The UK Landline Switch Off - What You Need To Know

[Simon]

Following on from the other thread, this seems to offer a little more clarity:

https://everythingconnected.idnet.net/2022/09/27/the-uk-land-line-switch-off-what-you-need-to-know

Please continue discussions here. 

[stan]

Received the email from IDNet today ... thanks for starting this new thread, Simon.

[peasblossom]

(Ha. Beaten to it.  Also got the email today.) It does come across as a touch optimistic (See previous thread.) The bit about new landline phones is interesting though.

[Postal]

As ever from the supplier side of the house it vastly underplays the concern in many rural parts of the UK about complete loss of service when there is a power cut.  We have 3 or 4 outages a year which on average last 10 to 12 hours.  We do not have a mobile signal but even if we did, the anecdotal evidence is that masts in rural locations do not have adequate power back up for that length of outage and go off-line as well leaving people with absolutely no method of contacting emergency services.  OfCOM and the suppliers are currently only mandating a back-up service lasting an hour for vulnerable customers which is clearly totally inadequate for people in our situation.

I see the article is showing "No comments found" at the bottom.  I can't see a way to make a comment - can anyone point me in the right direction, please?

[Terryphi]

Quote from article "Our recommendation at the moment (until 2024) for single line users would be to not panic about the switch off and move to a VoIP solution once FTTP/H is available in your area."

The article implies that the switch to VOIP depends on the installation of FTTP. Is this true? If so it will take a long time to cover rural areas.

[Simon]

As ever from the supplier side of the house it vastly underplays the concern in many rural parts of the UK about complete loss of service when there is a power cut.  We have 3 or 4 outages a year which on average last 10 to 12 hours.  We do not have a mobile signal but even if we did, the anecdotal evidence is that masts in rural locations do not have adequate power back up for that length of outage and go off-line as well leaving people with absolutely no method of contacting emergency services.  OfCOM and the suppliers are currently only mandating a back-up service lasting an hour for vulnerable customers which is clearly totally inadequate for people in our situation.

I guess if we have the ominously predicted blackouts this winter, that may bring some of these situations into stark focus.

I see the article is showing "No comments found" at the bottom.  I can't see a way to make a comment - can anyone point me in the right direction, please?

As far as I can see you can't comment on a Newsletter.  Maybe visit their Facebook page?

[nowster]

I'm wondering if it would be possible to have IDNet VoIP without the DECT phone. I'd at least be able to provide a couple of hours of UPS cover for a simple ATA box, which would then plumb in to the existing extension wiring. (Just disconnect the incoming phone line pair at the master socket and use an old modem cable to plug into any extension socket. The master socket's existing ring capacitor would then feed the ring shunt wire.)

Failing that it would mean porting the number to SIPGate or similar.

[Postal]

Maybe visit their Facebook page?

I take no willing part in the empire of that entitled, amoral, selfish and greedy Satan.

[john7]

Quote from article "Our recommendation at the moment (until 2024) for single line users would be to not panic about the switch off and move to a VoIP solution once FTTP/H is available in your area."

The article implies that the switch to VOIP depends on the installation of FTTP. Is this true? If so it will take a long time to cover rural areas.

This I regret is untrue many rural areas have already been forced onto fibre and suffered in last year's bid storm, the Ceiriog Valley near to us is one of them. Lost power for days and regularly do so and NO mobile signal in much of it. We have a friend who in in the process of moving as a result as in an emergency they are totally isolated from contacting help with the fibre setup.

[DarkStar]

One thing that that could cause problems. Looking at IDNets new VOIP packages I notice that they are subject to a 24 month contract. What happens if my broadband package is a 1 month contract and I want to move to another provider? Could be complicated.
I am one of the unfortunate souls that keep getting switched to a Zen  gateway and have to reboot the router to get a reasonable connection. (IDNet say there is nothing they can do about it). Last week Open Reach were putting in FFTP cable in the village and I have one of the connection boxes on the pole outside my house. Being medically highly vulnerable I am wary of only having a mobile but I certainly don't want to be tied in to a 24 month contract.

[Terryphi]

This I regret is untrue many rural areas have already been forced onto fibre and suffered in last year's bid storm, the Ceiriog Valley near to us is one of them. Lost power for days and regularly do so and NO mobile signal in much of it. We have a friend who in in the process of moving as a result as in an emergency they are totally isolated from contacting help with the fibre setup.

Thanks john7 for your reply to my question.

[Postal]

Quote from article "Our recommendation at the moment (until 2024) for single line users would be to not panic about the switch off and move to a VoIP solution once FTTP/H is available in your area."

The article implies that the switch to VOIP depends on the installation of FTTP. Is this true? If so it will take a long time to cover rural areas.

I don't think that is true.  VOIP runs over any internet connection so you can be forced onto VOIP even if you are still on an FTTC line.  There are financial benefits to BT if they push FTTC users onto VOIP as they can then look to cease maintenance on all of the switching apparatus in the exchanges and even perhaps sell off the exchange properties.  It is expected that people who do not currently have an internet connection will be given a modem with a telephone socket and the line will be capped at something like 0.5MBPs so that it will handle voice but no meaningful internet connection.  By the end of 2025 the PSTN (Public Switched Telephone Network) will be turned off and everybody wanting a landline telephone service will be forced to use VOIP whether they are on FTTP or FTTC.

[Simon]

I don't think that is true.  VOIP runs over any internet connection...

So, in theory, could VoIP run on a tethered 4G / 5G internet connection from a mobile?  Just thinking if that might be an alternative, but then again, I guess it wouldn't be much use if you have no power as your VoIP phones wouldn't work anyway. 

[Postal]

So, in theory, could VoIP run on a tethered 4G / 5G internet connection from a mobile?  Just thinking if that might be an alternative, but then again, I guess it wouldn't be much use if you have no power as your VoIP phones wouldn't work anyway.

So if you've got a mobile signal strong enough to support a tethered connection, why bother with the tethering - why not just use the mobile to make the call?

[Simon]

Indeed.  Stupid question. 

[peasblossom]

I take no willing part in the empire of that entitled, amoral, selfish and greedy Satan.

No, don't hold back on our account please!

[Simon]

I do have a FB account but I use it for information only, and hardly ever for 'social' purposes.  It does tend to get you noticed when you post a complaint on a company Facebook or Twitter page!

[stan]

Simon, regarding a facebook account   .....  I don't have one, mainly coz I don't want to display my name on t'internet - however, a bit like yourself, I would occasionally like to be able to contact organizations or companies for whatever reason (i suppose mainly to complain about something when all else has failed).

But how do you (or, indeed, can you) have a facebook account but remain anonymous? When I post the question online it always says you cant have an anonymous account but, surely, you must be able to have an account but stay nameless to the general public?

[stan]

Incidentally (in connection with phones/VOIP etc rather than Facebook)  ...  I've mentioned elsewhere that, after 14 years with IDNet, I've been thinking about moving to another ISP and getting FTTP, which is now available in my area (I think I mentioned who it was but probably shouldn't mention it again) ... and regarding the landline phone aspect I would be able (with the new people) to pay an additional £1.20 on top of the £37 (for FTTP at 115mb) and have the use of my existing "landline" along with the same landline number that I have now and thereafter either pay for any calls I make at xx pence per minute OR make no calls, just use it for incoming and use my mobile for outgoing calls. To that end I've just changed from o2 PAYG to o2 Pay Monthly and now have unlimited calls and texts and 4GB of data for £6 a month so that covers my needs very comfortably. 

If I didn't want to use my mobile for calls and chose to use the new provider's line for both incoming and outgoing calls I am informed that I could use the router (a Technicolour) which they provide and could plug in my existing "old type" cordless DECT GAP compatible phone into the router (it has a built in ATA (an adaptor) and apparently it would/should work - and, of course I can use the 4 or 5 additional handsets trhat I currently have working off the one main base station (the bit that's plugged into the new router).

Obviously, instead of using my own, old cordless phones I could have a new VOIP DECT phone (cordless or not) which apparently offers all manner of facilities but which (a) costs quite a lot if you have 4 or 5 new extension handsets working from it ... and (b) needs to configured and also requires the user to go on a week's course at a local college in order to learn how to use all the aforementioned fancy facilities.

I might be repeating myself here and may have said much of the above before but now that IDNet have issued the guidance that we're all receiving it seemed vaguely pertinent to put it here. 

[nowster]

So, in theory, could VoIP run on a tethered 4G / 5G internet connection from a mobile?  Just thinking if that might be an alternative, but then again, I guess it wouldn't be much use if you have no power as your VoIP phones wouldn't work anyway. 

Apart from the obvious, the Carrier Grade NAT used by the mobile providers makes VoIP difficult, especially for incoming calls using SIP.

[nowster]

To that end I've just changed from o2 PAYG to o2 Pay Monthly and now have unlimited calls and texts and 4GB of data for £6 a month so that covers my needs very comfortably. 

You'd probably be just as well served by one of the "bargain brand" virtual providers run by the mobile phone companies themselves. For example, O2 has Giffgaff and Three has Smarty.

Giffgaff would probably cost more than your deal with O2, though. Smarty is exactly the same as what you got.

[stan]

You'd probably be just as well served by one of the "bargain brand" virtual providers run by the mobile phone companies themselves. For example, O2 has Giffgaff and Three has Smarty.

Giffgaff would probably cost more than your deal with O2, though. Smarty is exactly the same as what you got.

All received and thanks for those thoughts - but I'm duty bound to wonder if there would have been anything gained with either GiffGaff or Smarty.

I say that only because I did look at the alternatives but if one is dearer - and the other is much the same then I didn't see a particular drawback in using o2 (remembering I was already with o2 on PAYG and additionally I have a local o2 shop where I can go for face to face assistance if needed (and I buy my phones there and they painlessly swap the details over from the old to the new). I have to say despite the dreadful Trustpilot reviews I've been very pleased with the swap from o2 PAYG to o2 Pay Monthly SIM  ONLY - the three advisors I've spoken to during the transition have been excellent and the SIM arrived promptly and the online experience has been faultless ...
Having said all that I've never used GiffGaff so it could be the best thing since sliced bread - but - I have used Three (when their call centre was in Mumbai) and found their customer service advisors to be helpful (when they answered the phone) BUT very difficult to have a conversation with due to difficulty having free flowing conversations. Yes o2 have a call centre in South Africa but the conversation I had there was much easier than any I've had with Three. Maybe Three have improved on that?

[Simon]

We're slightly straying off course here but I've just moved from O2 to a SIM only Pay Monthly contract with Sky Mobile.  I'm paying them £7 per month for unlimited calls and texts, plus 3GB data, the same as I was paying O2 nearly £16 per month for.  The reason I switched was O2's appalling customer service.  I realise that I am still technically on O2, as Sky piggyback on their network, but at least I'm only paying half the price I was paying before.

With regards Facebook, Stan, there are lots of privacy settings where you can lock your profile down so that only people that you want to see you can see you.  That said, I'm sure people don't always use their full real names.  I don't have any personal details in my profile, and as far as I can recall, the only validation they require on registration is an email address, but it's been a while since I joined, so that may have changed.

[robinc]

Quote from article "Our recommendation at the moment (until 2024) for single line users would be to not panic about the switch off and move to a VoIP solution once FTTP/H is available in your area."

Ha! bloody Ha!
FTTP in our area - probably never at the current rate.
All this is total bollox when the simple fact is that when you're without power IT WON'T WORK! 
The PSTN system is just exactly what you'd provide as a failover/backup if you were designing the thing from scratch - instead you've just got one massive single point of failure.
If someone can come up with the spec of a UPS that will keep a broadband line running for 12 hours then that would be a far more useful avenue to explore (IMVHO)

[Postal]

Ha! bloody Ha!
FTTP in our area - probably never at the current rate.
All this is total bollox when the simple fact is that when you're without power IT WON'T WORK! 
The PSTN system is just exactly what you'd provide as a failover/backup if you were designing the thing from scratch - instead you've just got one massive single point of failure.
If someone can come up with the spec of a UPS that will keep a broadband line running for 12 hours then that would be a far more useful avenue to explore (IMVHO)

+1