Warning about switching to ADSL2+ part 1

rireed3 · May 22, 2009, 17:31:20

i all,

This is from my mobile as 21cn has cut off my broadband.

If I repeat old news it's from lack of access. BT has used strange equipment for 21cn in a minority of exchanges that scuppers authentication for many or most routers or modems.

Rik · May 22, 2009, 17:34:53

I've heard about that, Draytek and Zyxel seem to be particularly badly affected, but not at all exchanges - it seems to come down to who made the MSAN you are connected to. So far, Netgear is the 'safe' router.

rireed3 · May 22, 2009, 17:45:38

PART 2

My three Speedtouches and, on 585v6, three versions of firmware including UK-friendly 822 from October failed. I even fried 585 attempting a downgrade, after which Speedtouch support tried to cheat me out of premium support charges.

rireed3 · May 22, 2009, 17:51:15

PART 3

It appears that BT has ordered makers to upgrade but makers have responded unevenly.

Support has found that Netgear is reliable on the unlucky exchanges. They have also heard that Belkin, 3COM and a beta Draytek firmware will do.

Rik · May 22, 2009, 17:53:30

I've got a Netgear in the cupboard, luckily. What a crazy situation for BT to have allowed.

rireed3 · May 22, 2009, 18:11:17

Yes, if the Netgear works for me, i'll return all the Speedtouch with a nastygram. BT Won't listen to me or Idnet.

Most exchanges won't have a problem, and this is new and changing information. Idnet responded very quickly to send a Netgear.

Rik · May 22, 2009, 18:13:43

It shouldn't ever have been allowed to develop to the point where end users were being denied connection because particular MSANs didn't like a router which was the right spec for ADSL2+. That said, I can remember having issues with my Draytek when Max was first introduced, and ending up moving to a Netgear to overcome it. It seems that history is not BT's strong point.

Sebby · May 22, 2009, 19:37:07

But at least Drayteks worked, Rik, albeit with a poor sync.

gizmo71 · May 22, 2009, 21:11:13

Quote from: Rik on May 22, 2009, 18:13:43
It seems that history is not BT's strong point.

The only lesson we learn from history is that people don't learn lessons from history.

Rik · May 23, 2009, 10:04:08

Quote from: Sebby on May 22, 2009, 19:37:07
But at least Drayteks worked, Rik, albeit with a poor sync.

True, Seb.

Rik · May 23, 2009, 10:04:28

Quote from: gizmo71 on May 22, 2009, 21:11:13
The only lesson we learn from history is that people don't learn lessons from history.

Very profound.

rireed3 · May 23, 2009, 12:56:33

Hi all,

I'm back online, thanks to a Special Delivery Netgear from Simon and friends.

As far as I'm concerned Speedtouch is out on some fair fraction of 21CN exchanges.
To be completely fair, my Speedtouch 585v6 firmware was at the old DMT-friendly 6.1.4.3 when I began. Synced at 18M, but login didn't work no Internet. I had on my machine 6.1.9, but that only got ADSL2 at 10M, but it did log in. I used this to download 8.2.2-en, which Whirlpool forum had blessed for UK. Same result as 6.1.4.3, but with a new user interface. I tried to downgrade to 6.1.9 again so I could try the last distribution on Thomson UK, called 6-2-T-2, but the 'upgrade wizard' ended up frying my 585v6. No ethernet, couldn't authenticate wireless, router is now a brick.

Thomson 'support' premium phone line let me talk for a minute or two before telling me no technician was available, and that I had already been charged at 50p per minute.

My 546 did the same as the two failed versions of 585 firmware.

I want no further dealings with Thomson. I think Reuters bought them, but the router/modem business might be separate. My point here is make sure you don't have any shares.

Yes BT is to blame, but Thomson takes the attitude that they need do nothing while the paying punter must suffer the consequences and pay more to fix them.

Richard

Rik · May 23, 2009, 12:59:22

That's not good, Richard, thanks for the warning. At least IDNet were able to do something to help.

Sebby · May 23, 2009, 13:54:00

Richard, did you try a hard factory reset by holding the button at the rear of the router for 10 seconds? That's always recovered them in the past for me.

rireed3 · May 26, 2009, 14:20:46

Thanks Sebby,

I had to leave on Saturday, but have been working more on this today (Tuesday).

I first tried the power-on version of the reset button, but gave up on Friday. Today I used the reset button with the router still running, and that got me back into ethernet. More firmware versions didn't help:

Speedtouch 585v6 does not work on the (rumoured) HuaWei MSAN's with the following firmwares:
6.1.4.3
6.1.9.6 (worked once on Friday at 10M on my 19M line)
6.2.29.2
8.2.2.5 (European Thomson site, English version, previous good reports for ADSL 8M)
I can't speak for 585v7.

The DG834g that support sent me is 'v5', so is not the Broadcom chipset, and may be tougher to monitor, but it's very solid on my short line, reliably giving me 19M syncs at 6db noise margin. I found the 'adsl' command in the Conexant chipset and it looks like I'm getting 200-300 error seconds an hour.

Waiting now for my profile to go back up after Speedtouch trashed it to 2M trying the firmwares.

Thanks all for the help,
Richard

Rik · May 26, 2009, 14:32:00

Don't you just love profiles.

VaderDSL · May 26, 2009, 17:59:57

When I get upgraded I'll let you know how my Draytek Vigor 100 ethernet adsl2/2+ modemworks. It has the BETA firmware that was used for PPPOA with Be* and hopefully it will work fine, but I'll report back

sebt · May 26, 2009, 20:06:36

About to take the plunge with my Vigor 2820n. It's a new model so I'm hoping to see no problems. Anyone else have experience with this Draytek?

sebt

Sebby · May 26, 2009, 21:48:56

Good luck, let us know how you go. It's probably wise to update to the latest firmware, if you haven't already.

Dangerjunkie · May 28, 2009, 02:18:46

Hi guys,

Sorry for my prolonged absence due to family circumstances.

Sebt, I called IDNet support today to ask about 21CN as I got the email and my exchange is shown as enabled since March. I have a DrayTek 110 (starting separate thread) and support told me to be careful as the 2820 was a unit known to have problems on 21CN ADSL 2+.

I believe there may be a (beta?) firmware version for the 2820 that does work. I would make enquiries before taking the plunge.

Cheers,
Paul.

Rik · May 28, 2009, 09:11:43

Everything OK now, Paul?

DAB Badboy · May 28, 2009, 09:54:54

Can't wait until the end of March to find out what my Billion BiPAC 7300 is/isn't capable of.

It's supposed to be capable of ADSL2+ (copes well with 8meg - but now I'm wondering) ...

Rik · May 28, 2009, 09:56:52

We all are.

The forum is going to be busy in the coming weeks, gathering information about what works and what doesn't.

rireed3 · May 29, 2009, 16:31:48

Quote from: Rik on May 26, 2009, 14:32:00
Don't you just love profiles.

I found out why I got dinged back to 2M while I was trying a couple of the ST585v6 firmwares on Tuesday.

This was quoted on Kitz (Re: ADSL24 now offering LLU on: May 13, 2009)

Quote
Evening,

We have been advised, via 3 different sources, that there is a known BT 21CN WBC platform issue that is locking lines by mistake to a 2Mbps profile. This appears to only happen where the exchange MSAN equipment being used is Huawei based.

BT have a national trouble ticket open at the moment to resolve this problem, which is causing problems for thousands of lines, not just those at Entanet.

Martin Pitt
Company Founder

Aquiss Internet

So this is a second Huawei MSAN router compatibility problem with ST585v6 and probably others. I didn't have the 2M problem last Friday, only the duff authentication problem. On Tuesday I had both, but thought the connection speed problem was because I had done too many 'dodgy upgrade wizard' attempts.

Richard

Rik · May 29, 2009, 16:40:25

Thanks for the update, Richard. BT really don't have their act together, do they.