png) and its happening again :shake:
Well my speed is back again, but it went down to 20Mbps and coincided with a nice big splodge of red on all IDNets TBBQM on craigs :(
Been having fun for the past 15 or so minutes, since my connection is off and on and off again more than a tart's knickers! ;D
(http://www.thinkbroadband.com/ping/share-thumb/631447f6b1c510c00c70ee4baefeb76a-18-02-2014.png)
I have been having trouble reaching some pages, but I'm not sure what the cause of that is :-\
I'm having the same problem. IDNet are not aware of any issues within their domain.
[EDIT] However, as far as I can tell, this has effected everyone on an IDNet connection.
I saw the same thing - but it seems to have settled down again. For now.
I'm only giving this a few more days then I'm gone if it hasn't improved. A lot of promises have been made.
Maybe it was BT screwing up the addition of the extra bandwidth :fingers:
Too early to be sure if the red bits have gone, but I can't see them yet. I'll keep an eye on my BQMs for a while.
I take it the new bandwidth went in today? That red splodge could have been an issue elsewhere to be fair and if So IDNet recovered quickly. All I know was I could not load any pages for a while and then just very slowly.
I saw the same thing. We have a backup connection and it kept swapping between the two. Fingers crossed...
Quote from: Gary on Feb 18, 2014, 15:47:19
I take it the new bandwidth went in today?
It's due in today, but BT aren't noted for saying when :(
Was also down for about 20 minutes or so there, and also have had the weekday afternoon packet loss for months. Must say I find the timing of it a bit strange; the weekday part certainly implies that it's related to some sort of business use, and we know IDNet are quite business-user heavy these days, but why only the afternoons? Surely we should see packet loss at 9am in the morning when everyone turns up for work and before anything else, checks their e-mail?
Quote from: Bill on Feb 18, 2014, 15:46:57
Too early to be sure if the red bits have gone, but I can't see them yet. I'll keep an eye on my BQMs for a while.
Looking on Craigs, Bill there was a huge drop 3:30PM ish. Its on IDNets dedicated server. Seems one other person got it that badly and another but to a lesser extent. An outside event by the looks of it?
Quote from: Bill on Feb 18, 2014, 15:50:08
It's due in today, but BT aren't noted for saying when :(
Very True. :(
We just witnessed a large DDoS attack on one of our DSL customers which attracted several GBs of traffic. We are in the process of trying to identify the target.
Had some odd effects here- lost everything a few times, but the router said it was still connected :dunno:
(Though it did drop once for a minute or two)
Running a 5-second ping to the Beeb for a while so I can see whether it's up or down :P
Quote from: Bill on Feb 18, 2014, 16:04:18
Had some odd effects here- lost everything a few times, but the router said it was still connected :dunno:
(Though it did drop once for a minute or two)
Running a 5-second ping to the Beeb for a while so I can see whether it's up or down :P
I lost the beeb at the time but it all seems ok again now, although netters keeps loading slowly now and then.
I'm down too, although my router says I'm connected. The default Gateway seems reachable but neither DNS servers are pingable.
Mine started as [Internet disconnected] Tuesday, Feb 18,2014 15:05:33 followed by lots of 'Dos Attack Fin scans' and I lost the net a few more times after that as well.
Quote from: scook94 on Feb 18, 2014, 16:07:02
I'm down too, although my router says I'm connected. The default Gateway seems reachable but neither DNS servers are pingable.
I'm having the same problem with some, but not all devices. Rebooting doesn't seem to help :dunno:
Quote from: Gary on Feb 18, 2014, 16:05:17
I lost the beeb at the time but it all seems ok again now
Seems OK for me at the moment... I think it may have started a while (~an hour?) ago, I noticed that Radio 3 started "sputtering".
[DoS attack: FIN Scan] attack packets in last 20 sec from ip [**.**.**.***], Tuesday, Feb 18,2014 15:10:49 after the initial drop. I have blocked the ip out for obvious reasons.
Can't tell from my router log... the only really bad point about the Asus is its event logging.
Seems to be an uptick in attacks in general. The security plugins on my self-hosted (elsewhere) Wordpress blog have noted a huge increase in hack attempts over the past couple of days, and it's only been a few weeks since the previous mass attempt on WP installations worldwide. The other day one IP address hammered my server with wp-login attempts 9400 times in three hours. I've learned more about the Wordpress backend, security plugins, and .htaccess files in the past few weeks than I ever thought I'd need to know.
Quote from: Bill on Feb 18, 2014, 16:18:40
Can't tell from my router log... the only really bad point about the Asus is its event logging.
I have the same ip and quite a few disconnects at that time, all point to the same ip whether that was even the real ip who knows, I looked it up and it was US based and seemed to be from Akamai. I really doubt that's the ip of the attacker though.
One thing I've found out- whatever was happening to the Radio 3 stream, iTunes doesn't recover from it, gracefully or otherwise. I had to force-quit every time it lost it :mad:
Quote from: Bill on Feb 18, 2014, 16:41:03
One thing I've found out- whatever was happening to the Radio 3 stream, iTunes doesn't recover from it, gracefully or otherwise. I had to force-quit every time it lost it :mad:
I never use iTunes to listen to the radio, on my phone its tune in radio on the Mac I go straight to the BBC page. iTunes does tend to freeze up with the loss of internet though. I was buying an album using it and that happened ages ago.
Quote from: Simon_idnet on Feb 18, 2014, 15:52:42
We just witnessed a large DDoS attack on one of our DSL customers which attracted several GBs of traffic. We are in the process of trying to identify the target.
Unfortunately the attck stopped before we were able to gather sufficaient data to identify the target. But we have identified the source vector so that if the attack recurs then we will have all the data needed to put a block on it.
Quote from: Gary on Feb 18, 2014, 16:43:46
I never use iTunes to listen to the radio, on my phone its tune in radio on the Mac I go straight to the BBC page.
I find that if I get Radio 3 direct from the BBC page it has a habit of dropping down from the 320kbps stream to the 48kbps one. Not good. It also saves messing about with Airfoil to redirect the output to the various Airplay speakers around the house- using iTunes means it's all in one place.
Quote
iTunes does tend to freeze up with the loss of internet though.
I can confirm that :P
Quote from: Simon_idnet on Feb 18, 2014, 16:48:53
Unfortunately the attck stopped before we were able to gather sufficaient data to identify the target. But we have identified the source vector so that if the attack recurs then we will have all the data needed to put a block on it.
Thanks for the info, Simon.
Quote from: Simon_idnet on Feb 18, 2014, 15:52:42
We just witnessed a large DDoS attack on one of our DSL customers which attracted several GBs of traffic. We are in the process of trying to identify the target.
Thanks for the update. Just had 2 disconnects (second required a reboot) and the packet loss spikes are back from being cleared. But FTTC boxes are being installed in this town, so could be local for me. I wonder if it is related? Also heard of some routers getting bot infected recently (http://www.tomshardware.com/news/themoon-worm-linksys-infected-8080,26042.html). I'm not in the know though, so don't listen to my random ramblings.
(http://www.thinkbroadband.com/ping/share-thumb/32b9ac4656621e3ed4e4720b290fe471-18-02-2014.png) (http://www.thinkbroadband.com/ping/share/32b9ac4656621e3ed4e4720b290fe471-18-02-2014.html)
Quote from: Bill on Feb 18, 2014, 16:41:03
One thing I've found out- whatever was happening to the Radio 3 stream, iTunes doesn't recover from it, gracefully or otherwise. I had to force-quit every time it lost it :mad:
If it helps I had to reload the flash players on my radio 1 page too. OH, but not a hard reset. That's poor form. Though I notice most software does not recover gracefully from a failed connection attempt. :(
(http://www.thinkbroadband.com/ping/share-thumb/c362d7b21c2c863cca73afb9fa7e997f-18-02-2014.png)
No, not what I was hoping for today. We'll have to wait until tomorrow to see if things are better.
Just a thought: if DSL customers can get DDOS attacks of several Gigs in a few minutes, then that's likely to screw up your data allowance isn't it? :slap:
Quote from: Technical Ben on Feb 18, 2014, 17:06:50
But FTTC boxes are being installed in this town, so could be local for me.
FTTC being installed should not have an effect on your line at all. I wondered that last year. After asking a man in the know it seems it has no effect. Interesting about those routers though.
Quote from: joe on Feb 18, 2014, 17:58:40
(http://www.thinkbroadband.com/ping/share-thumb/c362d7b21c2c863cca73afb9fa7e997f-18-02-2014.png)
No, not what I was hoping for today. We'll have to wait until tomorrow to see if things are better.
You line seems to have constant packet loss spikes though, no one else so far seems to. I'm wondering if there is a local/hardware issue going on as well with your connection. Have you tried a different router to see of the constant red goes away, of is your exchange congested by any chance?
It's every half hour on the dot. So I doubt it's normal congestion. I wonder what would cause that? Perhaps a device on the network and/or local interference of a timed device/equipment? Perhaps a noisy electrical device, or someone uploading backups every half hour?
Router busy doing something else possibly!
I noticed on AAISP they have been geting SYN Flood attacks on ZyXELs routers, they say it is effecting other ISP's. "The issue is related to specific routers, and is affecting many ISPs. In our case it is almost entirely zyxel routers that are affected. It appears to be some sort of widespread and ongoing syn flood attack that is causing routers to crash and resulting in loss of sync" Their last attack was the 7th February.
Mines a Fritz!Box 7390
Quote from: joe on Feb 19, 2014, 08:32:05
Mines a Fritz!Box 7390
Yeah I dom't think we need to all list our routers :) but with the link Technical Ben had had about certain Linskys routers and AAISP's saying for them its ZyXELs I was just wondering if this could be part of that pattern which AAISP say is effecting other ISP's.
Hi Gary,
I do believe the Zyxel issue was down to a vulnerability in certain router firmware/models and with remote management. The issue was usually solved by disabling that feature or locking it to one specific IP address (or by changing router of course).
Quote from: SimonM_IDNet on Feb 19, 2014, 09:12:12
Hi Gary,
I do believe the Zyxel issue was down to a vulnerability in certain router firmware/models and with remote management. The issue was usually solved by disabling that feature or locking it to one specific IP address (or by changing router of course).
Cheers Simon, same as the Linksys one. But since AAISP were getting SYN floods on the 7Th February stil, so could IDNet be getting them? As in yesterdays attack? Just wondered :)
Quote from: Simon_idnet on Feb 18, 2014, 16:48:53
Unfortunately the attck stopped before we were able to gather sufficaient data to identify the target. But we have identified the source vector so that if the attack recurs then we will have all the data needed to put a block on it.
All of the source traffic for the DDoS attack yesterday afternoon originated from AS4134, which is China Telecom. No surprise there! Just goes to show that there are a lot of easily compromisable machines in China - hence that's where the DDoS traffic all comes from. However, the attacker controlling this stuff could be anywhere else in the world.
Quote from: Simon_idnet on Feb 19, 2014, 10:01:06
All of the source traffic for the DDoS attack yesterday afternoon originated from AS4134, which is China Telecom. No surprise there! Just goes to show that there are a lot of easily compromisable machines in China - hence that's where the DDoS traffic all comes from. However, the attacker controlling this stuff could be anywhere else in the world.
Thanks for the info, Simon.
Things are fine speed wise at the moment which is good.
(http://www.thinkbroadband.com/speedtest/button/1392809381486670355-mini.png)
Good here too!
(http://www.speedtest.net/result/3317037309.png) (http://www.speedtest.net/my-result/3317037309)
Quote from: Simon_idnet on Feb 19, 2014, 10:01:06
All of the source traffic for the DDoS attack yesterday afternoon originated from AS4134, which is China Telecom. No surprise there! Just goes to show that there are a lot of easily compromisable machines in China - hence that's where the DDoS traffic all comes from. However, the attacker controlling this stuff could be anywhere else in the world.
Not just compromised. But setting up an attack with purchased hardware is theoretically cheaper too. So it's a target for criminals. A great example was when an entire Nintendo factory was setup. Except it was run by the mafia to both make cloned hardware at a profit, and launder money. You'd just not be able to cover such expenses in most over countries, let alone keep the illusion up long enough before you got caught.
So far so good:
(http://www.thinkbroadband.com/speedtest/button/139282144769530759376.png) (http://www.thinkbroadband.com/speedtest/results.html?id=139282144769530759376)
Something odd about the upload, but there's reports on tbb about other people seeing that too so likely it's either tbb or BT.
BQMs are a bit cleaner too, tho' still a trace of the red stuff.
Trace of red on 3 of the 4 BQMs I can see too. Looks like the issue still isn't fully resolved.
More red stuff appearing.
Speeds back to cr*p.
Silly me, everyone's watching the curling on BBC Olympics.
(http://www.speedtest.net/result/3317409288.png) (http://www.speedtest.net/my-result/3317409288)
Speeds are ok here
Download speed achieved during the test was - 67.4 Mbps
For your connection, the acceptable range of speed is 55.6 Mbps-69.5 Mbps .
Additional Information:
IP Profile for your line is - 69.5 Mbps
Speeds all over the place from minute to minute. I did get up to the 60's and now it's :
(http://www.speedtest.net/result/3317476459.png) (http://www.speedtest.net/my-result/3317476459)
Nope now they are cr@p It felt like we were so close, speeds are up and down all over the place. I thought this week was the problem solved, and it really felt like it was today. This is very disheartening.
(http://www.speedtest.net/result/3317477025.png)
(http://www.thinkbroadband.com/ping/share-thumb/f16025714bf4447c97412f3a0cea86fc-19-02-2014.png) (http://www.thinkbroadband.com/ping/share/f16025714bf4447c97412f3a0cea86fc-19-02-2014.html)
As have mine. Speeds in the afternoon awful as usual - not a blind bit of difference.
Quality:-
(http://www.thinkbroadband.com/ping/share-thumb/ebc9a25d24aadf8d40c82e6744ba5a2f-19-02-2014.png)
Speeds (62Mbps this morning as usual):-
Firefox:-
(http://www.thinkbroadband.com/speedtest/button/139282805527291412683.png)
Chrome:-
(http://www.thinkbroadband.com/speedtest/button/139282816127152354265.png)
and BT (attached)
My speeds are fine:
(http://www.thinkbroadband.com/speedtest/button/139283160613478787361.png) (http://www.thinkbroadband.com/speedtest/results.html?id=139283160613478787361)(http://www.speedtest.net/result/3317615202.png) (http://www.speedtest.net/my-result/3317615202)
The BTw tester isn't feeling co-operative atm >:(
Quote from: Bill on Feb 19, 2014, 17:46:51
My speeds are fine:
They always tend to be getting on for 6pm again, bill. I have noticed since the DNS upgrade pages are loading very fast. Guess the more powerful equipment has done its job well there. Speed loss for me wasn't as bad today but its still not fixed.
Quote from: joe on Feb 19, 2014, 16:58:05
As have mine. Speeds in the afternoon awful as usual - not a blind bit of difference.
Quality:-
(http://www.thinkbroadband.com/ping/share-thumb/ebc9a25d24aadf8d40c82e6744ba5a2f-19-02-2014.png)
Speeds (62Mbps this morning as usual):-
What happened at 4pm did you reboot your router?
No Gary I did not. I am using the Fritz as base station to Fritz DECT phones which is one of its features, I will try detaching the phones to see if they are having any effect. I will then have to revert to the OR modem and linksys router I used previously to see if that is any different.
Doesn't alter the fact that everything was OK with my setup until recently. I an only suffering as others are and have in the past and since left iDNet.
Quote from: joe on Feb 19, 2014, 18:32:39
No Gary I did not. I am using the Fritz as base station to Fritz DECT phones which is one of its features, I will try detaching the phones to see if they are having any effect. I will then have to revert to the OR modem and linksys router I used previously to see if that is any different.
Doesn't alter the fact that everything was OK with my setup until recently. I an only suffering as others are and have in the past and since left iDNet.
That makes sense now maybe it would be good to swap out to see if it stopped big drops like the one at 4pm today as that seems unique to you, but yes the situation is not resolved alas :( Is the Fitz a vDSL modem too? I know some all in ones don't mesh well with the cabs still, the HH5 uses an ECI chipset which is in line with compatibility between cabs, so it may be worth using the OR modem to see if it helps if the fritz is not a vdsl modem router ignore what I just said :)
It is a VDSL modem/router. The point is though that it was working perfectly well a month or two back, even when I started this thread I was suffering no speed drop at all in the afternoons despite the apparent packet loss. My dilemma is whether a move to another ISP would solve the problem, or whether it would continue, in which case there is no point moving.
Paul (psp83) appears to have got rid of this afternoon problem with his move.
Quote from: joe on Feb 19, 2014, 20:01:23
It is a VDSL modem/router. The point is though that it was working perfectly well a month or two back, even when I started this thread I was suffering no speed drop at all in the afternoons despite the apparent packet loss. My dilemma is whether a move to another ISP would solve the problem, or whether it would continue, in which case there is no point moving.
Paul (psp83) appears to have got rid of this afternoon problem with his move.
Only you can answer that Joe. I do sympathise.
More packet loss. More slow speeds.
Anyone else as fed up with this as I am?
I'm now seeing a repeating pattern that I can only see occurring on one other customer's BQM. During the afternoon and evenings there's a visual indication of continual heavy usage on my line coupled with a fair degree of packet loss. During these periods I generally can't stream due to insufficient bandwidth and my latency often quadruples.
(http://www.thinkbroadband.com/ping/share-thumb/e7cffb8cf5c1804736e9a97fc547d6f3-20-02-2014.png) (http://www.thinkbroadband.com/ping/share/e7cffb8cf5c1804736e9a97fc547d6f3-20-02-2014.html)
I've no idea what's causing the problem and I'm not really getting anywhere trying to get the issue fixed.
There still seems to be something awry somewhere:
(http://www.thinkbroadband.com/speedtest/button/139289703127731628148.png) (http://www.thinkbroadband.com/speedtest/results.html?id=139289703127731628148)
I'm still not convinced that it's a simple bandwidth issue, but I've no idea what it is.
Quote from: Bill on Feb 20, 2014, 11:53:56
I'm still not convinced that it's a simple bandwidth issue, but I've no idea what it is.
I agree, but Idnet's solution mainly seems to be to tell us it's about to get better. I've had enough.
I'm in touch with Zen, and am seeking advice for what can be done about damage caused. There appear to be more options than I realised.
Update: You have to admire Idnet. I call to ask for my Mac code and they tell me to email my request. No asking me why I want to leave.
They clearly could not care less.
Quote from: davecollins on Feb 20, 2014, 12:06:10
Update: You have to admire Idnet. I call to ask for my Mac code and they tell me to email my request. No asking me why I want to leave.
They clearly could not care less.
Anthing like that has to be done by email, Dave. Even upgrades, and I bet they already know why. :sigh:
Speeds seem ok here at the moment. I'm not convinced its packetloss as when I ping say the bbc when the speed drops I get 0% packetloss. The thing is no way should anyone loose 40Mbps and get them back minutes later, and to have that yo-yo effect repeating month in month out. It just never gets fixed either.
(http://www.speedtest.net/result/3319357804.png)
Quote from: Bill on Feb 20, 2014, 11:53:56
There still seems to be something awry somewhere:
(http://www.thinkbroadband.com/speedtest/button/139289703127731628148.png) (http://www.thinkbroadband.com/speedtest/results.html?id=139289703127731628148)
I'm still not convinced that it's a simple bandwidth issue, but I've no idea what it is.
Bill, I've noticed recently that our BQMs could be twins. I suspect we have the same issue although I'm fairly sure we are in different locations (North London here). Our BQMs indicate a remarkably similar pattern of usage although I suspect neither of us are actually using the Internet as the BQMs would suggest.
Quote from: Gary on Feb 20, 2014, 12:13:05
Anthing like that has to be done by email, Dave. Even upgrades, and I bet they already know why. :sigh:
Absolutely, but my main point was that I wasn't asked why.
And they didn't know who I was - different line, blocked number.
When you call a company and tell them you're leaving, you'd think they'd at least be interested?
And what
really annoys me is that Zen offer unlimited for £15 a month cheaper than I'm paying right now.
I don't mind paying more, but would hope to get what I pay for.
I'm waiting until Simon from Idnet gets back to me, but unless he has a seriously powerful magic wand to wave, I'm out of here.
This has been going on for months now.
Quote from: davecollins on Feb 20, 2014, 12:25:57
Absolutely, but my main point was that I wasn't asked why.
And they didn't know who I was - different line, blocked number.
When you call a company and tell them you're leaving, you'd think they'd at least be interested?
And what really annoys me is that Zen offer unlimited for £15 a month cheaper than I'm paying right now.
I don't mind paying more, but would hope to get what I pay for.
I'm waiting until Simon from Idnet gets back to me, but unless he has a seriously powerful magic wand to wave, I'm out of here.
This has been going on for months now.
IDnet are not equipped to ever offer unlimited at Zen prices to be fair, Dave. As to the rest I can see your point. I'd probably be happy with an extra 100GB for the price, I don't want unlimited and I don't think unlimited FTTC is a good thing long term as it has to reach a point when to many heavy downloaders slows things surely :dunno: I would love to know what's causing the blood loss on the TBBQM and I'm not sure that is really giving a proper view of what's happening either, but so far IDNet don't seem to be able to fix the truly drastic loss in speed which is beyond a joke. Its a shame as they have been spot on for so many years. I think though people have just reached the point where enough is enough now though.
Quote from: zappaDPJ on Feb 20, 2014, 12:19:55
Bill, I've noticed recently that our BQMs could be twins. I suspect we have the same issue although I'm fairly sure we are in different locations (North London here). Our BQMs indicate a remarkably similar pattern of usage although I suspect neither of us are actually using the Internet as the BQMs would suggest.
Yes, I'd noticed that. I'm out in Oxfordshire on the Didcot exchange, and I'm as sure as hell that I haven't hit the 'net hard enough to cause that latency!
Didcot was pretty early in the FTTC rollout and, as I've mentioned before, there are indications that my cabinet may be in the course of being extended. That implies a
lot of traffic through the exchange which maybe can't really cope. I can see traces of it back as far as December and it's slowly been getting worse.
Obviously, if that's the case then there's nothing IDNet (or any other ISP) can do about it, it's just a case of waiting for BT to uprate the exchange/backhaul... I'm not holding my breath :(
Quote from: Bill on Feb 20, 2014, 12:33:51
Obviously, if that's the case then there's nothing IDNet (or any other ISP) can do about it, it's just a case of waiting for BT to uprate the exchange/backhaul... I'm not holding my breath :(
Oddly though the speed issue in the day time/early evening has been cured by people moving to new ISP's Bill. Issues with eratic speed drops have vanished when they have moved, which points back here again I guess. :conf:
Quote from: Gary on Feb 20, 2014, 12:40:18
Oddly though the speed issue in the day time has been cured by people moving to new ISP's Bill.
The speed issues, yes, but I assumed Zap was referring to the horrible increase in latency on both our BQMs from about 5pm onwards. That looks local rather than IDNet.
Quote from: Bill on Feb 20, 2014, 12:44:03
The speed issues, yes, but I assumed Zap was referring to the horrible increase in latency on both our BQMs from about 5pm onwards. That looks local rather than IDNet.
True, I think after a while people have let all of it get mixed in. If as you say you are having new cabs put in then that does mean alot of traffic, though I would have thought they would need to uprate the exchange or backhaul for those cabs or basically it will just get worse. :-\ BT are doing a lot of work on the network at the moment though, and the rate of FTTC exchanges left to upgrade is coming to a end as well.
Quote from: Gary on Feb 20, 2014, 12:47:34... or basically it will just get worse. :-\
Yup, exactly what it's doing... but not to the extent that I can claim it's a fault :bawl:
Quote from: Gary on Feb 20, 2014, 12:40:18
Oddly though the speed issue in the day time/early evening has been cured by people moving to new ISP's Bill. Issues with eratic speed drops have vanished when they have moved, which points back here again I guess. :conf:
I think there's a possibility that me and Bill have been hit by a double whammy. Inadequate bandwidth provision within IDNet's domain and a congested BT infrastructure, local to us. It might explain why my connection is unusable during peak times rather then just problematic. When I say unusable I mean I literally can't do anything other than browsing web pages.
Quote from: Bill on Feb 20, 2014, 12:44:03
The speed issues, yes, but I assumed Zap was referring to the horrible increase in latency on both our BQMs from about 5pm onwards. That looks local rather than IDNet.
Indeed :)
BT should really be getting the Vectoring sorted as well, as crosstalk is going to be a major issue too, although from what I can make out the last phase of cabs has been mainly ECI. The ECI cabinets can do vectoring per card without new hardware but this then requires the pairs connected to be redone so that each pair bundle is all going to one card, lots of work and inefficient. Also for proper vectoring the old ECI dslams need replacing.
Quote from: zappaDPJ on Feb 20, 2014, 12:53:03When I say unusable I mean I literally can't do anything other than browsing web pages.
It hasn't (yet) hit me that hard- it hasn't stopped me doing anything, even video streaming (tho' I don't do a lot of that), just some things take rather longer than they really ought to on an 80/20 line.
Quote from: zappaDPJ on Feb 20, 2014, 12:53:03
I think there's a possibility that me and Bill have been hit by a double whammy. Inadequate bandwidth provision within IDNet's domain and a congested BT infrastructure, local to us. It might explain why my connection is unusable during peak times rather then just problematic. When I say unusable I mean I literally can't do anything other than browsing web pages.
I think thats true, I can still stream but gaming is bad when hit by by the speed drops, but not to the extent your line is.
Quote from: zappaDPJ on Feb 20, 2014, 12:53:03
I think there's a possibility that me and Bill have been hit by a double whammy. Inadequate bandwidth provision within IDNet's domain and a congested BT infrastructure, local to us. It might explain why my connection is unusable during peak times rather then just problematic. When I say unusable I mean I literally can't do anything other than browsing web pages.
That's a sign of the times! When I first had the Internet, browsing web pages was about all you
could do!
Seeing articles like this, makes me wonder if smaller companies simply can't keep up with the pace:
http://www.bbc.co.uk/mediacentre/latestnews/2014/2013-iplayer-stats.html
Quote from: Simon on Feb 20, 2014, 13:05:46
That's a sign of the times! When I first had the Internet, browsing web pages was about all you could do!
Seeing articles like this, makes me wonder if smaller companies simply can't keep up with the pace:
http://www.bbc.co.uk/mediacentre/latestnews/2014/2013-iplayer-stats.html
The thing is its not all at once IDNet does not have every user watching iPlayer at once if they did they would I imagine they grind to a halt, peoples usage varies day to day hour to hour so buy keeping bandwidth available and not over subscribing they should be able to I would have thought. :-\
I'm done here - my migration is now underway. I'll post here when I've moved to compare experiences.
For what it's worth this week (unlike previous weeks when I've had the same issues as everyone else, apparently) my IDNet broadband on VDSL2 based off the red6 PoP at Stepney Green has had negligible packet loss showing off TBQM (with only the 5m known outage at 2.25pm on Tuesday, when the router failed to connect to the IDNet's server for 4 minute-apart attempts), and so far as I can see peak afternoon/evening speeds on the TB speedtester have been consistent at my max 36-38Mbps on a line capped at 40Mpbs (old package). Many issues, not a single one, methinks. Strangely I always get weird 1-3Mpbs results on the 6x test, but I tend to blame the router which thinks I'm getting a DoS attack, presumably! And using the mobile Android tester via wifi again gives a pathetic result, but then wireless gives the the same result as wired on the PC.
Much better here this afternoon, and so far less red on the graphs too mainly.
Ironically I'm seeing the same thing too. But the last three months have taught me one thing: this won't last.
I've been very patient, and so has everyone else here. But enough.
Dave, it certainly will last. As I've explained to you personally, many times, we are continually working at getting this right and we will succeed. We're aiming at engineering our network to absorb these traffic-generating events, with a particular eye on the upcoming football World Cup.
I hope you're right - but I've been waiting (fairly) patiently for literally months now. Each time there's been a fix, things have improved and then the problem has returned.
The reason you've had to explain this personally to me many times is that the situation has not been resolved! I suspect and hope that you will succeed, but in the meantime these issues have had a terrible impact on the quality of the video conferencing with our US clients and even with a webinar we were holding.
I can no longer afford to sit and wait in good faith for this to be fixed.
Well I don't know about anybody else but my patience has run out. I'm currently experiencing 88% packet loss so I can't even browse the net.
Microsoft Windows [Version 6.1.7601]
Copyright (c) 2009 Microsoft Corporation. All rights reserved.
C:\Users\zappaDPJ>tracert google.co.uk
Tracing route to google.co.uk [173.194.41.119]
over a maximum of 30 hops:
1 <1 ms <1 ms <1 ms 192.168.1.1
2 11 ms 11 ms 12 ms telehouse-gw3-lo1.idnet.net [212.69.63.47]
3 7 ms 7 ms 7 ms 212.69.63.82
4 15 ms 17 ms * redbus-gw2-gi3-331.idnet.net [212.69.63.5]
5 * * * Request timed out.
6 20 ms 20 ms * 209.85.255.78
7 * * * Request timed out.
8 * 24 ms * lhr08s02-in-f23.1e100.net [173.194.41.119]
9 21 ms * * lhr08s02-in-f23.1e100.net [173.194.41.119]
10 24 ms 24 ms * lhr08s02-in-f23.1e100.net [173.194.41.119]
11 17 ms * * lhr08s02-in-f23.1e100.net [173.194.41.119]
12 * * * Request timed out.
13 * * 19 ms lhr08s02-in-f23.1e100.net [173.194.41.119]
Trace complete.
C:\Users\zappaDPJ>ping google.co.uk -n 25
Pinging google.co.uk [173.194.41.87] with 32 bytes of data:
Request timed out.
Request timed out.
Reply from 173.194.41.87: bytes=32 time=22ms TTL=58
Reply from 173.194.41.87: bytes=32 time=20ms TTL=58
Request timed out.
Request timed out.
Request timed out.
Request timed out.
Request timed out.
Request timed out.
Request timed out.
Request timed out.
Request timed out.
Request timed out.
Request timed out.
Request timed out.
Request timed out.
Request timed out.
Reply from 173.194.41.87: bytes=32 time=22ms TTL=58
Request timed out.
Request timed out.
Request timed out.
Request timed out.
Request timed out.
Request timed out.
Ping statistics for 173.194.41.87:
Packets: Sent = 25, Received = 3, Lost = 22 (88% loss),
Approximate round trip times in milli-seconds:
Minimum = 20ms, Maximum = 22ms, Average = 21ms
C:\Users\zappaDPJ>
Something's not right but my speed test is fine :dunno: Edit nope its all ok now
Download speed achieved during the test was - 67.32 Mbps
For your connection, the acceptable range of speedsis 55.6 Mbps-69.5 Mbps .
Additional Information:
IP Profile for your line is - 69.5 Mbps
I'm having problems too- tbb and BTw tests are slow (the BT one is showing as red, first time I've ever seen that), speedtest.net just spins its wheels at "connecting", some US sites I use are also very slow, and IPv6 is a waste of time atm:
(http://www.thinkbroadband.com/ping/share-thumb/e0d74a17f46212d7db23863cfa99c054-20-02-2014.png) (http://www.thinkbroadband.com/ping/share/e0d74a17f46212d7db23863cfa99c054-20-02-2014.html)
IPv4 about normal so far.
Experiencing massive packet loss right now.
C:\Users\Aaron>pathping 213.155.155.233
Tracing route to 213-155-155-233.customer.teliacarrier.com [213.155.155.233]
over a maximum of 30 hops:
0 Heimdall.home.gateway [192.168.1.1]
1 192.168.1.254
2 212.69.63.39
3 212.69.63.88
4 ge-2-25.r02.londen03.uk.bb.gin.ntt.net [213.130.48.161]
5 ae-4.r23.londen03.uk.bb.gin.ntt.net [129.250.5.40]
6 ae-3.r22.amstnl02.nl.bb.gin.ntt.net [129.250.5.198]
7 ae-1.r02.amstnl02.nl.bb.gin.ntt.net [129.250.2.113]
8 ae-0.teliasonera.amstnl02.nl.bb.gin.ntt.net [129.250.8.66]
9 * * *
Computing statistics for 200 seconds...
Source to Here This Node/Link
Hop RTT Lost/Sent = Pct Lost/Sent = Pct Address
0 Heimdall.home.gateway [192.168.1.1]
0/ 100 = 0% |
1 3ms 0/ 100 = 0% 0/ 100 = 0% 192.168.1.254
0/ 100 = 0% |
2 16ms 0/ 100 = 0% 0/ 100 = 0% 212.69.63.39
0/ 100 = 0% |
3 17ms 0/ 100 = 0% 0/ 100 = 0% 212.69.63.88
3/ 100 = 3% |
4 17ms 4/ 100 = 4% 1/ 100 = 1% ge-2-25.r02.londen03.uk.bb.gin.ntt.net [213.130.48.161]
0/ 100 = 0% |
5 21ms 5/ 100 = 5% 2/ 100 = 2% ae-4.r23.londen03.uk.bb.gin.ntt.net [129.250.5.40]
0/ 100 = 0% |
6 27ms 7/ 100 = 7% 4/ 100 = 4% ae-3.r22.amstnl02.nl.bb.gin.ntt.net [129.250.5.198]
0/ 100 = 0% |
7 27ms 3/ 100 = 3% 0/ 100 = 0% ae-1.r02.amstnl02.nl.bb.gin.ntt.net [129.250.2.113]
24/ 100 = 24% |
8 61ms 27/ 100 = 27% 0/ 100 = 0% ae-0.teliasonera.amstnl02.nl.bb.gin.ntt.net [129.250.8.66]
Trace complete.
Speed test working fine here, Bill.
(http://www.speedtest.net/result/3320440771.png)
Ping has started...
PING bbc.co.uk (212.58.244.18): 56 data bytes
64 bytes from 212.58.244.18: icmp_seq=0 ttl=57 time=8.191 ms
64 bytes from 212.58.244.18: icmp_seq=1 ttl=57 time=8.484 ms
64 bytes from 212.58.244.18: icmp_seq=2 ttl=57 time=8.811 ms
64 bytes from 212.58.244.18: icmp_seq=3 ttl=57 time=8.625 ms
64 bytes from 212.58.244.18: icmp_seq=4 ttl=57 time=8.921 ms
64 bytes from 212.58.244.18: icmp_seq=5 ttl=57 time=8.271 ms
64 bytes from 212.58.244.18: icmp_seq=6 ttl=57 time=8.596 ms
64 bytes from 212.58.244.18: icmp_seq=7 ttl=57 time=8.894 ms
64 bytes from 212.58.244.18: icmp_seq=8 ttl=57 time=8.401 ms
64 bytes from 212.58.244.18: icmp_seq=9 ttl=57 time=8.396 ms
--- bbc.co.uk ping statistics ---
10 packets transmitted, 10 packets received, 0.0% packet loss
round-trip min/avg/max/stddev = 8.191/8.559/8.921/0.242 ms
No packet loss either. I have no idea, I suspect this maybe outside IDNet.
Quote from: Gary on Feb 20, 2014, 20:36:11I suspect this maybe outside IDNet.
It could easily be the "local" problem that Zap and I are lumbered with (I suspect it is), but I can't think of any reliable way to tell :dunno:
No idea, Bill. :dunno: Everything is fine at my end. There was a fault with 01773 numbers at 8PM according to Zens page but that's been fixed. :-\
Now even my email is timing out :eek4:
edit- but only the IDNet accounts.... which doesn't sound local.
I've just attempted to email IDNet support my best wishes :eyebrow: but I can neither send or receive mail.
Quote from: Bill on Feb 20, 2014, 20:45:17
Now even my email is timing out :eek4:
edit- but only the IDNet accounts.... which doesn't sound local.
Email has been behaving oddly for a while there was a post about it earlier. Maybe an issue with the new DNS servers? I can send fine though now.
Aaron doesn't appear to be on an IDNet connection (unless I'm being characteristically thick), and is still experiencing packet loss:
http://www.idnetters.co.uk/forums/index.php/topic,31600.msg727142.html#msg727142
Doesn't that suggest an outside issue?
My connection seems fine on ADSL2+.
(http://www.thinkbroadband.com/ping/share-thumb/fe02a317040f58e7e3f3f9339f102c7a.png) (http://www.thinkbroadband.com/ping/share/fe02a317040f58e7e3f3f9339f102c7a.html)
I am on IDNet, the 2 IP addresses aren't resolving in my tracerts at the moment (212.69.63.39 212.69.63.88)
Getting about 8% packet loss on 100 pings to bbc.co.uk.
Quote from: Aaron on Feb 20, 2014, 21:00:29
I am on IDNet, the 2 IP addresses aren't resolving in my tracerts at the moment (212.69.63.39 212.69.63.88)
OK, sorry. :red:
The forum has been slow that I have noticed. My speeds are still fine though and no packetloss. At this point I have no idea.
Again, I've not noticed the forum being slow on ADSL2+.
Quote from: Gary on Feb 20, 2014, 21:04:02
The forum has been slow that I have noticed. My speeds are still fine though and no packetloss. At this point I have no idea.
Haven't noticed any difference with the forum, still quick here :dunno:
Quote from: Bill on Feb 20, 2014, 21:05:53
Haven't noticed any difference with the forum, still quick here :dunno:
Forums fine again now, Bill. I suspect we will find out what this is later, maybe a failure at a node like before? I cannot say for sure but I think people leap to 'its idnet' because of the issues we have had when sometimes is nothing to do with them at all, but tbh its anyones guess. Edit: now forum is slow again...looking at Craig's tgere are no red curtains apart from joes which is usual on his one.
Everything except email seems back to normal now (well, as normal as ever on my line at this time of night :P)
Fortunately the IDNet accounts aren't my primary ones... I've sent a couple of test mails to and from another account, I'll see what happens to them.
Quote from: Bill on Feb 20, 2014, 21:18:19
I've sent a couple of test mails to and from another account, I'll see what happens to them.
mine arrived ok bill.
Can't see anything on my BQM but some sites seem to be slow to load tonight and my Apple email not loading, maybe a DNS issue?
It seems I can send email from an IDNet account, but can't receive: "The connection to host pop3.idnet.com on port 110 failed."
It can wait until tomorrow.
It seems there was a DDoS attack last night, which is not connected to the ongoing packet loss issues. This thread refers. (http://www.idnetters.co.uk/forums/index.php/topic,31881.0.html)
Please keep this thread strictly for packet loss reporting.
Thanks.
Here we go again! Yawn!!!!!! :( :( :( :(
(http://www.speedtest.net/result/3321752058.png) (http://www.speedtest.net/my-result/3321752058)
(http://www.thinkbroadband.com/ping/share-thumb/6cf0eac37dbcc3e5ebc16940d3cfeffd-21-02-2014.png) (http://www.thinkbroadband.com/ping/share/6cf0eac37dbcc3e5ebc16940d3cfeffd-21-02-2014.html)
Quote from: sobranie on Feb 21, 2014, 12:08:51
Here we go again! Yawn!!!!!! :( :( :( :(
Identical to what I'm seeing. Sigh. I wonder what the reason for today's decline will be,
I now have a confirmed day for my connection with Zen to go live - wish I could speed it up...
Down to 49Mbps :sigh: Saying that will all the people moving to Zen I wonder how long before their speeds drop off. Yesterday until the DDoS attack was much better. I wonder what's gone wrong today...
Quote from: davecollins on Feb 21, 2014, 12:11:38
Identical to what I'm seeing. Sigh. I wonder what the reason for today's decline will be,
I now have a confirmed day for my connection with Zen to go live - wish I could speed it up...
I've to wait until July! Lord grant me patience,but Hurry!
Speeds back to normal. tbh for the sake of a few minutes I'm not bothered today, I would not have noticed unless I came here, its when it happens for prolonged periods its annoying. If people were not clock watching the TBBQM I bet many would not notice the loss of maybe 10Mbps. As to others loosing more, maybe there is congestion as well involved making it worse as the speed drops do vary from person to person. The whole thing is getting boring for me now. Its not right but unless I drop to 20Mbps its not damaging for 5-10 minutes, although it does need to be fixed still.
If someone is targeting IDNet connections, I wonder if they've been looking at this forum and having a bit of amusement with us headless chickens clacking in the coop?
Quote from: mervl on Feb 21, 2014, 12:32:19
If someone is targeting IDNet connections, I wonder if they've been looking at this forum and having a bit of amusement with us headless chickens clacking in the coop?
Unless someone like Derp trolling are really really really bored and have no big targets to get headline press with I doubt thats the case. Also no headless chickens here ;)
Speeds went up to mid 70's for a wee while but back to this at my 'hen coop'.
(http://www.speedtest.net/result/3321969661.png) (http://www.speedtest.net/my-result/3321969661)
............... and still dropping. IDNet categorically state that it's all down to the Winter Olympics.
(http://www.speedtest.net/result/3322054152.png) (http://www.speedtest.net/my-result/3322054152)
(http://www.thinkbroadband.com/ping/share-thumb/6cf0eac37dbcc3e5ebc16940d3cfeffd-21-02-2014.png) (http://www.thinkbroadband.com/ping/share/6cf0eac37dbcc3e5ebc16940d3cfeffd-21-02-2014.html)
Hmmmm. Seems the same here too.
(http://www.thinkbroadband.com/ping/share-thumb/73057144da713b0665bd7e20661f5221-21-02-2014.png) (http://www.thinkbroadband.com/ping/share/73057144da713b0665bd7e20661f5221-21-02-2014.html)
Strange as I was getting the online radio cut off last night, but the graph shows no packet loss then. I suppose I can make do if my usage (programs) are not effected. But it's something I'll have to think hard about. As zero packet loss (and by extension consistent packet speeds with no throttling) was the main and only reason for me to go to IDNet. :(
yep same here too..........exactly the same pattern and latency gone back up :(
Quote from: sobranie on Feb 21, 2014, 14:48:06
............... and still dropping. IDNet categorically state that it's all down to the Winter Olympics.
IDnet must have very little bandwidth then.......
(http://www.thinkbroadband.com/ping/share-thumb/1068cb46defa5d3a4a52df413d752eb1.png) (http://www.thinkbroadband.com/ping/share/1068cb46defa5d3a4a52df413d752eb1.html)
Download speed achieved during the test was - 68.95 Mbps
For your connection, the acceptable range of speed is 55.6 Mbps-69.5 Mbps .
Additional Information:
IP Profile for your line is - 69.5 Mbps
(http://www.speedtest.net/result/3322392590.png)
Got the same packet loss here again too.
(http://www.thinkbroadband.com/ping/share-thumb/cef533a191aae6a5537c4bcc368a0aa2-21-02-2014.png) (http://www.thinkbroadband.com/ping/share/cef533a191aae6a5537c4bcc368a0aa2-21-02-2014.html)
Also noticed since I started monitoring my link that I have quite a big surge in latency roughly every 6 hours. Not sure what's causing it, and happens when I'm asleep/in work. I've made sure everything possible is switched off, wireless on my router off etc too. Odd. :dunno:
I'm still getting a huge amount of packet loss and very slow throughput. In fact the only time the Internet is reliable is between the hours of 2.00am and 10.00am.
(http://www.thinkbroadband.com/ping/share-thumb/8e12af6dc39dc0273ecd94c1afb30fbf.png) (http://www.thinkbroadband.com/ping/share/8e12af6dc39dc0273ecd94c1afb30fbf.html)
all ok here at the mo, Zap,
(http://www.speedtest.net/result/3328243772.png)
Mine looked like that last night, but it was the closing ceremony for the Olympics ;)
Speed was down from where it should have been, but not as much as I'd expected from the look of the BQM- maybe a 25% loss.
If Simon is right and the Olympics were the cause of it then it should be a lot better today... time will tell.
My speeds gave been seemed fine over the weekend, but tbh I have not been sitting doing any speedtests or been online that much. But when I was early evening of lunchtime ish things seemed ok, time will tell now as you say the Olympics have finished.
My speeds aren't great this morning - down to 55 down. That's enough to really feel it.
Quote from: davecollins on Feb 24, 2014, 13:29:22
My speeds aren't great this morning - down to 55 down. That's enough to really feel it.
Download speed achieved during the test was - 67.58 Mbps
For your connection, the acceptable range of speed is 55.6 Mbps-69.5 Mbps .
Additional Information:
IP Profile for your line is - 69.5 Mbps
I noticed a few red blobs appearing on those TBBQM again which were not there over the weekend again, but speed seems ok so far for me...
Download speedachieved during the test was - 63.11 Mbps
For your connection, the acceptable range of speedsis 51.67 Mbps-64.58 Mbps .
Additional Information:
IP Profile for your line is - 64.58 Mbps
Can't complain about that... but I'm waiting until after about 4:30 before I think about uncrossing my fingers.
and at 4.30 we find:-
(http://www.thinkbroadband.com/speedtest/button/139325934118233221627.png)
the usual afternoon dip with no Olympics as an excuse.
:) No issues here in the east either on TBBQM or with speeds. But then I stayed on a capped 40/10 service. Perhaps BT shouldn't have uncapped the domestic service if the network infrastructure can't take the consequences.
At least I don't have to fret about not getting what I might have got and, if I want to concentrate on anything, there's making the best use of what I have got, which is hard enough.
I have to say that speeds still aren't good, but better than when the Olympics were on:
(http://www.thinkbroadband.com/speedtest/button/139327447325217365344.png) (http://www.thinkbroadband.com/speedtest/results.html?id=139327447325217365344)
BQM's are still poor in the evening, I need some way to determine whether the problem could be my exchange (or even my cabinet?)... iow, someone local with a fixed IP, a different ISP and who doesn't mind me setting up a BQM to their router. I've thought it over and come up with exactly zero candidates :(
Bill I'm not sure whether this is still applicable
http://www.kitz.co.uk/adsl/btwspeedtest.htm
It used to test your connection with BT servers and not your ISP
My connection is the same as usual, total garbage during peak hours.
(http://www.thinkbroadband.com/ping/share-thumb/f44c0489d01a1c4bc9be270215c998ca-24-02-2014.png) (http://www.thinkbroadband.com/ping/share/f44c0489d01a1c4bc9be270215c998ca-24-02-2014.html)
Quote from: Steve on Feb 24, 2014, 21:31:36
Bill I'm not sure whether this is still applicable
I'd forgotten about the old BTw test, thanks.
I'm not sure it'll do what I want tbh- I'm more interested in the congestion implied by the BQM than single speed tests, they quite often show clean anyway if (Sod's Law!) I happen to run it at a quiet moment. And that test can only be run once every 3 hours!
But it could be a useful one to have in reserve.
Bill, Zap - both your BQM graphs show the classic signs of a congested cabinet/exchange. Please could you both run the BT Speedtest during a bad spell and send them into Support? We'll then raise a fault with BT for you.
Will do, the worst looks around 10pm for me... but is mine bad enough for BT to view it as a fault? Don't they usually want three, spread thoughout the day?
I've only run one BT test where the speed showed as red, and that was only by about 200kbps.
It will be a battle with BT. They will want to send an engineer which we will have to refuse because he would only arrive at a time when the problem is not in evidence. BT removed to process for us to complain about a congested Exchange because, they say, capacity is automatically managed. So we'll have to convince them that it is their management of your Exchange that is faulty rather than your line being faulty.
Is this still relevant for FTTC?
http://usertools.plus.net/exchanges/
Not sure who looks after FTTC though , aren't the cabinets down to Openreach and then the exchange and after is BTw which if I'm right sounds a tad confusing.
Quote from: Steve on Feb 25, 2014, 11:05:17
Is this still relevant for FTTC?
http://usertools.plus.net/exchanges/
Not sure who looks after FTTC though , aren't the cabinets down to Openreach and then the exchange and after is BTw which if I'm right sounds a tad confusing.
Spot on Steve. Openreach look after as you said FTTC cabinets and the exchange, then its BTw who are in charge of things like the EES to MSE upgrades that are going on at the moment.
Quote from: Simon_idnet on Feb 25, 2014, 11:01:47
It will be a battle with BT.
Doesn't sound too promising, but I'm game if you are ;)
Would a copy/paste of the text or a screen grab be preferable?
I've also started a 24-hour ping (at 10s intervals) to idnet.com, if that shows anything useful I'll attach the file at the same time.
@Steve- I don't think it's relevant, but fwiw my exchange shows as green. Mind you, it still refers to 20CN virtual pipes :dunno:
A screenshot will be fine.
20CN used VPs. 21CN uses SVLANs.
And it looks like it is still happening...
Monday 24th - 17:29
(http://www.thinkbroadband.com/speedtest/button/139326293412725618180.png) (http://www.thinkbroadband.com/speedtest/results.html?id=139326293412725618180)
Monday 24th - 17:50
(http://www.thinkbroadband.com/speedtest/button/139326415909799991744.png) (http://www.thinkbroadband.com/speedtest/results.html?id=139326415909799991744)
Tuesday 25th - 17:27
(http://www.thinkbroadband.com/speedtest/button/139334920476833753865.png) (http://www.thinkbroadband.com/speedtest/results.html?id=139334920476833753865)
And my BQM at current moment
(http://www.thinkbroadband.com/ping/share-thumb/35060575047517c9898352312b269877-25-02-2014.png) (http://www.thinkbroadband.com/ping/share/35060575047517c9898352312b269877-25-02-2014.html)
I have no issues at all on weekends or normally after 18:00 and up till recently had no red in it at all.
Download speed achieved during the test was - 53.07 Mbps
For your connection, the acceptable range of speed is 55.6 Mbps-69.5 Mbps .
Additional Information:
IP Profile for your line is - 69.5 Mbps
A nice line in the red :sigh: No issues at weekends though, wasn't to bad yesterday, worse today and that all to familiar red TBBQM curtain is back again. After 6pm it will be fine as NGDragon said.
And as predicted.
Tuesday 25th - 18:00
(http://www.thinkbroadband.com/speedtest/button/139335117137810916896.png) (http://www.thinkbroadband.com/speedtest/results.html?id=139335117137810916896)
So much for it being over when the olympics finished. Sorry to sound bitter but blah....
It's all gone Pete Tong again over here :'(
(http://www.thinkbroadband.com/ping/share-thumb/7e53d8356c65027f20da12745a238c6b-25-02-2014.png)
Quote from: Gary on Feb 25, 2014, 17:50:50
A nice line in the red :sigh:
I'm getting quite a collection of red lines to send to Simon tomorrow (running a speedtest every hour or so), the last one is the best so far:
Download speed achieved during the test was - 15.43 Mbps
For your connection, the acceptable range of speeds is 51.67 Mbps-64.58 Mbps .
Additional Information:
IP Profile for your line is - 64.58 Mbps
:eek4:
edit- I should add that these tests are to give Simon something to beat BT about the head with- he's sure it's exchange/cabinet congestion and it's my favourite idea too.
Quote from: mervl on Feb 18, 2014, 18:03:53
Just a thought: if DSL customers can get DDOS attacks of several Gigs in a few minutes, then that's likely to screw up your data allowance isn't it? :slap:
http://www.idnetters.co.uk/forums/index.php/topic,31833.0.html
I'm now with a different ISP on an unlimited package. Once almost burnt, never again. Contrary to my posts in that thread I'm still running my email server. It's doing fine :)
Quote from: zappaDPJ on Feb 20, 2014, 12:19:55
Bill, I've noticed recently that our BQMs could be twins. I suspect we have the same issue although I'm fairly sure we are in different locations (North London here).
Picked this up on tbb, are you anywhere near Crouch End?
http://status.aa.net.uk/1890
So a good weekend with no slow downs on my side, waiting for the red curtain of wtf to slip back today around 5:30pm... hoping it wont. Then again I hope Russia does not kick off in the Ukraine but what's the chance of that not occurring either... :-X
Quote from: Bill on Mar 03, 2014, 09:37:21
Picked this up on tbb, are you anywhere near Crouch End?
http://status.aa.net.uk/1890
I'm on different exchange Bill, probably about 5 miles from Crouch End. However I did have an engineer call Sunday lunch time. As you can see below, he managed to time his visit really well, leaving just before the daily packet loss started.
(http://www.thinkbroadband.com/ping/share-thumb/34202a8d6565567372268d886bfe4ad9-03-03-2014.png) (http://www.thinkbroadband.com/ping/share/34202a8d6565567372268d886bfe4ad9-03-03-2014.html)
He was not happy that I didn't have a clear and obvious fault but he did say the FTTC cabinet was filled to capacity.
I'm currently renting an office, I've given up trying to work from home and in the medium term I'm looking to move. The communications infrastructure in this area is abysmal, a real backwater. Even Virgin don't bother. Twice I've tried and failed to get a second line connected. I've pretty given up of ever getting a decent connection.
Ah well, it was worth a shot. (I used to live in Muswell Hill many moons ago, so thought you might be in the area)
I had an engineer turn up on Saturday, he also left before the fun really got started (although it was quite a bit later that day- the fine weather must have kept people away from their computers!)
He changed the faceplate for a newer version (mine apparently didn't have some extra choke in it or something) but didn't expect it to make any difference, and he was right.
I showed him the speedtests I'd done, along with the BQMs (which I had to explain), he agreed that it looked like congestion somewhere but that was outside his remit. Fair enough.
Youngish bloke, good lad. Makes a nice change to get one who accepts that the customer might just know what they're talking about!
Quote from: Bill on Mar 03, 2014, 12:23:57
Ah well, it was worth a shot. (I used to live in Muswell Hill many moons ago, so thought you might be in the area)
I wish, although we have quite a number of friends who live in that area. One couple just sold their four bedroomed semi, close to Alexandria Park Road for 1.6 million :eek4: Here's another one for sale in the same road: http://www.rightmove.co.uk/property-for-sale/property-44692079.html?premiumA=true They were clearly robbed! ;D
I'm nearer Barnet, so further north.
The sad anomaly is that (for political reasons I suppose) Greater London (and perhaps other large conurbations and a few residual larger urban post-war housing estates) are outside the BDUK subsidy, so are the new poor relations for broadband. During the great post-war housing expansion much telecomms infrastructure was put in on the cheap and with negligible quality control - up to the late 1980s, and I suspect it's still happening with quite a lot of Developers. The stuff you don't see doesn't sell. I think locally the next best thing that ever happened to telecomms was the late 1980s gale - so much of it blew down that it had to be replaced. The underground stuff is just patched up endlessly - here that eventually got to a virtually replacement network after 25 years, but with so many joints that half the data escapes.
I think the best hope is to get somewhere with at least the prospect of major new builds, when BT have the incentive (and probably the developer payments) to improve capacity. We've gone back to the nineteenth century: make money to spend money (and not the other way round).
Quote from: zappaDPJ on Mar 03, 2014, 12:40:13
I wish, although we have quite a number of friends who live in that area. One couple just sold their four bedroomed semi, close to Alexandria Park Road for 1.6 million :eek4: Here's another one for sale in the same road: http://www.rightmove.co.uk/property-for-sale/property-44692079.html?premiumA=true They were clearly robbed! ;D
I'm nearer Barnet, so further north.
Wow, I know places where it would not reach 185k... (Off topic I know :P ).
Since 8.00am Saturday I have had no sign of packet loss, even my regular half-hourly blip has gone. What happened at 8.00?
(http://www.thinkbroadband.com/ping/share-thumb/9385968ecf938abe93f177e095992c38-01-03-2014.png)
Still loosing speed on weekday afternoons though.
Just lost ppp here, no idea why but back up and blazing along now. Most impressed.
Guess I spoke to soon, speeds a bit all over the show tonight and some nice red marks on the TBBQM's have been appearing as well. :( :shake:
My red marks (the TBBQM ones!) have all but gone.
It difficult to determine cause with the evening packet loss however we've at least 2 users here who have local exchange congestion, but I think late afternoon seems to have been solved at present.
Quote from: Steve on Mar 04, 2014, 22:00:31
It difficult to determine cause with the evening packet loss however we've at least 2 users here who have local exchange congestion, but I think late afternoon seems to have been solved at present.
They moved it to late evening instead, Steve. ;)
Quote from: colirv on Mar 04, 2014, 21:46:59
My red marks (the TBBQM ones!) have all but gone.
Even IDNets dedicated one shows last nights blip at 9:30pm ish.
Mine, to be fair, showed a small blip 9:30ish. But overall it's still better than it was.
Quote from: colirv on Mar 05, 2014, 09:54:24
Mine, to be fair, showed a small blip 9:30ish. But overall it's still better than it was.
Agreed but its still not right, if it effects internet usage that's bad. The fact the speeds were varying from 53-67 constantly meant it knocked me off online gaming and off video chat with my wife, for that I'm not impressed, especially when at weekends its fine...
Just as a matter of interest, if you're sync'ed at, say, 71, what sort of minimum speed would you expect to see?
Quote from: colirv on Mar 05, 2014, 10:30:19
Just as a matter of interest, if you're sync'ed at, say, 71, what sort of minimum speed would you expect to see?
Before the weirdness started if my profile was 71 I would see say 69Mbps at the moment my profile is 69.5 and I get 67-68Mbps ish that will remain steady all weekend and most of the day, but when these red stalactites grow it can yoyo down to 50Mbps at present, with my sync still at 69.5.
Quote from: colirv on Mar 05, 2014, 10:30:19
Just as a matter of interest, if you're sync'ed at, say, 71, what sort of minimum speed would you expect to see?
If you're sync'd at exactly 71Mbps then your IP profile will be 96.2% of that, ie 68.3Mbps and that's your maximum speed.
The minimum acceptable (by BT) speed is 80% of IP, ie 54.64Mbps.
The minimum that you might
expect to see is very much down to personal opinion ( :P ), but before this current kerfuffle I found IDNet could usually maintain more than 90% of IP.
Quote from: Bill on Mar 05, 2014, 13:31:55
If you're sync'd at exactly 71Mbps then your IP profile will be 96.2% of that, ie 68.3Mbps and that's your maximum speed.
The minimum acceptable (by BT) speed is 80% of IP, ie 54.64Mbps.
The minimum that you might expect to see is very much down to personal opinion ( :P ), but before this current kerfuffle I found IDNet could usually maintain more than 90% of IP.
If you multiply the profile sync you get on the BT speed test by 1.0.33 you get the sync rate that BTOR see as your maximum sync to the cab. so for me thats 71.7 so 72Mbps which is what it was when they installed it, 92.6% of that is 66.6 or 67 rounding up which is spot on pretty much. :)
Quote from: Bill on Mar 05, 2014, 13:31:55
If you're sync'd at exactly 71Mbps then your IP profile will be 96.2% of that, ie 68.3Mbps and that's your maximum speed.
The minimum acceptable (by BT) speed is 80% of IP, ie 54.64Mbps.
Now that's interesting. I did a BT test a few days ago. IP profile was 71.18, speed was 62.77 (via wifi) and the acceptable range was 40-71.18 - i.e. down to 56% of IP. Why might that be?
Quote from: colirv on Mar 06, 2014, 09:30:58... the acceptable range was 40-71.18 - i.e. down to 56% of IP. Why might that be?
Simple answer- dunno :dunno:
There are sometimes some oddities with that value- for a long time my minimum was 12Mbps, which was a hangover from the (fairly arbitrary) setting I had from the early days with a 40/10 service. Not sure when it changed.
40Mbps is suspicious... it sounds as though somebody thought "If he's getting a higher speed on 80/20 than he would have got on 40/10 then he shouldn't complain" :evil:
Quote from: Bill on Mar 06, 2014, 09:41:10
40Mbps is suspicious... it sounds as though somebody thought "If he's getting a higher speed on 80/20 than he would have got on 40/10 then he shouldn't complain".
As it happens, I was on 40/2 for 9 months before upgrading just before Xmas! I shall test again when I have a quiet moment and see what happens.
Quote from: colirv on Mar 06, 2014, 09:30:58
Now that's interesting. I did a BT test a few days ago. IP profile was 71.18, speed was 62.77 (via wifi) and the acceptable range was 40-71.18 - i.e. down to 56% of IP. Why might that be?
Speeds test via wifi are never a good move, you can get odd results sometimes, its always best to do them via a physical connection if possible.
I realise that, but TBH as long as the speed's above 60 and my allowance is 100GB my needs are met! I was just puzzled why 40 was deemed acceptable.
I think it just gives enough range for OpenReach either not to declare a fault or upgrade congested equipment
Put your details in here http://www.dslchecker.bt.com/
I did, and this was the result. It was an engineer install, so I assume the "Clean" figures apply. I'm none the wiser!
(http://www.colinandpat.co.uk/dslcheck.png)
http://www.ispreview.co.uk/index.php/2013/11/bt-wholesale-broadband-checker-adds-detail-fttc-speeds.html gives an explanation
According to BT, the term "Clean" relates to a line which is free from any wiring issues (i.e. in good condition) and the term "Impacted" relates to a line which may have wiring problems (e.g. poor extension wiring etc.).
Yes, the Thinkbroadband web site said exactly the same thing, and explained that the "Impacted" was really designed for the self-installs which are coming along - hence my assumption that the clean figures would apply in my case. I'm still none the wiser where the 40 Mbs came from.
Quote from: Glenn on Mar 06, 2014, 14:07:09
Put your details in here http://www.dslchecker.bt.com/
Hmm... when I put my number in there it says that FTTPoD is available ;D
But I don't think I'll bother.
If the cabinet is right outside the front door the install cost isn't massive because they charge the basic plus a per meter charge. I think I recently read that the costs (install and per month cost) are increasing a fair bit too in the not too distant future (if indeed they've not increased already)
Quote from: Lance on Mar 06, 2014, 17:53:49
If the cabinet is right outside the front door the install cost isn't massive
Unfortunately it's about 450m away... but that would be the least of the problems. I spent over ten grand last year having the front landscaped, getting an underground fibre across it to the house would be
seriously expensive!
Getting iffy after a good week!
(http://www.thinkbroadband.com/ping/share-thumb/17773a714d5786000e5218b663557317-06-03-2014.png) (http://www.thinkbroadband.com/ping/share/17773a714d5786000e5218b663557317-06-03-2014.html)
Another post from Adrian Kennard that might be worth reading....
http://revk.www.me.uk/2014/02/bt-21cn-not-fit-for-purpose.html (http://revk.www.me.uk/2014/02/bt-21cn-not-fit-for-purpose.html)
Those packet loss graphs at bottom look strangely familiar...
Yep Sobranie. It seems skittish again. :(
Quote from: Tacitus on Mar 06, 2014, 18:58:43
Another post from Adrian Kennard that might be worth reading....
http://revk.www.me.uk/2014/02/bt-21cn-not-fit-for-purpose.html (http://revk.www.me.uk/2014/02/bt-21cn-not-fit-for-purpose.html)
PS, sometimes silence is a good thing. As when it goes quiet, it's because real action is being taken. The kind they are not allowed to talk about...
with base ball bats... I mean strong words and legal departments. :whistle: ;D
QuoteAt the suggestion it was the SVLAN not the exchange I said "If you say it not the exchange it is the SVLAN, then that is the same thing - if the pipe to the exchange is getting full, then that is congestion at the exchange". I was told "no" and "but if you want to be stupid then I won't argue with you". These are the com
Wow. Way to miss the point Mr Chief Engineer. "The boat is sinking", "It's not a boat you idiot, it's a ship..." (Ship sinks due to chief engineer not taking note over a perceived error/technical difference).
There is a reason I use the tag "technical", as I jokingly know you can redefine many things. Redefining the location of a problem does not remove it, especially when your going from an "in" to an "out" connection and it's still on BT's own hardware. :slap:
Quote from: Bill on Mar 06, 2014, 19:08:14
Those packet loss graphs at bottom look strangely familiar...
I thought the interesting thing was that AAISP have been talking to other ISPs about the problem, which makes me wonder if Simon_idnet has been involved. Also the threat to move people to TalkTalk's wholesale network. I know that a while ago iDNet used Be, but since their demise I'm not sure which of the other wholesalers they're using
Quote from: Bill on Mar 06, 2014, 19:08:14
Those packet loss graphs at bottom look strangely familiar...
Indeed they do :rant2: Thankfully I'm not getting the same level of disconnections as I was a couple of weeks ago. The packet loss in the evenings is still quite dreadful and my latency increases ten fold but apart from a lot of video buffering my connection is almost usable.
Quote from: zappaDPJ on Mar 06, 2014, 21:05:06
Thankfully I'm not getting the same level of disconnections as I was a couple of weeks ago.
Liar liar pants on fire...
(http://www.thinkbroadband.com/ping/share-thumb/6f6695a5e6e54110a8cdb8e20d955d55-07-03-2014.png) (http://www.thinkbroadband.com/ping/share/6f6695a5e6e54110a8cdb8e20d955d55-07-03-2014.html)
::)
Quote from: sobranie on Mar 06, 2014, 18:54:43
Getting iffy after a good week!
(http://www.thinkbroadband.com/ping/share-thumb/17773a714d5786000e5218b663557317-06-03-2014.png) (http://www.thinkbroadband.com/ping/share/17773a714d5786000e5218b663557317-06-03-2014.html)
I noticed on a Zen graph some random packetloss too the other day. Seems getting off BT's backhaul would be advantageous for some fibre users as packetloss is creeping in more and more as FTTC uptake continues. Its bad when Talk Talks networks does not suffer it.
Yesterday I migrated to a provider that others in this thread have also joined.
First indications serves as a warning that the iDNet may not be the problem.
similar bleeding simply later:-
(http://www.thinkbroadband.com/ping/share-thumb/5a89698bf6a87e6769386473748f1aa1-08-03-2014.png)
awful speed:-
(http://www.thinkbroadband.com/speedtest/button/139422728465001763835.png)
as reflected by BT test at 9.26pm. :-
18.33 Mbps from my possible 68.75 Mbps be more helpful as to causes and solutions.
I think IDNet have currently solved their afternoon problem which I assume was related to heavy business use,the remaining issues I think are local exchange congestion occurring in the peak evening time for home users. The latter is obviously not ISP dependent and thankfully something I don't suffer from yet!
just checked mine and had this yesterday
Quote from: joe on Mar 08, 2014, 08:12:03
First indications serves as a warning that the iDNet may not be the problem.
An example of BT's competence wrt their own network:
BT say they can find no problems with my connection (I don't believe them, but that's a separate issue) and asked me log in to the speedtest domain and run the extended diagnostics.
Fait enough, if that's what their script says... except that the tests wouldn't run.
I won't detail what I tried, but eventually I had an idea- I logged in to the test domain again and tried pinging the test server.
"Host not found".
Log back in to IDNet and run the ping again- timeout.
In other words, BT can't even set up their own DNS servers properly :mad: :mad:
Which DNS were you using Bill at the time?
Quote from: Steve on Mar 08, 2014, 08:42:32
Which DNS were you using Bill at the time?
At which time?
In both cases, the one provided by the server I logged in to, so a BT one for the the speedtest domain and IDNet's for normal login.
Just that I couldn't get anywhere either from the test login, I guess it's broke.
I just tried something else... logged in to the test domain, then entered the IP address (from the ping) of the test server into Safari's address bar... that
still didn't work, it just sat there with a blank screen!
Quote from: Steve on Mar 08, 2014, 08:55:12I guess it's broke.
I hereby award you the trophy for the understatement of the decade.
Quote from: Steve on Mar 08, 2014, 08:29:31
I think IDNet have currently solved their afternoon problem which I assume was related to heavy business use,the remaining issues I think are local exchange congestion occurring in the peak evening time for home users. The latter is obviously not ISP dependent and thankfully something I don't suffer from yet!
If the info is correct, it may not be IDnet, but BT that's failing to "switch over" when lines are congested? IE, IDnet have the details forwarded to BT, but BTs system is buggy in implementing?
I've just realised why BT can't find any issues with my connection: their monitoring software probably doesn't work either :mad:
Quote from: Technical Ben on Mar 08, 2014, 09:30:03
If the info is correct, it may not be IDnet, but BT that's failing to "switch over" when lines are congested? IE, IDnet have the details forwarded to BT, but BTs system is buggy in implementing?
I think it's the same old problem, the local capacity whether it be exchange or street cabinet is congested prior to the IDNet hand off and until BT upgrade capacity those with evening issues will continue to suffer .
Quote from: Steve on Mar 08, 2014, 09:37:16
I think it's the same old problem, the local capacity whether it be exchange or street cabinet is congested prior to the IDNet hand off and until BT upgrade capacity those with evening issues will continue to suffer .
If BT would
admit that I'd be a bit happier, at least I'd know that there
was a problem and that they were aware of it. I accept that they can't increase capacity at a moment's notice.
But their reflexive denial that there's any problem is no use to anybody!
Quote from: Technical Ben on Mar 08, 2014, 09:30:03
If the info is correct, it may not be IDnet, but BT that's failing to "switch over" when lines are congested? IE, IDnet have the details forwarded to BT, but BTs system is buggy in implementing?
Which is much the same as Adrian Kennard is suggesting. It's not simply an iDNet problem but down to congestion and BT's network failing to adjust.
Quote from: Steve on Mar 08, 2014, 09:37:16
I think it's the same old problem, the local capacity whether it be exchange or street cabinet is congested prior to the IDNet hand off and until BT upgrade capacity those with evening issues will continue to suffer .
From the post on the blog though, it suggest the congestion is either virtual and/or after the exchange. The providers were getting the products (virtual or physical) from BT with adequate bandwidth, but seeing congestion like packet loss. When asking BT, BTs response was "the exchange is under capacity, not congested". Which, along with it only effecting some providers some of the time, suggests it's else where and BT are missing/passing by the real problem?
I was a little surprised that no one complained about the quality of their connection last night. Most, but not all, of IDNet's BQMs were atrocious. I wouldn't rule out that their was a major issue outside of IDNet's domain. It's hard for me to judge because my connection is permanently rotten, barely fit for purpose. It's been better since IDNet increased their capacity and rebalanced things but it's still unusable most evenings. That's obviously a problem within BT's domain but like Bill there's probably little that I can do about it.
It's all but put me out of business. Two thirds of our income comes via the Internet and I've been forced to rent office space to try and keep our heads above water. Needless to say I'm very unhappy with this situation.
I lost 3Mbps yesterday somehow, maybe crosstalk no drop showing in the logs, all I did was change my IDNet package. :dunno: seems like 64Mbps is now my max from 67Mbps. Guess thats the way of things but today my line is flying along, no issues last night either, Zap. It all seems very confusing. :-\
No additional spikes here on ASDL2+ (though I was getting the congestion during the winter Olympics), was fine last night (though as said I did get that one off spike along with everyone else earlier in the week). So is it back to just effecting FTTC in the main?
Quote from: zappaDPJ on Mar 08, 2014, 15:09:27
I was a little surprised that no one complained about the quality of their connection last night. Most, but not all, of IDNet's BQMs were atrocious.
I didn't complain because my BQM was fine. Virtually no packet loss at all.
awful speeds at the moment, and the red curtain has one again descended :mad:.
Same here, it's setting in early today >:(
Not yet as bad as last night- one speed test was just over 8Mbps :bawl:
Quote from: Bill on Mar 11, 2014, 12:49:38
Same here, it's setting in early today >:(
Not yet as bad as last night- one speed test was just over 8Mbps :bawl:
Makes you wonder whats going to happen at 5:30pm then. So sick of this.
The original post has been deleted, this thread relates to the title. Should anyone wish to comment further re the benefits or disadvantages of an alternative ISP please start a new thread or comment elsewhere!
The red curtain continues, what's going on, anyone from IDnet have an answer?
Just had a disconnect-reconnect for no very obvious reason... maybe it will improve now :dunno: :fingers:
It seems like your packet loss bill has gone after that, maybe on another pipe now?
Whatever it was I don't like it- BT speedtest shows my IP profile has dropped from 64.91Mbps to 52.27Mbps.
I suspect BT have decided it might be one way to sort out the problem on my line :mad: :mad:
Would it not be better to have a stable, if slightly slower, connection, though, if that is the case?
Quote from: Simon on Mar 11, 2014, 14:46:55
Would it not be better to have a stable, if slightly slower, connection, though, if that is the case?
Possibly...
IF the evening packet loss has gone, I'm reserving judgement until I see.
In terms of disconnections it was perfectly stable anyway, that's the first I can remember for several months.
Quote from: Bill on Mar 11, 2014, 14:53:12
Possibly... IF the evening packet loss has gone, I'm reserving judgement until I see.
In terms of disconnections it was perfectly stable anyway, that's the first I can remember for several months.
FTTC is a weird thing... my line can be stable for months and then one day it'll have a mental and have loads of disconnects, drop my profile and then be fine.. then I have to wait months for the profile to sort itself out... then it all happens again :laugh:
Further post removed. It is known this is an IDNet only issue, except for Bill and Zap who have the double whammy of cabinet/exchange congestion. As Steve said above, any posts discussing alternative ISPs should be in a new thread.
No discussion is going to be entered into on this and further posts will be deleted without explanation.
Quote from: psp83 on Mar 11, 2014, 15:02:48
FTTC is a weird thing... my line can be stable for months and then one day it'll have a mental and have loads of disconnects, drop my profile and then be fine.. then I have to wait months for the profile to sort itself out... then it all happens again :laugh:
That it is, mind you cross talk plays a part too Paul. DLM is not as nasty as it was with adsl 2 though.
Quote from: Bill on Mar 11, 2014, 14:44:33
Whatever it was I don't like it- BT speedtest shows my IP profile has dropped from 64.91Mbps to 52.27Mbps.
I suspect BT have decided it might be one way to sort out the problem on my line :mad: :mad:
Normally FTTC DLM acts in the small hours I thought, not generally during the day although I could be wrong. The drop could have been caused by something else possibly, I had one the other day for no reason as well but DLM stayed as it was. Back to today its a mess, and if IDNet says its because of iOS 7.1 ill tear my hair out, as they should have the capacity to cope with these things
Quote from: Gary on Mar 11, 2014, 15:16:51DLM is not as nasty as it was with adsl 2 though.
That's certainly true, and if you hadn't also reported packet loss I'd probably have put this down to some local noise source causing a resync and waited for it to recover.
But I wouldn't trust BT not to over-ride the DLM because it's easier than looking for a real fault elsewhere...
Quote from: Bill on Mar 11, 2014, 15:25:51
But I wouldn't trust BT not to over-ride the DLM because it's easier than looking for a real fault elsewhere...
Attainable rate seems to be slipping a bit if you use the wholesale checker, well it is for me. Maybe BTW's way of 'fixing' things all round by dropping peoples sync speeds.
Wouldn't surprise me :(
Well it doesn't seem to have any effect on the evening latency increase- yellow building up as normal :(
I might try forcing a re-sync tomorrow morning just to see what happens- with a 52Mbps IP I'm not much better off than with a 40/10 connection, so it's unlikely to do much harm.
Quote from: Bill on Mar 11, 2014, 16:58:21
Well it doesn't seem to have any effect on the evening latency increase- yellow building up as normal :(
I might try forcing a re-sync tomorrow morning just to see what happens- with a 52Mbps IP I'm not much better off than with a 40/10 connection, so it's unlikely to do much harm.
I did notice your BQM looking particularly dreadful last night Bill, even worse than mine. It's also becoming pretty obvious to me that local congestion plus further congestion with IDNet's network like we have today gives you problems far greater than the sum of its parts. Or to put it another way, my connection is totally ***** just now :mad:
My connection was atrocious last night. It was pretty much stalling for up to four minutes at a time with nothing loading. It kicked me out of Second Life and booted me from my IM client, then it would remember it was supposed to be an internet connection and start working again. This happened on and off for about two hours until I gave up and went to bed at about 9pm. Today, though, I'm back to the intermittent packet loss of earlier in this thread :-\
(http://www.thinkbroadband.com/ping/share-thumb/9854b6920ec8bd1585799baf21597fcb-11-03-2014.png)
Quote from: Reya on Mar 11, 2014, 18:04:25
My connection was atrocious last night. It was pretty much stalling for up to four minutes at a time with nothing loading. It kicked me out of Second Life and booted me from my IM client, then it would remember it was supposed to be an internet connection and start working again. This happened on and off for about two hours until I gave up and went to bed at about 9pm. Today, though, I'm back to the intermittent packet loss of earlier in this thread :-\
(http://www.thinkbroadband.com/ping/share-thumb/9854b6920ec8bd1585799baf21597fcb-11-03-2014.png)
That might expalin why I could lot get onto the PSN network on my PS4 :-\
Oh dear, why am I not surprised!!
(http://www.thinkbroadband.com/ping/share-thumb/72061cdbb60b32cee64bd969f76de66b-11-03-2014.png) (http://www.thinkbroadband.com/ping/share/72061cdbb60b32cee64bd969f76de66b-11-03-2014.html)
Aaaaand the 4-minute long stall-outs have just begun again. *sigh* I'm getting up to 20% packet loss, same pattern and same time as last night. Nothing loading, streaming music an impossibility. At least I'm still in Second Life (*peeks to check*) - for the moment.
Oh, wait. The Winter Paralympics are on now, aren't they? :slap: ;D
All ok here at the moment, Reya... have not checked logging in on my PS4 yet :fingers:
No such problems here in West Sussex.
I'm currently getting 1.89 Mbps downstream (BT speed test) on an 80/20 FTTC connection with 24% packet loss. I am very close to banning myself from these forums :mad:
I had a little packet loss tonight (a different ISP) so it might be a BT problem somewhere that's also not helping IDnet's own problems.
Maybe this is not helping things : http://status.aa.net.uk/1902
OTOH Have a look at 'milvus' post here:
http://forums.thinkbroadband.com/otherisp/4311439-coms-occasional-packet-loss.html#Post4311439
Now, that's what I call a problem!!!
(http://cust120-dsl53.idnet.net/~billford/images/Tues.png)
:bawl:
On and off small packet loss here too on ASDL2+. :/
and more sites not loading again.
??? Something's going on . . . Zen reports for much of this week: "total outage while line cards reload new code. Upgrade is designed to minimise down time by upgrading seperately the SRP cards. See staged plan." Have dropped synch speed by a few Meg too.
It won't cure the packet loss I'm sure, but what's this "staged plan" about? Presumably the ISPs have access. To what end?
Quote from: mervl on Mar 12, 2014, 12:09:55
??? Something's going on . . . Zen reports for much of this week: "total outage while line cards reload new code. Upgrade is designed to minimise down time by upgrading seperately the SRP cards. See staged plan." Have dropped synch speed by a few Meg too.
It won't cure the packet loss I'm sure, but what's this "staged plan" about? Presumably the ISPs have access. To what end?
Got a link to this, Mervl?
Looks like more maintenance for my exchange (Bosham) coming up on the 18th. Wonder if I'll get some of my speed back...
As part of BT?s ongoing capacity activities, which maintains best possible customer service, the following exchanges will be impacted by change ( BIRMINGHAM - Stow-on-the-Wold and Druids Heath, BRISTOL - Torquay, CARDIFF - Henbury and Cross Hands, GLASGOW - East Kilbride, GUILDFORD - Chartham Canterbury and Bosham and Dover). The capacity work in question is (SVLAN moves for capacity - programme number 6) within the exchange to move service from a heavily loaded device to one with spare capacity. There will be one service outage to End-Users of approximately 60 minutes within the period 00:01 - 06:00.
They're up to something... for my area code:
QuoteStart: 13/03/2014 00:01
Cleared: 13/03/2014 06:00
Duration: 5 Hours 59 Minutes
Message: The Planned Engineering Work is required on the Broadband Nodes within the (Oxford) region that support EU's nationwide for completion of (upgrade of EEA from a 200G TO 500G chassis). There will be (one) service outage to End-Users of approximately (40) minutes (total) within this period. This outage(s) will occur during the outage window of (02:00:00 - 06:00:00) within this PEW Window. A list of your end users affected is attached to this notification this could be WBC, WBMC and/or HE services. Details of your end users for WBC and WBMC will also be available on Broadband Customer Reporting (BBCR). Please note it may take up to a maximum of 48 hours for the affected circuits to appear on BBCR.
Area Codes:
Whatever 200G and 500G chassis are :dunno:
(Forced a re-sync this morning and got about 6Mps back, another 6 to go :P )
Stop press: Just had a call from support- BT have found a congestion issue on my exchange and are investigating! Better late than never, though they say it won't be a quick solution (there's a surprise). But at least they've acknowledged a problem exists :clap1:
Quote from: Gary on Mar 12, 2014, 12:18:47
Got a link to this, Mervl?
It came up on the Zen Broadband status for a few dozen East Anglian exchanges under ref PW236134 as tonight's work following on from work the previous couple of days. But just seemed to me it might refer to something wider with the reference to a "plan" and perhaps IDNet might know something, or be able to find out? From previous experience we're on Stepney Green PoP and that seems to come out early on planned upgrades, maybe because it serves East London, which is supposed to be some sort of "silicon valley" isn't it? (Not my locality, though - we're more like some impoverished Bangladeshi delta!).
Quote from: Bill on Mar 12, 2014, 13:12:20
Whatever 200G and 500G chassis are :dunno:
I believe they are server racks.
Sounds possible... next thing is to wonder what they're going to put in them, let's hope the "G" stands for "Giga" :P
And, 6:30pm for the third night running the pauses begin YET AGAIN. I'm getting sick of this. Like before, it lasts for four minutes (I'm timing it). It's just come back (hence this page finally loads so I can make the post) and after about 10 seconds it stops, then stutters up again, then stops again. I can't stream anything, I can't chat in IM, I can't stay logged in to games. This is getting to be really bloody frustrating. The one time when I get to relax online, and NOTHING WORKS! :bawl:
(http://www.thinkbroadband.com/ping/share-thumb/df30ee80895a4b25ca517d015574e188-12-03-2014.png)
Edited to add: I've checked my exchange and it's green, so all OK. There was a brief fault last night at around midnight (hence the big spike then) but nothing else listed at all.
I woukd not rely on those exchange summaries. They are not always that accurate and sometimes exchanges become congested between dates shown. My exchange shows green but I doubt it is if we are having work done fir capacity :slap:
I'm going to call Support tomorrow. Traceroutes seem to be hanging at the third hop, as they hit an IP that (on running a WHOIS) is IDnet's, after it's run through hop #2 at telehouse-gw3 (etc).
This is the third night running, and it's making me tear my hair out. The wierd thing is, the router shows green. Sometimes I'm not even kicked off Second Life (which usually boots me if I have a power blip, for example). Everything just... stops. Nothing works, nothing loads, no textures rez in SL, instant messages back up, and then - after 4 minutes - it all starts up again (and I get a stream of 20 IMs all coming through at once). And this goes on for the next hour or so. Streaming music is impossible once it begins.
Knowing my luck it'll be something Support can't do anything about, like my neighbour firing up some dodgy old Sky box that causes a lot of line noise :-\
Does your heating or anything come on at that time? If it's that specific and precise, I would guess that points to something local. :dunno:
Nothing in my house, nope. It's not dead on 6:30pm each night, but guaranteed by 7pm each night it's begun (hence my joke earlier in the thread about the winter Paralympics!)
Monday it began at 7pm and went on until about 9pm.
(http://www.thinkbroadband.com/ping/share-thumb/d33af2f1e46cd200d646e5b72be9f6f3-10-03-2014.png)
Tuesday, well that was a washout in general from about lunchtime, but it began (noticably, to me) at about 7:30pm and lasted until 10-ish:
(http://www.thinkbroadband.com/ping/share-thumb/9854b6920ec8bd1585799baf21597fcb-11-03-2014.png)
And tonight it began (again, noticably) at 6:30pm and is still ongoing at almost 8pm.
(http://www.thinkbroadband.com/ping/share-thumb/df30ee80895a4b25ca517d015574e188-12-03-2014.png)
I dont normally get it as bad as some but have noticed some loss at same times and my speed is way down tonight >:(
This has been on going for a while now hasnt it....beginning of Dec this thread was started
Similar probs here and speed has dropped from around 75 to mid 20's.
(http://www.thinkbroadband.com/ping/share-thumb/64bb8b46787725d5f310f39b7476e685-12-03-2014.png) (http://www.thinkbroadband.com/ping/share/64bb8b46787725d5f310f39b7476e685-12-03-2014.html)
Mine was fine last night :dunno:
I have more work on the 19th now :( Same thing Mervl was on about Start: 19/03/2014 02:00
Cleared: 19/03/2014 06:00
Duration: 4 Hours
Message: total outage while line cards reload new code. Upgrade is designed to minimise down time by upgrading seperately the SRP cards. See staged plan.
Area Codes: 01243 01273 01293 01342 01403 01444 01730 01737 01883 02392
Clear tonight, but had spikes last night. Ever so slight loss every 15 mins to half hour (varies) through out the day, which is strange.
(http://www.thinkbroadband.com/ping/share-thumb/e85e485dfd7fc91ceca229aa0b52230c-13-03-2014.png) (http://www.thinkbroadband.com/ping/share/e85e485dfd7fc91ceca229aa0b52230c-13-03-2014.html)
Quote from: Gary on Mar 13, 2014, 08:04:45
I have more work on the 19th now :( Same thing Mervl was on about Start: 19/03/2014 02:00
Cleared: 19/03/2014 06:00
Duration: 4 Hours
Message: total outage while line cards reload new code. Upgrade is designed to minimise down time by upgrading seperately the SRP cards. See staged plan.
Area Codes: 01243 01273 01293 01342 01403 01444 01730 01737 01883 02392
Yep we had it over 4 nights but only lost service for a couple of minutes one night so it's obviously done in sequence.
BT have at last admitted to us that they are seeing congestion in parts of their network. They say that they have a dedicated team tasked with investigating reports. Which all rather confirms our suspision that this seems to be a reactive process rather than an automated proactive alert-driven (by monitoring systems) process.
The problems mostly appear to be in saturated SVLANs which link a cabinet to an Exchange. There may be one or more fibre cards in a cabinet that are grouped together into an SVLAN which then links back to the Exchange. So, the symptoms may affect some customers on a single cabinet but no others (on the same cabinet). BT will not give us visibility as to which customers are on which SVLAN :(
Thanks Simon :thumb:
Quote from: Simon_idnet on Mar 14, 2014, 10:34:37There may be one or more fibre cards in a cabinet that are grouped together into an SVLAN which then links back to the Exchange. So, the symptoms may affect some customers on a single cabinet but no others (on the same cabinet).
That would suggest that a planned multiple "lift and shift" at the cabinet level, to spread those affected between the groups, could at least ameliorate it?
Whether BT will bother is a different matter of course.
What happens though if the fibre optics from the cabinets are congested perhaps that does that not happen, if it does that sounds expensive.
Quote from: Steve on Mar 14, 2014, 11:22:08
What happens though if the fibre optics from the cabinets are congested perhaps that does that not happen, if it does that sounds expensive.
I'd have thought that was one of the easier problems to solve- all the ducting and pipework is in place to blow another fibre through. OK, it may need another box in the cabinet to feed the new fibre but they shouldn't be inordinately expensive.
Thanks Bill , I did wonder whether that was a very time consuming job involving multiple vans, multiple road side conferences and of course tea breaks. >:D
It would still probably involve all that anyway :P
Thanks Simon.
QuoteThe problems mostly appear to be in saturated SVLANs which link a cabinet to an Exchange.
As you say, that makes a lot more sense. Hence why those on FTTC (no idea if it effects us on ASDL) were seeing very varied results, that did not seem to correlate to the info we (and you) have at hand.
Wonderful how BT cloak and dagger all the important stuff, while saying "all is good". :shake:
As I've said before, and I'll say again, I left BT when they "upgraded and improved" our connection to "not show you your bandwidth use" and "manage it automatically". With a download limit, that's asking for miss communication purely to get away with charging extra/providing less. I don't care if they now allow users to see bandwidth use, if they have not changed their internal behaviour, that's dreadful.
Well at least they've said something I guess.
I had two drops about 7pm last night and that has knocked my latency back up and speed down a tad :( just when it had improved a bit too
Quote from: Simon_idnet on Mar 14, 2014, 10:34:37
BT have at last admitted to us that they are seeing congestion in parts of their network.
Which is pretty much what Adrian Kennard was saying. IOW, the problem was not with iDNet's network.
Quote from: Baz on Mar 14, 2014, 13:50:56
I had two drops about 7pm last night and that has knocked my latency back up and speed down a tad :( just when it had improved a bit too
>:( another two drops tonight within 10mins of each other and latency gone up some more and speed down
I think I might print out today's BQM and frame it... I daren't run a speed test :eek4:
(http://www.thinkbroadband.com/ping/share-thumb/ebd26abff514bbc77612e8b11cb59cab-14-03-2014.png) (http://www.thinkbroadband.com/ping/share/ebd26abff514bbc77612e8b11cb59cab-14-03-2014.html)
Quote from: Baz on Mar 14, 2014, 20:20:35
>:( another two drops tonight within 10mins of each other and latency gone up some more and speed down
Someone please correct me if I'm being thicker than usual, but I don't see why congestion should cause a sync drop (if that's what you're referring to), and it would only cause a drop in PPP if it got so bad the router couldn't communicate with the authentication server. Wouldn't it?
And that wouldn't affect speed or latency. Sounds more like interference from something switching on (or off) at the same time each day.
well someone just tell me something as ive totally lost track of whats going on now.I dont know what it is.Did I say it was congestion? is that what it is, how can you tell if your exchange is congested.Do BT tell your ISP who then tell you?
Its not the same time each day or every day.
I agree Bill loss of sync is not a congestion issue. So Baz if you want to start a new thread with routers stats etc please do so.
Quote from: Bill on Mar 14, 2014, 20:55:37
I think I might print out today's BQM and frame it... I daren't run a speed test :eek4:
(http://www.thinkbroadband.com/ping/share-thumb/ebd26abff514bbc77612e8b11cb59cab-14-03-2014.png) (http://www.thinkbroadband.com/ping/share/ebd26abff514bbc77612e8b11cb59cab-14-03-2014.html)
I certainly can't compete with that!
(http://www.thinkbroadband.com/ping/share-thumb/77e80b6a88ecfd001ff2fbb30a419572-14-03-2014.png) (http://www.thinkbroadband.com/ping/share/77e80b6a88ecfd001ff2fbb30a419572-14-03-2014.html)
Quote from: Steve on Mar 14, 2014, 22:02:33
I agree Bill loss of sync is not a congestion issue. So Baz if you want to start a new thread with routers stats etc please do so.
OK if you think it needs a new thread but what is the difference between loss of sync and small packet loss...this thread...which do I have and how do you know.Thats all Im asking.
I could also start a thread about ducting,pipework,multiple vans,roadside conferences and lots of tea breaks eh ;)
If it is exchange congestion wouldn't that be the same whichever ISP you were with?
Having now left iDNet I don't see the same packet loss/speed drop with the new provider. Is that coincidental? BT have been doing some card upgrading on my exchange (01277) in recent days.
(http://www.thinkbroadband.com/ping/share-thumb/c800f1f325c8e6d902bfd0e202a78533-14-03-2014.png)
Good points Joe.It will of been mentioned already somewhere in this thread, I dont know the answer though,wish I did.my latest graph.
Quote from: joe on Mar 15, 2014, 08:01:38
If it is exchange congestion wouldn't that be the same whichever ISP you were with?
Having now left iDNet I don't see the same packet loss/speed drop with the new provider. Is that coincidental? BT have been doing some card upgrading on my exchange (01277) in recent days.
(http://www.thinkbroadband.com/ping/share-thumb/c800f1f325c8e6d902bfd0e202a78533-14-03-2014.png)
Monday and Tuesday is the line card work and also work on a congested svlan in my village's exchange for more capacity, if this cr@p continues after that I think something else is going on, and I really doubt its congestion at the cab in my village.
Quote from: joe on Mar 15, 2014, 08:01:38
If it is exchange congestion wouldn't that be the same whichever ISP you were with?
Yes, unless the new ISP were LLU of course, but that's not currently an option with FTTC.
If the congestion is at the
cabinet (see Simon's post (http://www.idnetters.co.uk/forums/index.php/topic,31600.msg728451.html#msg728451)) then I'm not sure, I don't know how SVLANs are organised. I suspect it's still true.
Then there's the situation where the fibre from a cabinet doesn't go back the the same exchange as the copper (a sort of fibre LLU within BT), so it would be possible to have congestion at one but not the other, and switching between ADSL and VDSL (in either direction) could either introduce or clear congestion... or have no effect.
It's impossible to predict without details of the SVLANs and what goes where, and BT aren't parting with that information :(
Quote from: Bill on Mar 15, 2014, 09:15:29
Yes, unless the new ISP were LLU of course, but that's not currently an option with FTTC.
If the congestion is at the cabinet (see Simon's post (http://www.idnetters.co.uk/forums/index.php/topic,31600.msg728451.html#msg728451)) then I'm not sure, I don't know how SVLANs are organised. I suspect it's still true.
Then there's the situation where the fibre from a cabinet doesn't go back the the same exchange as the copper (a sort of fibre LLU within BT), so it would be possible to have congestion at one but not the other, and switching between ADSL and VDSL (in either direction) could either introduce or clear congestion...
It's impossible to predict without details of the SVLANs and what goes where, and BT aren't parting with that information :(
Im not sure about congestion at the cab, Bill. As I see it that's unlikely, you cant fit more connections into a line card than its designed to take, when BTOR are out of room no more capacity is available and BTW stop showing FTTC as available, and at a later point they may install a new cab for more connections, but for congestion at the cab everyone would have to be using a hell of a lot of data all at once and I cant see that as likely tbh. Exchanges get congested, line cards fail and they can run out of ports but to have congestion at a cab seems to me unlikely since they don't typically install capacity for 100% of the lines connected to a PCP anyway. They tend to install a cabinet to supply approximately 50% of the lines available.
Quote from: Gary on Mar 15, 2014, 09:24:17
Im not sure about congestion at the cab, Bill. As I see it that's unlikely, you cant fit more connections into a line card than its designed to take
The line cards may not be saturated, but the SVLANs they're part of may be:
Quote from: Simon_idnet on Mar 14, 2014, 10:34:37
The problems mostly appear to be in saturated SVLANs which link a cabinet to an Exchange. There may be one or more fibre cards in a cabinet that are grouped together into an SVLAN which then links back to the Exchange.
Quote from: joe on Mar 15, 2014, 08:01:38
If it is exchange congestion wouldn't that be the same whichever ISP you were with?
Having now left iDNet I don't see the same packet loss/speed drop with the new provider. Is that coincidental? BT have been doing some card upgrading on my exchange (01277) in recent days.
(http://www.thinkbroadband.com/ping/share-thumb/c800f1f325c8e6d902bfd0e202a78533-14-03-2014.png)
I'm on an 01245 exchange with IDNet FTTC and have had no packet loss showing on TBBQM over the last 24 hours too, and this week has had hardly any throughout. I've also had the card reprogramming. I assume in Essex we're both on the Stepney Green PoP (unless you don't have BT Wholesale backhaul) which had a fair few upgrades (presumably for the Olympics a few years ago) - and which itself has several gateways, not all of which will have any problems at the same time. It all makes me think that it's regional/exchange based which is consistent too with the BT troubleshooting approach. And as IDNet explained if the SVLAN is saturated then different people may have different experiences on the same exchange - and BT don't reveal who is on what SVLAN, or the criteria. It means some people suffer horribly, but that's the mend and make do way we do things in this country because we're all addicted to cheap, cheap, cheap.
And BT are a private company so nothing obliges them to reveal their confidential business operations any more than you and I our secrets. Try asking Tesco for how they make up their prices or for copies of their contracts with their suppliers or do any of you hand over all your business knowledge to your customers on request so they can save paying you for the job?
Quote from: Bill on Mar 15, 2014, 09:30:24
The line cards may not be saturated, but the SVLANs they're part of may be:
So that means that every idnet user showing packetloss is connected to a congested svlan and it all started on the same date for everyone last year which was first blamed on an Apple update, but moving to another ISP corrects this :eyebrow: Packet loss will show on all ISP's at some point but none are as bad as IDNet which has had this issue to a much greater extent, which kinda puts this svlan idea out the window a bit, Mervl :dunno: It will be interesting to see what happens after the work on the line cards and svlan for myself next week.
The explanation given by Simon agrees with what little direct evidence I can get (and, tbh, gut feeling), with what I've seen on BQMs from other ISPs and reports from AAISP... they could all be wrong and I could solve my problems at a stroke by migrating.
But I don't think the likelihood is very high and I'm not prepared to take the chance.
Your situation may be different to mine of course, and you must make your own decisions.
Not saying Gary that's it's all the same problem over time and for everyone. IDNet have increased the capacity of their links in the meantime. Do you know that was unnecessary and made no difference rather than just dealing with "only part of the problem"? The whole thing is so complex that we're chasing shadows. BT and IDNet too, possibly. I was referring really to the last 24 hours and the recent history over the last few weeks. Even the reprogramming might help some but not others. Congestion, as with the road network which always seems a good analogy to me, covers many sins. (And in a similar way it's the "junctions" (aggregation nodes) that are always the weakest link). Same with a breakdown, too!
EDIT I suspect that the "boots on the ground" at BT have a very good idea of the what needs to be done, but that's very different from "proving it" to the management and getting the budget from the even more remote accountants. Surely something that none of us can say we've never encountered? As I said in my earlier post, Welcome to the UK.
Quote from: Bill on Mar 15, 2014, 09:50:46
Your situation may be different to mine of course, and you must make your own decisions.
I have just seen so many different reasons for the issues, Bill. After a while it wears thin. If the work here next weeks corrects this then fair enough. I still think alot of this is down to size of ISP and the capacity it can actually afford. As I said seeing what this work does next week will be interesting, and maybe will cure this problem or at least help mitigate it
Quote from: Gary on Mar 15, 2014, 09:57:33
I have just seen so many different reasons for the issues, Bill.
Fair enough, but there's no law that says problems can only occur one at a time.. in fact there's one that states the opposite (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sod's_law) :P
Quote from: mervl on Mar 15, 2014, 09:54:35
Not saying Gary that's it's all the same problem over time and for everyone. IDNet have increased the capacity of their links in the meantime.
They increased bandwidth, which you can buy in and then rent out when not needed to help the cashflow, they didn't say they had new pipes just more bandwidth, but who knows really what they have. AAISP seem more transparent in talking about that so it makes it easier to judge what's going on. As you say who really knows, and its a very complex issue and we are not privy to all the info. Its time to watch and see what happens yet again, and that's all anyone can really do.
My understanding is that there were two issues which unfortunately coincided. IDNet had capacity issues which peaked at certain times of the day, then there was the now disclosed BT issue as well. Doesn't it therefore follow that the two issues when coupled together, would have more of an impact on IDNet networks than any others, and that IDNet's own issues could have been 'masking' the general BT capacity issues?
We are now seeing less problems for the majority on IDNet's networks (that post here), but similar issues are starting to show up with other ISPs. To me, that indicates that whilst IDNet have sorted their own capacity issues (or, possibly, are still in the process of doing so), the ongoing BT issues remain, and there is little that IDNet, or any other ISP using BT's networks, can do about that.
I'll get me coat... :out:
Quote from: Gary on Mar 15, 2014, 10:07:42they didn't say they had new pipes just more bandwidth,
I don't think the concept of "pipes" applies to 21CN, I've always pictured it as more analogous to "quotas".
Quote from: Bill on Mar 15, 2014, 10:01:35
Fair enough, but there's no law that says problems can only occur one at a time.. in fact there's one that states the opposite (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sod's_law) :P
True bill, but if all this is a set of different issues manifesting as the same type of problem, IDnet have to be the unluckiest ISP on the block right now. Here's hoping it will mellow out...
Quote from: Bill on Mar 15, 2014, 10:10:48
I don't think the concept of "pipes" applies to 21CN, I've always pictured it as more analogous to "quotas".
AAISP if you read had new hostlinks. I guess you can have all the bandwidth you want but if you cant pass it though your network without a bottleneck its no good to anyone.
"We are pleased to confirm that we are extending the links to BT for broadband to a third gigabit hostlink. This means we will actually have six gigabit fibres to them allowing lots of headroom and redundancy. This should be seamless to customers but the LNSs known as "A", "B", "C", and "D" will have a new "E" and "F" added and we will run 5 of the 6 LNSs as "live" and one backup"
On that note im off to see if the fogs cleared from outside, and from my head, and maybe have another coffee too ;)
Well its been a very quite no nasty red curtain (for me) weekend so far. I guess everyone was also taking advantage of the springlike weather. Never seen the TBBQM's so clear.
Well, quiet as a whisper here and nothing more than local interruptions. :)
TBB shows mine as having 8 drops since 8pm friday night and still the rest of today to go :(
Baz, as Steve said the other day, yours is most likely local sync/faulty connection issue not related to this ongoing problem, have you reported it yet?
Quote from: Baz on Mar 16, 2014, 14:45:56
TBB shows mine as having 8 drops since 8pm friday night and still the rest of today to go :(
Make sure your router is ok, no harm in re-flashing it with the latest firmware if need be (only as a last resort) or try another router if possible. Also try plugging into the test socket etc etc you know the normal routine, and see if its your equipment, its what support will ask anyway. If not it may well be a local fault but rule out your faceplate and cables as well, as they can get dodgy after a while as well.
Quote from: Gary on Mar 16, 2014, 11:44:06
Well its been a very quite no nasty red curtain (for me) weekend so far. I guess everyone was also taking advantage of the springlike weather. Never seen the TBBQM's so clear.
Mine was exactly the same as usual :(
The repeatability of mine, particularly wrt the timings and the way it drops off quite abruptly around midnight, makes me think it's probably one or more pubs, clubs etc which turn on their hi-def BT Sport streams or whatever when the customers start to turn up and leave them running until chucking out time. Or something like that.
Perhaps your best solution is to go to the pub, Bill! ;)
Quote from: Glenn on Mar 16, 2014, 15:48:04
Baz, as Steve said the other day, yours is most likely local sync/faulty connection issue not related to this ongoing problem, have you reported it yet?
Why is it that Steve and not the same as others are getting? whats the difference with what im getting and every one else,I dont follow.
No I havent reported it yet was hoping it would be corrected by whatever IDNet said they were doing.
Gary...Yeah I will check those out soon but feel ok that its not them,of course I could be wrong.All the other times Ive gone through that routine it has ended up just the same results and faceplates ive changed have been ok, but yeah just for elimination you're right
Baz,
From what you are saying it is your connection dropping between you and the exchange. This thread is for those who have a connection, but are seeing packet loss/increased latency on it.
The difference is your issue may need new equipment/engineer visit/further investigation. The packet loss issue is due to network configurations and capacity.
The problem too is the way things are handled within BT. Not BT's fault but at the insistence of the regulator, Ofcom.
The "local loop" between us end users and the exchange (or cabinet for FTTC data, not voice) is managed and maintained by the OpenReach division. The exchange/fibre cabs and BT backhaul between the exchange and the handover points to IDNet are the responsibility of BT Wholesale, a different division. That's why you need to speak to IDNet, so they get the right people involved for your issue.
The issue in this thread is the same or similar for many people across different exchanges and cabinets. So we're as certain as we can be that it's a BT Wholesale issue, and/or one for IDNet's network. Where you have more or a different problem from others that is a strong indicator that a problem may be in your local loop or at the DSLAM, once you are sure it's not your own equipment or internal wiring that's faulty which can normally be checked by directly connecting a connected PC to the test socket (or BT VDSL "OpenReach" modem), where BT's responsibility ends.
After last weeks work on the regional network, things seem to have settled down to a weekday 10am-10pm minor 1% packet loss showing on TBBQM, with no significant effect on use. (Doesn't happen at weekends so I put it down to network rather than the router). My non-IDNet service shows absolutely none, though. Could just be down to busy busy IDNet, I suppose; which perhaps means they're doing good business, commercially. ;D
Quote from: mervl on Mar 18, 2014, 09:45:32
My non-IDNet service shows absolutely none, though. Could just be down to busy busy IDNet, I suppose; which perhaps means they're doing good business, commercially. ;D
Or dont have enough hostlinks. But I could and probably am way off. Second part of that work you had is happening here tonight, so it will be interesting to see if things become better. Exchange congestion work was last night. The last few days seem to have been ok, although IDnet still show more packet loss on their networks than others, but is that purely down to their size? Who knows. :dunno:
My TBB speed test looks much healthier since the work last night, and TBB has the link to Rev K's rant on packetloss on the front page. The continued packetloss being seen by some providers is not getting better at all, and reading into it I doubt it will as the take up of services like BT vision continue :(
'The problem appears to be affecting multiple broadband providers, and is not consistent across the United Kingdom. We all know that broadband usage is climbing rapidly as more people switch to OTT TV platforms for their viewing, but as the billing on the WBC network is based around the peak utilisation it is in the interest of BT Wholesale to carry as much traffic as possible, rather than allow congestion'
http://www.thinkbroadband.com/news/6360-no-sign-yet-of-bt-wholesale-congestion-improving.html
There's an interesting comment on TBB forums from a rep for another (big) ISP (nameless, but not a million miles away from BT) tonight:
BTW now provide us with a list of which customers are on which SVLAN within the BTW network so our quality monitoring can now look for congestion down at the SVLAN level.
Should IDNet tackle this point again?? Might be less useful though as they (presumably) have many less customers for comparison.
It does look like BT are being busy with upgrades lately..
Start: 25/03/2014 02:01
Cleared: 25/03/2014 06:00
Duration: 3 Hours 58 Minutes
Message: This Planned Engineering Work is required on the 21C Network within the (Devizes) region for (capacity upgrades).
Area Codes: 01225 01380 01706
Do excuse the odd look, its because I'm using a Mac and users of Firefox and Safari see slow speeds on the 'TBB' download figures because of flash in these browsers. I wont download Chrome just for a speedtest, so the results are abit odd but give the general impression. So apart from the drop in speed a few weeks back, things are looking ok at the moment.
(http://www.thinkbroadband.com/speedtest/button/139522208873161820287.png)
Quote from: mervl on Mar 18, 2014, 21:55:57
There's an interesting comment on TBB forums from a rep for another (big) ISP (nameless, but not a million miles away from BT) tonight:
BTW now provide us with a list of which customers are on which SVLAN within the BTW network so our quality monitoring can now look for congestion down at the SVLAN level.
And for my exchange:
QuoteBT already have case open at Didcot for degraded service, I've added the affected Plusnet customers to the case to help, we can definitely see problems on 3 SVLANs, a 4th shows up on the SVLAN status report as being upgraded and a 5th could be affected but we don't have enough customers on that one to be 100% certain.
Link (http://forums.thinkbroadband.com/fibre/t/4315028-bt-congestion-monitoring.html)
So much for "We cannot see any problems" :mad:
Quote from: Bill on Mar 19, 2014, 12:29:17
And for my exchange:
Link (http://forums.thinkbroadband.com/fibre/t/4315028-bt-congestion-monitoring.html)
So much for "We cannot see any problems" :mad:
Being totally dumb here, Bill. Who said they couldn't see any problems? On a side note I had at about 1:30pm today a dip to 40Mbps :sigh: A nice huge blob of red once again on the TBBQM's too, and looking at a Zen one they had no issue at all at that time. WTF is going on!!! :rant2:
BT. This entire problem may have partly Stemmed from BT not being honest/able to see their own network failures. There probably was some congestion (lack of bandwidth) on the side of IDNet, which they have both fixed and understandably have been on a wild goose chase, as BT have not played fair. So I'll give IDNet more of the benefit of the doubt as it's now come to light that other ISPs are getting similar problems and they are hopefully now all banding together to sort BT out with a big push. :)
QuoteA nice huge blob of red once again on the TBBQM's too, and looking at a Zen one they had no issue at all at that time.
If the new info that has come to light is true, then it's a randomish problem that means we will see the packet loss on one user, but not else where. Smaller ISPs might be more effected than larger ones, so finding the one customer on Zen who was also effected would be rather hard. Whatever the fault with BT is (the technical stuff is mentioned on the blog post over on ThinkBroardband), it is now apparent it's not just IDNet it's effecting, though it was effecting them more than others.
while I agree partly with you, the timing is classic IDNet, they have had this glitch at about this time for 6months now, so excuse me if I see a pattern rearing it's head as well as all the BT stuff which worries me greatly. :( Small ISP's don't seem the place to be anymore, and for FTTC they offer very little benefit over larger ISP's in all honesty, as long as you choose wisely of course as when things go wrong its a potential nightmare. Oh and that blob is way to familiar, it was on both TBBQM's on craigs, and IDNets dedicated one as well, and not on any others in the bigger leagues, so as if by magic I'm back to why to square one again wondering what I'm paying for. Sorry bad day and I'm sick of the jumble of excuses BT issues and general avoidance I have seen at times in the last six months over this. >:(
I think like Gary, I can see 5 IDNet TTBQMs all with this afternoon's blip and one non IDNet TTBQM without it. I agree it's not conclusive but it is consistent with the original issue. IDNet do not appear to have any congestion issues outside of normal working hours.
Quote from: Gary on Mar 19, 2014, 16:34:02
Being totally dumb here, Bill. Who said they couldn't see any problems?
As Ben said- BT.
In emails to/from support so I can't link to them.
I think may may have decided that admitting to them was easier than trying to fix the DNS server in their test domain so I could run the TAP3 tests they were insisting on... whatever, they still haven't fixed that either!
Quote from: Steve on Mar 19, 2014, 17:03:38
I think like Gary, I can see 5 IDNet TTBQMs all with this afternoon's blip and one non IDNet TTBQM without it. I agree it's not conclusive but it is consistent with the original issue. IDNet do not appear to have any congestion issues outside of normal working hours.
Thats the issue, Steve, as you said while not conclusive for myself this is way to familiar, but never appears at weekends, which makes me very suspicious and less likely to blame BT network issues for this event tbh as this was part of the original issue which I don't think can truly be passed off to BTW or BTOR.
Quote from: Gary on Mar 19, 2014, 17:06:22but never appears at weekends
Saturday:
(http://www.thinkbroadband.com/ping/share-thumb/593659a3b625d9e52a28e5a4c14250ee-15-03-2014.png) (http://www.thinkbroadband.com/ping/share/593659a3b625d9e52a28e5a4c14250ee-15-03-2014.html)
Sunday:
(http://www.thinkbroadband.com/ping/share-thumb/13ac90258e0bf6b6334ad0c2028d37d9-16-03-2014.png) (http://www.thinkbroadband.com/ping/share/13ac90258e0bf6b6334ad0c2028d37d9-16-03-2014.html)
Last weekend as it happens but it doesn't really matter- they're typical since Christmas.
Your graphs are congestion/packetloss though are they not Bill? I don't see any at weekends at the 1:30pm slot and none in the evening at any point, the TBBQM's I can see on other sites from IDNet don't show anything like your graphs either, so I think todays glitch is IDNets issue, sadly yours isn't. I see no issues outside iDnets working hours at all. :dunno:
Ah, OK... I hadn't kept up with the thread drift :P
I hope I'm not tempting fate by posting this, but by this time of day my BQMs (see sig) are normally looking a bit sad, but they're not... even a speedtest looks quite good:
(http://www.thinkbroadband.com/speedtest/button/139525262319657292397.png) (http://www.thinkbroadband.com/speedtest/results.html?id=139525262319657292397)
A touch of congestion maybe (the low single-thread result) but that's the best I've had in the evening for a long while!
Maybe one of the slight glitches earlier was me being fixed (so to speak :P )
Note to Zappa- hang in there buddy, there is yet hope!
Quote from: Gary on Mar 19, 2014, 16:34:02
Being totally dumb here, Bill. Who said they couldn't see any problems? On a side note I had at about 1:30pm today a dip to 40Mbps :sigh: A nice huge blob of red once again on the TBBQM's too, and looking at a Zen one they had no issue at all at that time. WTF is going on!!! :rant2:
Quote from: Technical Ben on Mar 19, 2014, 16:48:13
so finding the one customer on Zen who was also effected would be rather hard. Whatever the fault with BT is (the technical stuff is mentioned on the blog post over on ThinkBroardband), it is now apparent it's not just IDNet it's effecting, though it was effecting them more than others.
I don't know if Gary is talking about my TBBQM but if he is, remember I was a IDnet customer with the same issue, packet loss during the day... I migrated and the problem went away....... So a change of ISP fixed my problem, everything else is the same... This points the finger at IDnet still suffering from peak time (business hours) congestion some days.
I hope everything get fixed for you all soon though.
I kind of agree PSP, but for different reasons. It would seem it's been down to the way BT is managing ISPs. So as always, IDNet gets the short end of the stick. But as the poor management seems to stem from BTs integration fo the networks, it's creeping up on the other ISPs as well now.
For example, this is
not IDNet related, but is noticed by all now: http://www.thinkbroadband.com/news/6360-no-sign-yet-of-bt-wholesale-congestion-improving.html
Quote from: Gary on Mar 19, 2014, 17:06:22
Thats the issue, Steve, as you said while not conclusive for myself this is way to familiar, but never appears at weekends, which makes me very suspicious and less likely to blame BT network issues for this event tbh as this was part of the original issue which I don't think can truly be passed off to BTW or BTOR.
As far as I can tell, either starting with the ISP and it's own allocation of bandwidth, there seems to be a problem with BT not properly allocating or directing that traffic. So, a company like IDNet will be hit more often than others, as from what I can tell, they like to manually and finely manage their own network. A larger network/ISP or one that "buys in bulk, ships out" might be lesser effected, as random blips from the current bug with BT will show less. It's not necessarily that IDNet constantly have too little bandwidth, but that currently on the Exchange level, something at BT headquarters is not showing IDNet when and how they need to correct any problems for customers.
Especially as other companies have now reported a similar problem, hopefully enough of them going to BT and saying "No, our customers are still reporting problems, fix it" will get the job done. :thumb:
Quote from: Gary on Mar 19, 2014, 17:16:15
Your graphs are congestion/packetloss though are they not Bill? I don't see any at weekends at the 1:30pm slot and none in the evening at any point, the TBBQM's I can see on other sites from IDNet don't show anything like your graphs either, so I think todays glitch is IDNets issue, sadly yours isn't. I see no issues outside iDnets working hours at all. :dunno:
If it's exchange limited (which I think the technical details on TBB blog mention), then everyone will get slightly different results. As some of us IDNetters are on the same exchange (or virtual circuit etc), then we are getting "false positives" to the problem being with IDNet. Where as bigger companies would see lots of customers getting random (as on different exchanges/virtual circuits) packet losses, ours instead matches up. At least that's my theory so far. It's entirely assumption though.
I really hope it is solved, as we would not want it getting worse, and I'm sure people are working really hard to correct it (I've been in jobs where we all did the best we could in circumstances we had no control over).
Finally, there seem to be some strange "rules" from BT that don't quite filter down to users in the most apropriate way. Such as the new "3% packet loss is expectable" or "FTTC speeds for 90% of the time, but not during congestion". :/
it's not just iDNet that's for sure
(http://www.thinkbroadband.com/ping/share-thumb/5556383d2261a03f0a6b8cdbd8ba4ce5-19-03-2014.png)
BT speed test 13.11Mbps (80/20 service) attached
Is that FTTC from another ISP? I just read this on TBB forum:
QuoteThe Service Level Agreement (SLA) is that users should achieve the above throughputs for 90% of the busy 3 hour period.
Which means, it's "by design" that FTTC speeds fluctuate wildly? Wow. :dunno: :eyebrow:
Ben,
Yes it is. The packet loss occurs less frequently but is not absent altogether.
Quote from: joe on Mar 20, 2014, 08:26:09The packet loss occurs less frequently but is not absent altogether.
Up until yesterday I would have agreed with that- I've almost always had a scattering of red dots on the BQM throughout the day. Not enough to bother about.
It's early days yet, but since whatever was done yesterday to remove my evening horribleness there isn't a
trace of red, not a solitary pixel... so it can be done!
Quote from: Technical Ben on Mar 19, 2014, 20:14:03
Which means, it's "by design" that FTTC speeds fluctuate wildly? Wow. :dunno: :eyebrow:
I dont think you can say that, ADSL2+ can do the same, there has to be elasticity in any connection to allow for congestion, but its not designed to do it wildly, and up till the 'Mavericks' issue it didn't at IDNet. When packetloss knocks out ppp as it did yesterday it aint good. At least Bill is recovering.
Quote from: Bill on Mar 20, 2014, 08:42:33
Up until yesterday I would have agreed with that- I've almost always had a scattering of red dots on the BQM throughout the day. Not enough to bother about.
It's early days yet, but since whatever was done yesterday to remove my evening horribleness there isn't a trace of red, not a solitary pixel... so it can be done!
I've had similar experiences now. Some days perfect, others it's back. Which again makes me wonder if it's exchange congestion, or a bug in BTs management of Exchanges or the Virtual equivalent (which would mean it would only effect certain ISPs at a time, as each is on a different Virtual circuit though on the same Exchange)? Though again, it could be at the ISP level I suppose.
Quote from: Bill on Mar 19, 2014, 18:23:06
Note to Zappa- hang in there buddy, there is yet hope!
Well... ;D ...strange things have occurred which I think are worth documenting. Here are three fairly randomly chosen BQM snapshots from the last two months which are typical of what happens every day plus one from Tuesday (18th).
(http://www.thinkbroadband.com/ping/share-thumb/3e9b42de98205fa8012f69a7d6368214-10-02-2014.png) (http://www.thinkbroadband.com/ping/share/3e9b42de98205fa8012f69a7d6368214-10-02-2014.html)
(http://www.thinkbroadband.com/ping/share-thumb/26954cc45ad7505d66853ecc5caca2ff-12-02-2014.png) (http://www.thinkbroadband.com/ping/share/26954cc45ad7505d66853ecc5caca2ff-12-02-2014.html)
(http://www.thinkbroadband.com/ping/share-thumb/f5b6a21793b7e5a0e0eca3136b25db54-21-02-2014.png) (http://www.thinkbroadband.com/ping/share/f5b6a21793b7e5a0e0eca3136b25db54-21-02-2014.html)
(http://www.thinkbroadband.com/ping/share-thumb/f9c8039f4cc9d956eab8c80b1954251b-18-03-2014.png) (http://www.thinkbroadband.com/ping/share/f9c8039f4cc9d956eab8c80b1954251b-18-03-2014.html)
As you can see the pattern is predictable and very similar in nature to what Bill was seeing on his BQM. Two early afternoon engineer's visits failed to find a fault which was predictable because the problem is clearly peak time congestion. Then, as if by magic, suddenly a loss of sync occurred in the early hours of Wednesday morning!
(http://www.thinkbroadband.com/ping/share-thumb/1d8200a7f036950bf77a4790ddc17536-19-03-2014.png) (http://www.thinkbroadband.com/ping/share/1d8200a7f036950bf77a4790ddc17536-19-03-2014.html)
You don't need to be a rocket scientist to see the result. It's too early to be sure but it appears that whatever caused the loss of sync has fixed my problem. Perhaps an upgrade at my exchange? 2.00am would be about the right time for it. Somewhat unexpectedly I had a third, totally unannounced visit from an Engineer today. He replaced the entire BT box and supplied a new modem. To be honest I'm not sure what's going on, IDNet hadn't booked this engineer and it was only by chance that I was in when he called.
Anyway, long story short, my problems may be over but nobody really knows why. Does that sound familiar? It must be magic ;D
Quote from: zappaDPJ on Mar 20, 2014, 14:09:49
Anyway, long story short, my problems may be over but nobody really knows why. Does that sound familiar? It must be magic ;D
I suspect somebody in BT knows perfectly well why, but they're not saying :P
And "over-subscribed SVLAN" probably comes into it somewhere... interesting that you had a ~20 minute loss, that's what I've seen mentioned on tbb as the usual sort of time to sort an SVLAN out, but I didn't get one. Odd.
Glad you're back in business :thumb:
Whether IDNet have any problems of their own or not I can't say, but today's update at the end of this tbb news item (http://www.thinkbroadband.com/news/i/6360.html) is interesting.
To me, it looks as close to a mea culpa as you'll ever get from BTW.
Quote from: Bill on Mar 20, 2014, 22:27:53
Whether IDNet have any problems of their own or not I can't say, but today's update at the end of this tbb news item (http://www.thinkbroadband.com/news/i/6360.html) is interesting.
To me, it looks as close to a mea culpa as you'll ever get from BTW.
what as in a " we've made a balls up but wont say so "
Quote from: Baz on Mar 21, 2014, 07:39:56
what as in a " we've made a balls up but wont say so "
Got it in one :laugh:
I see IDNet had a little glitch yesterday at 4:30pm ish but not at 1:30pm this time... if the could rid themselves of that things would be spot on. :)
In the absence of the BT Wholesale network achieving a nivana state of perfection (and I wouldn't hold my breath on that one), it seems to me if Ofcom got their finger out and modified the regulatory Network Plan and PIA to allow alternative network operators access to the Cabs for competing services (at the moment that means Opal, presumably) there'd be competition which is the next best thing. But of course then there would be other things to complain about. :(
Oddly I've been getting bursts of packet loss since about 2 weeks ago. Before that my graphs were near perfect. The packet loss doesn't seem to coincide with me using the connection so I'm assuming it's not at my end. Seems to be on the 5% level with spikes to 20% and one at 50%.
Spikes greater than about 25% usually mean a brief disconnect, not necessarily long enough for the router to notice. Got a link to a relevant BQM?
It could be that you've been caught in the cross-fire as BT re-arrange their SVLANs (or whatever they've been doing), I noticed something similar around the time my drastic packet loss was cured.
Interesting to see that once again on the weekend IDNets 1:30pm ish and later afternoon packetloss are awol... :eyebrow:
I don't think there's enough evidence to blame that on IDNet... OK, it doesn't happen with other ISPs but it doesn't happen with all IDNet's customers either. Me, for one.
The jury's still out afaic.
Quote from: Bill on Mar 23, 2014, 08:57:25
I don't think there's enough evidence to blame that on IDNet... OK, it doesn't happen with other ISPs but it doesn't happen with all IDNet's customers either. Me, for one.
The jury's still out afaic.
It happens on IDNets own TBBQM I think that says a lot, Bill... also considering Simon mentioned a business user as possibly the cause, that gives the game away a bit..
The pattern I mentioned started about the time Mavericks was released, which it was initially blamed on. We have some good days I will grant you that but that very distinct pattern has been happening for over 6mths, and never at weekends, now once fair enough, twice maybe, but this is beyond a coincidence and is totally unique to IDNet and their dedicated TBBQM and the few others on craigs for instance. That's just my observation.
Well this is what I'm seeing on the problematic days. There aren't a lot of spikes, but they are big enough that they cause things actively streaming data (such as VOIP and games) to drop.
This is on the 19th (Wednesday):
(http://www.thinkbroadband.com/ping/share-thumb/c58799975c7cd4589f17b1f20178a5d3-19-03-2014.png) (http://www.thinkbroadband.com/ping/share/c58799975c7cd4589f17b1f20178a5d3-19-03-2014.html)
And the 21st (Friday) - note that after everyone was complaining about all their games and streams dropping I gave the router a kick at around midnight, hence the big red bit:
(http://www.thinkbroadband.com/ping/share-thumb/b8807c5f47dcbf2bb95e653f1d54a585-21-03-2014.png) (http://www.thinkbroadband.com/ping/share/b8807c5f47dcbf2bb95e653f1d54a585-21-03-2014.html)
Earlier in the month (8th, Saturday):
(http://www.thinkbroadband.com/ping/share-thumb/7e2927c028545038725f3efd53aa759d-08-03-2014.png) (http://www.thinkbroadband.com/ping/share/7e2927c028545038725f3efd53aa759d-08-03-2014.html)
And another one earlier in the month (5th, Wednesday):
(http://www.thinkbroadband.com/ping/share-thumb/bf2f436fe843efefbd6285633718ba3e-05-03-2014.png) (http://www.thinkbroadband.com/ping/share/bf2f436fe843efefbd6285633718ba3e-05-03-2014.html)
Anyone know if FTTC is better for this sort of thing? I don't care about getting any higher bandwidth connection than I already have (13Mbit) but I'm a bit picky about latency and loss.
Blimey Esh I wish I could get my latency like that, im on nearly 40 mark at the moment >:(
The latency did increase very slightly when I moved from ADSL to ADSL2 but I suspect that is just part of the technology. Buying newer, more expensive hardware did notably decrease latency and also gave much more stable latencies.
Ah well, it was nice while it lasted... ie from Wednesday all the way to Saturday, a whole 4 days :mad:
Yesterday:
(http://www.thinkbroadband.com/ping/share-thumb/08a5df3005061732aa037803e0d9b479-25-03-2014.png) (http://www.thinkbroadband.com/ping/share/08a5df3005061732aa037803e0d9b479-25-03-2014.html)
Support are aware (and, I suspect, not surprised)
On the plus side, my profile has gone back up to 64 point odd from the low of 52 a week or two back.
The packetloss last night is on quite a few TBBQM's from IDNet, including their own, it seems to be something even Zen get now, but maybe to a lesser degree possible due to their size. BT's graphs show some packetloss last night and a few plusnet ones look scary around the same time, not sure if there was an event of some kind. Sorry to see the congestion back, Bill. Have you got access to any other peoples TBBQM's in your area? Just be interesting to see how it effects each provider, as BT don't seem able bothered to monitor it themselves :shake:
Um, I wonder if for VDSL2 the remaining problems are mainly exchange and region-based. The last detectable packet loss on my TBQM here in the far east, was a brief isolated instance on the 19th at lunchtime; totally clear since and no latency spikes either. Speeds have declined but I suspect that's the DSLAM doing its thing rather than a network issue as it seems to have been adjusted with a lower error tolerance.
Quote from: Gary on Mar 26, 2014, 10:38:32Have you got access to any other peoples TBBQM's in your area? Just be interesting to see how it effects each provider, as BT don't seem able bothered to monitor it themselves :shake:
No, those who I know anything about all use dynamic IPs, so no BQM :(
My own suspicion is that someone moved users off my SVLAN, thus solving my problem, and a few days later someone else (trying to sort out a different SVLAN) spotted an uncongested one (mine) and moved a load of users on to it to solve
his problem :shake:
Left and right hands etc... or maybe Fred Karno's Army would be more appropriate.
Quote from: mervl on Mar 26, 2014, 10:52:44
peeds have declined but I suspect that's the DSLAM doing its thing rather than a network issue as it seems to have been adjusted with a lower error tolerance.
If speeds are declining and you have FTTC thats probably crosstalk as more users get plugged in. It appears Vectoring has started in Ireland, sadly in the UK only Huawei cabs can I think at this time be easily updated. The ECI need new line cards, very short sighted of BT using M41's not V41's as a cost cutting exercise on the ECI cabs . No real surprise though but I cant see BT replacing every line card in ECI cabs somehow.
Quote from: Bill on Mar 26, 2014, 10:54:14
No, those who I know anything about all use dynamic IPs, so no BQM :(
My own suspicion is that someone moved users off my SVLAN, thus solving my problem, and a few days later someone else (trying to sort out a different SVLAN) spotted an uncongested one (mine) and moved a load of users on to it to solve his problem :shake:
Left and right hands etc... or maybe Fred Karno's Army would be more appropriate.
Sounds about right, Bill. :( its does seem that when hot svlans get cleared it does not take long for them to get congested again.
Quote from: Gary on Mar 26, 2014, 10:38:32
The packetloss last night is on quite a few TBBQM's from IDNet, including their own, it seems to be something even Zen get now, but maybe to a lesser degree possible due to their size. BT's graphs show some packetloss last night and a few plusnet ones look scary around the same time, not sure if there was an event of some kind. Sorry to see the congestion back, Bill. Have you got access to any other peoples TBBQM's in your area? Just be interesting to see how it effects each provider, as BT don't seem able bothered to monitor it themselves :shake:
That is very interesting. If it's congestion, pushed towards the smaller ISPs, but effecting all, and "not there" as BT say, but effecting BTs own network... I might get some popcorn to watch what happens next.
What is likely to happen is that BTW will shuffle the SVLANs around a bit, announce that they have taken action to cure the technical problems (without claiming to have succeeded!) and that a packet loss of 5% is now considered to be within acceptable limits.
And I wish I were joking :(
Quote from: Bill on Mar 26, 2014, 08:44:32
Ah well, it was nice while it lasted... ie from Wednesday all the way to Saturday, a whole 4 days :mad:
Yesterday:
(http://www.thinkbroadband.com/ping/share-thumb/08a5df3005061732aa037803e0d9b479-25-03-2014.png) (http://www.thinkbroadband.com/ping/share/08a5df3005061732aa037803e0d9b479-25-03-2014.html)
Support are aware (and, I suspect, not surprised)
On the plus side, my profile has gone back up to 64 point odd from the low of 52 a week or two back.
That's really disappointing and quite worrying. I'm currently living in dread that the same thing will happen to my connection but seems ok so far. One slight oddity since my connection has been fixed, iPlayer buffers every 10 minutes or so but I think it must be their end as Netflix and the other streaming services I use are fine.
(http://www.thinkbroadband.com/ping/share-thumb/1f907de7b069b876009ef4b68a49ed39-26-03-2014.png) (http://www.thinkbroadband.com/ping/share/1f907de7b069b876009ef4b68a49ed39-26-03-2014.html)
I've seen a few other complaints about iPlayer recently, so I suspect the Beeb are having troubles. I seldom use it.
So far the congestion is nowhere near as bad as before, as you can see- only a little bit of red. But I'm crossing everything I've two of that can cross!
Anyone else notice a drop in IDNet yesterday at 2PM Packetloss shows 100% so not quite sure what happened. Its shown very clearly on IDNets dedicated TBBQM. Its also on a few other peoples BBM that I can see.
http://www.thinkbroadband.com/ping/share-thumb/3e9f40bbdf719aef79db49d8d5f4522c.png (http://www.thinkbroadband.com/ping/share-thumb/3e9f40bbdf719aef79db49d8d5f4522c.png)
Quote from: Gary on Mar 28, 2014, 09:41:51
Anyone else notice a drop in IDNet yesterday at 2PM
Announcement
We just experienced a brief routing interruption and are investigating the cause.
The problem was caused by a configuration error. This has now been rectified. We would like to apologise for the inconvenience.
Posted: 2014-03-27 14:03:47 Updated: 2014-03-27 14:36:41 (https://www.idnet.net/support/networkstatus.php)
Quote from: Bill on Mar 28, 2014, 09:49:32
Announcement
We just experienced a brief routing interruption and are investigating the cause.
The problem was caused by a configuration error. This has now been rectified. We would like to apologise for the inconvenience.
Posted: 2014-03-27 14:03:47 Updated: 2014-03-27 14:36:41 (https://www.idnet.net/support/networkstatus.php)
Cheers, Bill :thumb: I wondered why everything went pear shaped when I was downloading. I rarely check the status page as it does not always show incidents.
Quote from: Gary on Mar 28, 2014, 09:41:51
Anyone else notice a drop in IDNet yesterday at 2PM Packetloss shows 100% so not quite sure what happened. Its shown very clearly on IDNets dedicated TBBQM. Its also on a few other peoples BBM that I can see.
http://www.thinkbroadband.com/ping/share-thumb/3e9f40bbdf719aef79db49d8d5f4522c.png (http://www.thinkbroadband.com/ping/share-thumb/3e9f40bbdf719aef79db49d8d5f4522c.png)
Yes I did Gary.
IDNet does an RSS feed just for status incidents. That's how I knew.
Quote from: colirv on Mar 28, 2014, 11:16:02
IDNet does an RSS feed just for status incidents. That's how I knew.
I knew because I was relaxing in an armchair listening to a Radio 3 stream and it suddenly went quiet!
Couldn't get anything to work, so rang support who told me there'd been an outage, and to call again if still offline after half an hour or so.
Quote from: Bill on Mar 28, 2014, 12:22:44
I knew because I was relaxing in an armchair listening to a Radio 3 stream and it suddenly went quiet!
;D I just use FM. Better sound and never suffers with these problems.
Quote from: mervl on Mar 28, 2014, 19:57:39
;D I just use FM. Better sound and never suffers with these problems.
I'd prefer to, but FM reception here without an external aerial is rubbish and DAB is marginal... Radio 3 streams at 320Kbps so it's a lot better than you might expect compared to most.
(I stream it via iTunes where I can choose which stream I want, I find iPlayer has a habit of dropping back to the 48Kbps stream :( )
All my packet loss has gone away again. Temporary congestion or something perhaps?
Have to agree, things are flying along here and have been for a while, its great. ;D
My connection is as dreadful as ever. I had one decent week after my congestion issue was mysteriously fixed and then my connection dropped...
(http://www.thinkbroadband.com/ping/share-thumb/fac4a8ffc99faa0aecb7f83fa0d56f58-04-04-2014.png) (http://www.thinkbroadband.com/ping/share/fac4a8ffc99faa0aecb7f83fa0d56f58-04-04-2014.html)
That was around 10 days ago and it's been the same pattern of packet loss ever since...
(http://www.thinkbroadband.com/ping/share-thumb/bae39c248cb74d8777c0fd956ad4c511-13-04-2014.png) (http://www.thinkbroadband.com/ping/share/bae39c248cb74d8777c0fd956ad4c511-13-04-2014.html)
Quote from: zappaDPJ on Apr 13, 2014, 12:59:53
My connection is as dreadful as ever. I had one decent week after my congestion issue was mysteriously fixed and then my connection dropped...
(http://www.thinkbroadband.com/ping/share-thumb/fac4a8ffc99faa0aecb7f83fa0d56f58-04-04-2014.png) (http://www.thinkbroadband.com/ping/share/fac4a8ffc99faa0aecb7f83fa0d56f58-04-04-2014.html)
That was around 10 days ago and it's been the same pattern of packet loss ever since...
(http://www.thinkbroadband.com/ping/share-thumb/bae39c248cb74d8777c0fd956ad4c511-13-04-2014.png) (http://www.thinkbroadband.com/ping/share/bae39c248cb74d8777c0fd956ad4c511-13-04-2014.html)
That is awful, Zap. What have support said? Has to be local again though I would have thought :( Could it be your router attributing to it? That packetloss is constant
To be honest I've given up on it so I haven't contacted support and probably won't bother. I rent an office and go there if I need to use the Internet for anything important. I only use this connection for streaming now and although I get the occasion buffering it seems to work most of time.
Hmmm. My line is whisper quiet again (but with occasional small blips).
The only reason to get FFTC here would be for stream uploading. Packet loss would be a bit of a problem though. I'll have to think twice about it. :(
Quote from: Technical Ben on Apr 13, 2014, 23:08:58
Hmmm. My line is whisper quiet again (but with occasional small blips).
The only reason to get FFTC here would be for stream uploading. Packet loss would be a bit of a problem though. I'll have to think twice about it. :(
Most people don't get packetloss at all, its only a few exchanges and maybe lines and possibly router issues. Mines fine now and has been for a while, the benefits out way any small chance of issues tbh. Its more stable than ADSL as well as far as DLM. I would never go back. Upstream has never been an issue either.
My speed at the mo. is down from 75 to 7.
Red curtain has descended.
Now, what's the b....y excuse!!!!!!!!!
(http://www.thinkbroadband.com/ping/share-thumb/69dbb3a60f72bec13bf8533a36927a34-14-04-2014.png) (http://www.thinkbroadband.com/ping/share/69dbb3a60f72bec13bf8533a36927a34-14-04-2014.html)
Speed down to 16Mbps here, guess I spoke to soon :( Spoke to support who have no idea, they show under 50% utilisation on the network so god knows I'll go look at Zens fault page and AAISP's
Edit: Just checked a Zen one and it shows the same packetloss and a dropout too, so its not IDNet its external. BT playing up again it seems
Slight improvement on speed at the mo.
(http://www.speedtest.net/result/3438294665.png) (http://www.speedtest.net/my-result/3438294665)
It's not all IDNet lines that are affected today: 2 out of the 3 I monitor have the red curtain. All different exchanges.
On the 2 other lines I monitor (BT Business and PlusNet) no sign of anything.
The IDNet line here has it, but not the non-IDNet connection. I note that A&A say "BT are actually providing more data now that shows where each circuit will use network components within their network" which is helping them correlate with congestion reports to try and "point BT in the right direction". Are IDNet doing the same, I hope? :eyebrow:
Quote from: sobranie on Apr 14, 2014, 13:38:48
My speed at the mo. is down from 75 to 7.
Red curtain has descended.
Now, what's the b....y excuse!!!!!!!!!
mine down too and same red curtain at the same time.....I havent had it this bad before.
Quote from: Gary on Apr 14, 2014, 13:43:18
Edit: Just checked a Zen one and it shows the same packetloss and a dropout too, so its not IDNet its external. BT playing up again it seems
Strangely I was chatting with another ISP support over the weekend and they told me they havent had any notification from customers about packet loss issue on their service, so no we've had no bother...were his words.......Hmmmm makes me wonder now whether to go to a new provider or not, are they all the same and dont let on :dunno:
Quote from: Baz on Apr 14, 2014, 15:14:51
mine down too and same red curtain at the same time.....I havent had it this bad before.
Strangely I was chatting with another ISP support over the weekend and they told me they havent had any notification from customers about packet loss issue on their service, so no we've had no bother...were his words.......Hmmmm makes me wonder now whether to go to a new provider or not, are they all the same and dont let on :dunno:
A salesman will tell you just what you want to hear, until they have got you...always research and never just go with the blurb. As I said Zen were showing the same packet loss today, so god knows what it is but its not IDNets fault.
Quote from: Gary on Apr 14, 2014, 13:43:18
Speed down to 16Mbps here, guess I spoke to soon :( Spoke to support who have no idea, they show under 50% utilisation on the network so god knows I'll go look at Zens fault page and AAISP's
Edit: Just checked a Zen one and it shows the same packetloss and a dropout too, so its not IDNet its external. BT playing up again it seems
My BQM by any chance ?
If it is, then yeah I'm getting the same problem since 9am and the drop was me turning the modem off to do something ;D
(http://www.thinkbroadband.com/ping/share-thumb/e497db81cbab9153901db5e42db98756-14-04-2014.png) (http://www.thinkbroadband.com/ping/share/e497db81cbab9153901db5e42db98756-14-04-2014.html)
Perhaps it's people downloading Game of Thrones? :whistle:
Quote from: psp83 on Apr 14, 2014, 15:24:10
My BQM by any chance ?
If it is, then yeah I'm getting the same problem since 9am and the drop was me turning the modem off to do something ;D
(http://www.thinkbroadband.com/ping/share-thumb/e497db81cbab9153901db5e42db98756-14-04-2014.png) (http://www.thinkbroadband.com/ping/share/e497db81cbab9153901db5e42db98756-14-04-2014.html)
It was indeed ;D sh*t happens to all networks sometimes I'm sure it will be fine later (famous last words) ;)
Quote from: Simon on Apr 14, 2014, 15:26:50
Perhaps it's people downloading Game of Thrones? :whistle:
;D
Quote from: Gary on Apr 14, 2014, 15:26:57
It was indeed ;D sh*t happens to all networks sometimes I'm sure it will be fine later (famous last words) ;)
It has to be a BT fault somewhere to cause issues to more than 1 ISP.
Zen has already checked my connection, did a line check and everything came back fine.
I've also allowed them to setup their own monitoring system / graph on my IP so they can trace anything..
Back to dodginess again. Might have to get this looked at. It's bloody annoying.
Quote from: esh on Apr 17, 2014, 22:55:40
Back to dodginess again. Might have to get this looked at. It's bloody annoying.
Nothing showing up here all the TBB meters look good too :-\